Mass Graves claimed to be found at Treblinka

[gatedancer]

In fact, if that study pretends to be of some relevance, and it is WHAT is actually in the holes which matters more than to learn that some holes were made sometime as we already know.

It's not just what's in them that matters, but how big they are. The holes she found - apparently the same ones the Poles found or created in 1945 - are only big enough in volume to have held a fraction of the 700,000+ bodies that are alleged to have been buried there.

She didn't prove or disprove that there are bodies in the relatively small ground disturbances she found. But she did prove, based on their size, that it is impossible for there to have been 700,000+ bodies buried and exhumed in/from them. The standard history, as maintained by Yitzhak Arad, Hilberg, etc., of 700,000+ burials/exhumations is false, regardless of what is in the holes - even if they are, or were, filled to their maximum capacity with bodies.

In other words; Size matters.

[Kingfisher]

Some years ago, Richard Krege proved with ground penetrating radar that there is only undisturbed soil on the site.
Who disturbed the soil since then?

Santiago Alvarez has this to say on the subject:

Astonishingly, Krege claims to have found no ground disturbances at all on the territory of the former Treblinka camp, although quite a few trenches were dug in this area during a forensic investigation conducted by the Polish authorities right after the war. So if Krege’s method had been sound, he should have at least found those disturbances. In addition, those Polish investigators did indeed find traces of mass graves, although the size of their find did not match the gargantuan claims made about Treblinka.

That these claims are technically impossible and unsupported by the available physical eviedence, has been conclusively proven by Carlo Mattogno and Jürgen Graf in their thoroughly researched book on Treblinka (see the cover image at the right). This book also contains a partial translation of the report prepared by the above-mentioned Polish investigators about their 1945 excavations (pp. 83-89).

All things considered, it cannot surprise that Krege’s ground-penetrating research might not have been all that penetrating after all and that he has therefore been attacked by the orthodoxy.

http://barnesreview.org/wp/archives/243

[Kingfisher]

Krege's preliminary report has only been made available in German and French, from which I conclude it was probably written by Rudolf. The following is my translation of the French version:

Archaeological Survey of the Treblinka extermination camp

By engineer Richard Krege

The number of alleged victims of the p Auschwitz-Birkenau concentration cam has already been reduced considerably in recent years. The lowest figure advanced by a historian today is 650,000. However the figure of 875,000, given for the Treblinka camp, has been relatively stable for several years. The central role of Auschwitz as an extermination camp, the role occupied for decades, becomes less obvious. It therefore becomes increasingly urgent to submit the site of the Treblinka camp to a detailed and scientific analysis. The following contribution is an outline summary of a more detailed study currently being prepared and which will be published later. It is based on a radar analysis method that allows the composition of the soilto be studied to a depth of 30 meters without it being necessary to move the soil. Using this method we can detect objects lying below the surface and even study the composition of geological strata. Archaeologists have dreamed for centuries of having such a possibility, but we can say that for some Holocaust historians this may turn into a nightmare.

Brief description of Treblinka

About 60 km north of Warsaw is a memorial commemorating the victims of this camp, 875,000 Polish Jews mainly from Warsaw and Lublin who were brought here from July 23, 1942 onwards and allegedly murdered on the spot. From what is said, for 13 months packed trains brought people to the camp.

Just after the war, eyewitnesses claimed that these people had been killed by steam jets [1] but this story was suddenly corrected by these eyewitnesses shortly after. The new story was that up to 6,000 people were killed daily in gas chambers with diesel exhaust within 10 to 25 minutes. [2]

The diesel engine was supposed to come from a Russian submarine - or a tank - (the evidence is not entirely consistent on this subject) [3]

In 1988, 97 children were trapped in a 400-meter tunnel following a train accident in Washington state. They were subjected to the fumes of two diesel engines which continued to run as rescuers outside tried to clear the exits. They all came out unscathed. [4] This element is already in conflict with the history given for Treblinka. In 1985 the engineer Friedrich Paul Berg had already produced a detailed study of the toxic fumes of diesel engines and their harmlessness for gassings of short exposure (a few hours or less). [5] He emphasizes that Germany had available far more appropriate such as gasoline engines and all the expertise necessary to develop a less absurd and more efficient process. [6]

Memorial on the site of the former Treblinka II.
Photo: © Richard Krege

But that is not all. It was mentioned with great fanfare that 875.000 bodies were buried near the gas chambers, then dug up and burned in order to remove traces. It is obvious that such an operation would have left visible traces in the soil and a study can be done with the dimensions given for these mass graves. The graduate engineer Arnulf Neumaier in 1994 already showed a pit containing 875,000 would have to measure 100,000 m2. [7]

Heinrich Himmler is said to have issued the order to dig up the bodies because of the advance of Russian troops.

875,000 bodies are therefore said to have been exhumed from the spring of 1943 over a period of 5 months and cremated on huge grills. As the camp had no crematoria, teams of workers are alleged to have cut wood in the surrounding forests.

After comparing with the available sources for open cremation in India and the fuel that is normally required Arnulf Neumaier engaged in some calculations concerning the logistics of such an operation: [8]

Grids, rails, the bunker, the streets and the station, size: 10,800 m², with a team of 6,000 workers assigned to the grill, especially for crushing bones, including the organization, administration, etc., 50 million liters of oil (a train15 km long) or alternatively 195 million kg of dry firewood in 185 trains of 55 cars or alternatively 351 million kg of freshly cut wood (515,000 trees, 6.4 square miles of forest), slaughtered, packed and sawn 3450 with saws, transported daily by 42 x 15- ton trucks, resulting in 4,0000,000 kg ash (wood ash and human ashes)

After the 875,000 after the bodies were disposed of, and before the Russians arrived, the SS are said to have removed the installations, i.e. barracks, concrete foundations, sewerage and water supply plumbing, rubbish, glass residue, barbed wire, rails, the bunker, the streets and the railway station, in short everything we might find.

Impressed by the superhuman feat of the SS in disposing of all traces of the bodies, a small group of Australians arrived at Treblinka in October 1999. They used a GPR device (ground penetrating radar), a Boden radar detector and another device with a vacuum tube to probe the soil to a depth of 6 meters.

GPR is used by geologists, archaeologists, construction engineers, oil companies and police forces. It has been used for example during archaeological excavations around the pyramids in Egypt as well as in Australia and the United States to find the ancient tombs of the first inhabitants.

The device can find, depending on altitude, variations up to 30 meters underground. The Australians adjusted their device to probe to a depth of 6 meters so that it could detect even a kitchen knife. They were interested in finding traces of these gigantic graves.

The device sends a signal vertically through the soil and an image appears on the screen. These images can then be stored on the hard disk. Normally undisturbed soil is represented by near-horizontal and uninterrupted layers. These layers are called "horizons". Deviations from this horizontal stratification can be caused by rocks, stumps, streams of water. A spade handle for example gives a sudden vertical interruption and the height of the handle can be measured.

One of the many images received by the Australians over the former graves of Treblinka is given here. The Australians have also probed the ground of other sections of the camp where normally it has not been disturbed. It was indeed necessary to acquire images of normal strata which could have expected in this region. Everywhere the horizons are virtually uniform and uninterrupted. This picture shows a survey done across 12 meters to a depth of 6 meters.

Using the official plans of mass graves, the Australians worked for 3 weeks. They studied the soil above the mass graves from east to west and from north to south and between the stones and monuments erected after the war. In addition the AUGER Bohren unit was used at regular intervals to take soil samples. To be more certain the team members also repeated the process far beyond the limits of these pits.

Samples of trees were also taken nearby to determine their age.

Results

Found:

Almost all of the soil (soil, sand and rocks) has been intact for millennia. The trees are over 50 years old.

Not found:

Individual or mass graves, fragments of skeletons, human ashes, wood ashes, ground irregularities, unidentified compounds, remains of trees or stumps, cavities, gold teeth.

[astro3]

Here is a witness statement from Down Under about Krege:

Michael Mazur:

Fact of the matter is that Richard Krege did a public lecture and slide presentation of the Ground Penetrating Radar – GPR research findings on Treblinka in Melbourne in January 2000, which presentation was very well attended. None of what he had to say or show was subsequently reported anywhere in mainstream media, but later an unbiased report of his research appeared on David Irving's site. Later Paul von Stroheim compiled an unauthorised version video clip of Krege’s work. Of course there was no chance that his work because it challenges the dogma that is the Treblinka of official memory, would ever be published in any engineering journal. I say this because Krege is himself an engineer.
He called for a commission under UN auspices to be set up to go to the Treblinka grounds and with the GPR conduct, as he had done; open scientific research,
meaning a repeating of the survey over the entire grounds at least as thoroughly as Krege did, and if possible find fault with his research findings. There was
no response by anyone, none of the ADLs and JDLs had anything to say about his work these long 12 years of silence, until now...Richard Krege 12 years ago did his
comprehensive presentation audiovisually, and I still retain some of the images, but not the words verbatim - as would be true of other people there too...
A word about Richard Krege's fate since then; later, at some point, a compensated separation from his decade-long Federal Government employer was agreed upon – that was after he returned from attending the Holocaust Conference in Teheran in December 2006

FredToben: ...When in December 2006 the Iranians held an International Conference on Reviewing the Holocaust, the so-called ‘free-and-democratic world was in uproar...It is this context in which Mr Richard Krege found himself with his original Treblinka research. When he returned from the 2006 Teheran Holocaust-Shoah conference, he lost his decade-long government job at AirServices in Canberra. Mr Krege is now a married man with child and cannot afford openly to expose himself in the way he had already done in the past. http://www.adelaideinstitute.org/newsle ... %20601.pdf

[Werd]

Roberto Muehlenkamp has claimed that Gerdes, of nafcash.com fame used to talk a lot about Krege's GPR work at Treblinka which allegedly showed there was no significant soil disturbance. But then Roberto claims, when others started saying that a scan Krege put out showed the opposite of what he was trying to prove, all mention of Krege was suddenly dropped from the nafcash site.

Here are but two examples of some people disagreeing with the Krege scan.
http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?t=47550
http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?t=94929

I did some googling and thanks to an archive version of a waronyou topic from 2009, I found someone giving a quote from nafcash that DID include a mention of Krege.
http://waronyou.com/forums/index.php?topic=163.50;wap2

oiram:


The National Association of Forensic Historians
Quote

NO TRACE OF MASS GRAVES FOUND AT TREBLINKA

A detailed forensic examination of the site of the wartime Treblinka camp, using sophisticated electronic ground radar, has found no evidence of mass graves there. For six days in October 1999, an Australian forensics team headed by Richard Krege, a qualified electronics engineer, carried out an examination of the soil at the site of the former Treblinka II camp in Poland where, holocaust historians claim, 870,000 jews were put to death in gas chambers and then buried in huge mass graves. Krege said: “From these scans we could clearly identify the largely undisturbed horizontal stratigraphic layering, better known as horizons, of the soil under the camp site. We know from scans of gravesites and other sites with known soil disturbances, such as quarries, when this natural layering is massively disrupted or missing altogether. Because normal geological processes are very slow acting, disruption of the soil structure would have been detectable even after 60 years. Historians say that the bodies were exhumed and cremated toward the end of the Treblinka camp’s use in 1943, but we found no indication that any mass graves ever existed.”

According to the Encyclopedia of the Holocaust (1997), a total of 870,000 people were allegedly killed with diesel exhaust and buried at Treblinka between July 1942 and April 1943. Then, between April and July 1943, the hundreds of thousands of corpses were allegedly dug up and burned on large grids made of railroad rails. Krege’s team used an $80,000.00 GROUND PENETRATION RADAR (GPR) device, which sends out vertical radar signals that are visible on a computer monitor. GPR detects any large-scale disturbances in the soil structure to a normal effective depth of four or five meters. (GPR is routinely used around the world by geologists, archeologists and police.) In its Treblinka investigation, the team carefully examined the entire Treblinka II site, especially the alleged “mass graves” portion, but found no evidence of individual graves, bone remains, human ashes or wood ashes. (SOURCE)

http://nafcash.com/


NO DIESEL GASSINGS AT TREBLINKA

“Most Nazi gassings were supposedly committed with diesel exhaust rather than Zyklon B… a working draft paper authored by Walter Lüftl, President of the Austrian Federal Chamber of Engineers, described mass murder with diesel exhaust as a “sheer impossibility.” He substantiated his view as to the relative harmlessness of diesel exhaust… there are no known deaths in cars or trucks with diesel engines! Every night across the world, tens of thousands of truck drivers sleep in their truck cabs with the diesel engines running throughout the night – there is no evidence of even one trucker dying. It never happens. There are no known diesel suicides either… The new 'revised' version of the Holocaust story is even more absurd than the old version. The diesel gas chamber claim is rubbish… Although it would have been theoretically possible to commit the deeds alleged for Belzec, Chelmno, Sobibor and Treblinka with diesel engines… It would be hard to imagine a mass murder method more awkward and inefficient. Even if some deranged minds had tried for a time to commit murder with diesel exhaust, after a few tries it would have become apparent to even the most demented fiend that something far better was needed. The idea that the National Socialists actually used such a method is preposterous. It never happened!” (SOURCE)

NOTE: The alleged Treblinka diesel gas chamber lie is only the latest on a long list of ever changing, ludicrous killing methods claimed by the “eyewitnesses” that have been totally debunked by forensic scientists / historians. The following is a list of the absurd and/or physically impossible murder weapons / techniques previously claimed to have been employed at Treblinka: *Exhaust fumes from an unspecified engine, with poison added to the fuel. *A mobile gas chamber that traveled along the edge of the “huge mass graves” and unloaded the corpses into them. *Gas chambers with delayed action gas - which enabled the victims to walk to the mass graves, where they lost consciousness at precisely the right moment - then conveniently fell into them! *Quicklime in trains. *Thrown alive into boiling water. *Steam. (Steam chambers were also “proven” at the Nuremberg show trial and were previously a very commonly claimed method until finally being officially replaced with the equally absurd diesel exhaust method.) *Suffocation. (Sucking the air out of the chambers with a vacuum pump was another commonly claimed method before it too was put down the memory hole.) *Electric current. *Chlorine gas. *And last, but certainly not least - by tearing the children in half, like phone books - WITH BARE HANDS!
http://nafcash.com/


THE INCREDIBLE SHRINKING HOLOCAUST

According to the official holocaust story, the Germans set up six “extermination camps” in Poland where jews were allegedly murdered in homicidal gas chambers. Before we further expose the alleged “pure” extermination centers as historical frauds, witness what forensic experts have already proven about the two alleged “death / labor” camps of Auschwitz and Majdanek.

Table chart Here: http://nafcash.com/

Even the jews have been forced to admit that the alleged Auschwitz holocaust was exaggerated by no less than 364% and that the alleged Majdanek holocaust was exaggerated by no less than 1,923% and that the combined 4.322 million reduction of the Auschwitz / Majdanek death tolls means that, at the very least - 78.6% of these two alleged holocausts within the holocaust - didn’t happen. (Remember, these are the maximum figures that the jews themselves accept!) But of course, the sacred six million figure is never reduced.

Due to the skeptical inquiry of forensic historians and the on-site investigations of forensic scientists, the original “judicially proven” death toll figures of the German WW II camps have been dropping like a stone. Of course, it’s politically incorrect to even notice these facts, but when people do and they dare to speak the truth about what they’ve learned, they’re attacked as anti-Semitic HOLOCAUST DENIERS and in many countries arrested, fined and thrown in prison. This is how numerous “free democracies” have prevented unfettered historiography and open debate about this fraudulent shell game. (This is especially true for Germany, which is still paying REPARATIONS TO ISRAEL based on figures that were “proven” at the Nuremberg show trial.)


THE “PURE EXTERMINATION CENTERS”
Table chart Here: http://nafcash.com/
“UTTERLY ERADICATED” ALL EVIDENCE OF THEIR CRIME
Do you really believe that two million people could be murdered without leaving a trace?
Table chart Here: http://nafcash.com/


“Eyewitness” Yankel Wiernik’s model of the phantom “huge mass graves” of Treblinka that allegedly contain

Millions of pounds of bone fragments, tens of millions of teeth and tens of thousands of bullets and shell casings.

Quote

The remains of 870,000 jews are allegedly buried within this clearing under and around the monuments.

So why are the billion dollar per-year holocaust industry and its fawning front men at the “Skeptics” Society afraid to honestly apply the scientific method to the fairy tale known as the Treblinka holocaust? It really is this incredibly simple: The alleged Treblinka holocaust literally stands or falls on the existence of the alleged “huge mass graves” / millions of pounds of evidence, and the nonsensical lies of Belzec, Chelmno and Sobibor become untenable (as if they’re not already!) if the truth about Treblinka is exposed. Are you beginning to understand why the jews have gotten holocaust denial (jewish code name for THE TRUTH) to be a criminal offense in 15 countries of the world? And the “Skeptics” Society is aiding and abetting them in this immoral inquisition! And to add insult to injury, they’re prostituting themselves to the holocaust industry under the guise of skeptical inquiry and the scientific method! That explains why the alleged Treblinka holocaust had to be “proven” with the “science of history” instead of archeology / forensic science. The only other explanation for this craven refusal to apply the scientific method to scientifically knowable truths and forensically provable facts is that the logically retarded pseudo-skeptics at the Schleptics Society actually believe in magically disappearing jews!

http://nafcash.com/


$100,000.00

REWARD

For locating / proving the existence of just one grave that contains just one tenth of one percent of the alleged mass murder.
Link: http://nafcash.com/

Go to nafcash now. Krege is not mentioned once. Is it because, as some speculate, they show evidence of soil disturbance, which could mean mass graves? There is a conspiracy theory that Krege published nothing because the early scan he did release he had thrown back in his face and so he slunk back into the night. However, some have said that Germar Rudolf was going to write a report for Krege with Krege's help because Rudolf is a chemist and not an archaeological expert, but that Rudolf was put in jail and THAT is why nothing has been released today from Krege. Although one can make the argument that Rudolf being in jail, is not actually preventing Krege from releasing more photos and more of his work to be checked and scrutinized. And also, how else do we explain Krege being taken out of the nafcash site now? Does the runner of nafcash also think that the nay sayers about Krege's scans may be on to something? Is nafcash afraid of egg on their face like they claim Krege is? Or do we say that despite there possibly being evidence of soil disturbace, IS THAT ENOUGH TO PROVE THERE ARE X AMOUNT OF DEAD JEWS IN THERE? I would say no but that it would be a step for the believers (as opposed to us doubters and agnostics). I would say that this newest expidition to Treblinka should provide us with evidence. That is if the Jews don't get in the way and use their 'don't dig up those graves' law that is in fact bullshit and isn't really a law since those rabbis let it slide all the time. Laws like that are either all or none. Thus, they have no excuse for standing in the way.

The VHO website states that, as late as 2007 (the last time it was updated) a Krege report was still in the making. The M/G Treblinka book says something about Krege's research was going to be published in the book, but he had performed research at other camps, and as such the results were to be published in a separate book. That was 2004. We have heard nothing since.

What are the explanations and where does the truth lie? Can anyone help me out please?

[Haldan]

Werd:

One option would be to contact the people in-charge of VHO. I'm quite certain that we'll hear a lot more soon...

-haldan

[Clem]

Werd:

Roberto Muehlenkamp has claimed that Gerdes, of nafcash.com fame used to talk a lot about Krege's GPR work at Treblinka which allegedly showed there was no significant soil disturbance. But then Roberto claims, when others started saying that a scan Krege put out showed the opposite of what he was trying to prove, all mention of Krege was suddenly dropped from the nafcash site.

Werd, Roberto Muehlenkamp also claims that Krege never conducted a geophysical investigation of Treblinka:

http://revisionistworkshop.com/forum/vi ... 6574#p6574

C - Has anyone ever claimed to have conducted a geophysical investigation of this alleged “huge mass grave” - Yes. - or - No. - ??

[...]

roberto's answers: [for question C]

Treblinka - 6 alleged "huge mass graves:"

"Huge mass grave" # 1/49: - No.

"Huge mass grave" # 2/50: - No.

"Huge mass grave" # 3/51:- No.

"Huge mass grave" # 4/52: - No.

"Huge mass grave" # 5/53: - No.

"Huge mass grave" # 6/54: - No.

He also admits that Coll's investigation didn't prove the existence of a single grave:

E - It is known - WITH 100 % CERTAINTY - that - AT LEAST - __?__ pits and/or trenches have been located / proven to exist at Treblinka - using one or more of the following geophysical methods: Ground Penetrating Radar, Magnetrometry, Resistivity and Conductivity, EM61 High Resolution Metal Detection, GEM19 Overhauser GPS Magnetic Gradiometer, EM38 Terrain Conductivity Meter or GPS Mapping - by a team led by Caroline Sturdy Colls?

roberto's answer: 0

F - It is known - WITH 100 % CERTAINTY - that - AT LEAST - __?__ of the 54 alleged “huge mass graves” of Belzec, Chelmno, Sobibor and Treblinka have been located / proven to exist using one or more of the following geophysical methods: Ground Penetrating Radar, Magnetrometry, Resistivity and Conductivity, EM61 High Resolution Metal Detection, GEM19 Overhauser GPS Magnetic Gradiometer, EM38 Terrain Conductivity Meter or GPS Mapping?

roberto's answer: 0

[...]

V - True. - or - False. ?? - Forensic archaeologist Caroline Sturdy Colls’ geophysical investigation of Treblinka did not prove that any of the pits she claims to have located contain anything other than soil and/or trash, or prove in any way that said pits are actually “graves;” and she most certainly did not prove that any of the pits currently contain so-much-as one single bullet, shell casing, tooth, bone fragment or “whole corpse,” - i.e. - no human remains what-so-ever - NONE!

roberto's answer: True.

And he refuses to answer other questions about Krege:

A - It is known - WITH 100 % CERTAINTY - that - AT LEAST - __?__ pits and/or trenches have been located / proven to exist at Treblinka - using one or more of the following geophysical methods: Ground Penetrating Radar, Magnetrometry, Resistivity and Conductivity, EM61 High Resolution Metal Detection, GEM19 Overhauser GPS Magnetic Gradiometer, EM38 Terrain Conductivity Meter or GPS Mapping - by a team led by Richard Krege?

roberto's answer: roberto cravenly refuses to unequivocally answer this incredibly simple question - go figure.

B - Can you provide the name of so-much-as one person who has seen the results of Krege’s geophysical investigation of Treblinka - Yes. - or - No. - ??

roberto's answer: roberto cravenly refuses to unequivocally answer this incredibly simple question - go figure.

C - Can you provide the name of so-much-as one person who has seen the results of Coll’s geophysical investigation of Treblinka - Yes. - or - No. - ??

roberto's answer: roberto cravenly refuses to unequivocally answer this incredibly simple question - go figure.

http://revisionistworkshop.com/forum/vi ... 6574#p6574


Werd:

Go to nafcash now. Krege is not mentioned once.

Neither is Freund or Nowak or Colls.

If I recall, there used to be information about John Demjanjuk there as well, but suddenly "all mention of Demjanjuk was suddenly dropped from the nafcash site" as well!

So what does that mean Werd?

Look what else I found that used to be on the nafcash site Werd:

Forensic Experts Prove Holocaust Gas Chamber Myth a “Sheer Impossibility”

NO DIESEL GASSINGS AT TREBLINKA

“Most Nazi gassings were supposedly committed with diesel exhaust rather than Zyklon B… a working draft paper authored by Walter Lüftl, President of the Austrian Federal Chamber of Engineers, described mass murder with diesel exhaust as a “sheer impossibility.” He substantiated his view as to the relative harmlessness of diesel exhaust… there are no known deaths in cars or trucks with diesel engines! Every night across the world, tens of thousands of truck drivers sleep in their truck cabs with the diesel engines running throughout the night – there is no evidence of even one trucker dying. It never happens. There are no known diesel suicides either… The new 'revised' version of the Holocaust story is even more absurd than the old version. The diesel gas chamber claim is rubbish… Although it would have been theoretically possible to commit the deeds alleged for Belzec, Chelmno, Sobibor and Treblinka with diesel engines… It would be hard to imagine a mass murder method more awkward and inefficient. Even if some deranged minds had tried for a time to commit murder with diesel exhaust, after a few tries it would have become apparent to even the most demented fiend that something far better was needed. The idea that the National Socialists actually used such a method is preposterous. It never happened!” (SOURCE)

NOTE: The alleged Treblinka diesel gas chamber lie is only the latest on a long list of ever changing, ludicrous killing methods claimed by the “eyewitnesses” that have been totally debunked by forensic scientists / historians. The following is a list of the absurd and/or physically impossible murder weapons / techniques previously claimed to have been employed at Treblinka: *Exhaust fumes from an unspecified engine, with poison added to the fuel. *A mobile gas chamber that traveled along the edge of the “huge mass graves” and unloaded the corpses into them. *Gas chambers with delayed action gas - which enabled the victims to walk to the mass graves, where they lost consciousness at precisely the right moment - then conveniently fell into them! *Quicklime in trains. *Thrown alive into boiling water. *Steam. (Steam chambers were also “proven” at the Nuremberg show trial and were previously a very commonly claimed method until finally being officially replaced with the equally absurd diesel exhaust method.) *Suffocation. (Sucking the air out of the chambers with a vacuum pump was another commonly claimed method before it too was put down the memory hole.) *Electric current. *Chlorine gas. *And last, but certainly not least - by tearing the children in half, like phone books - WITH BARE HANDS!

But suddenly "all mention of diesel gassings were suddenly dropped from the nafcash site" as well!

So what does that mean Werd?

In fact, the word "gas" does not appear once!

So what does that mean Werd?

Nor does the word Jew.

So what does that mean Werd?

Nor does the word Holocaust.

So what does that mean Werd?


http://nafcash.com/


Werd:

What are the explanations and where does the truth lie? Can anyone help me out please?

Why not ask your buddy Roberto?

If you use him as a source of information for your posts here, then you must respect his opinion.

[Clem]

“Caroline Sturdy Colls: ...I have identified a number of buried [sic] pits using geophysical techniques. These are considerable. One in particular is 26 meters by 17 meters.

Jonathan Charles: That’s huge.

Sturdy Colls: It is huge. We are talking about a considerable number of bodies [which] could have been contained within pits of that size.

Charles: That could have contained hundreds, perhaps thousands of bodies, we don’t know deep it is, or do you know how deep it is?

Sturdy Colls: Unfortunately no. The survey technology does not allow us to go to certain depths. I know that it is over 4 meters, that was the extent of this [inaudible]. It’s a considerable pit.

The soil at Treblinka is supposedly very sandy.

Check out how far down GRR works in sand:

http://www.global-gpr.com/gpr-technolog ... works.html

Depending on the subsurface material the depth range can be from a few inches to thousands of feet (as indicated in the chart).

[Turpitz]

Calm down, Turpitz.

implying that astro3 was defending the exterminationist thesis when in fact he was doing the opposite!

You probably don't realise it, as you have not been here much recently, but astro3 has suffered professionally for his revisionism. He is also the originator and main contributor to the sticky thread on Chemistry at Auschwitz.

I'm not sure who you mean by "you and your friends" (addressed to me) but, again, if you had looked at my posts you would have seen that I am not an exterminationist either.

Let's now get back to talking about Treblinka.

How do you know that I am irate? Apart from being presumptuous, you must have amazing powers of observation. You should channel these powers into something more useful, like for instance finding a "mass grave" or something.

Anyone who talks or acts publicly against the industry gets persecuted, so what! Maybe you just haven't been here long enough, ever thought of that?

In regard to talking about Treblinka (An empty field with some post-war rocks on their end in the middle of nowhere. Or is there a McDonalds there yet?) you seem to be missing the point as I see nothing to talk about. If you want to carry on jumping through hoops and led on a wild goose chase for Jewry, that is your funeral. I have already stated my position on the subject quite clearly. Nothing will come of it, all wind, piss and pie-charts. As stated before in a years time there will be no more evidence for mass murder than we have had for the last seventy years, you can mark my words. BBC putting their poison in again, bank rolled by Brussels and source their "news" from the Rothschild owned Reuters. Is Alan Yentob still at the helm? Another "survivor" I shouldn't wonder.

The only aspect of this nonsense that I find interesting is the push away from the Holy Auschwitz. The calculating journaille are subtlely introducing the Goy masses to the more obscure and lesser known industry hot-spots. From Belsen and Dachau we have moved right across the continent and are now on the doorstep of Russia - the ever evolving industry.
If you get caught lying, just move the goal-posts.

[Carolyn Yeager]

Calm down, Turpitz. [...] Let's now get back to talking about Treblinka.

How do you know that I am irate? Apart from being presumptuous, you must have amazing powers of observation. You should channel these powers into something more useful, like for instance finding a "mass grave" or something.

Anyone who talks or acts publicly against the industry gets persecuted, so what! Maybe you just haven't been here long enough, ever thought of that?

In regard to talking about Treblinka (An empty field with some post-war rocks on their end in the middle of nowhere. Or is there a McDonalds there yet?) you seem to be missing the point as I see nothing to talk about. If you want to carry on jumping through hoops and led on a wild goose chase for Jewry, that is your funeral. I have already stated my position on the subject quite clearly. Nothing will come of it, all wind, piss and pie-charts. As stated before in a years time there will be no more evidence for mass murder than we have had for the last seventy years, you can mark my words. BBC putting their poison in again, bank rolled by Brussels and source their "news" from the Rothschild owned Reuters. Is Alan Yentob still at the helm? Another "survivor" I shouldn't wonder.

The only aspect of this nonsense that I find interesting is the push away from the Holy Auschwitz. The calculating journaille are subtlely introducing the Goy masses to the more obscure and lesser known industry hot-spots. From Belsen and Dachau we have moved right across the continent and are now on the doorstep of Russia - the ever evolving industry.
If you get caught lying, just move the goal-posts.

Thanks Turpitz for a brilliant post. I highlighted a few sentences that I especially like. One might think that there is a "Revisionist Industry" that doesn't want to come to an end, but I don't really think that. Maybe too much of a serious, scholarly approach instead of pointing out that they have provided nothing of any substance. "Please offer some evidence and then we can talk about it." Otherwise, it's just empty air. Lots of commotion to cover up that emptiness.

[Clem]

I don't have the page number, but in Rachel Auerbachs: In the Fields of Treblinka, she has a title or subtitle:

"The Sandy Soil Yields Up Its Secret..."

Every photo of Treblinka that I've seen shows what appears to me to be very sandy soil.

Colls should have been able to look at least 10 times deeper than what she claims.

http://www.global-gpr.com/gpr-technolog ... works.html

Krege claimed that he could find a butter knife 30 meters below ground.

And that was 12 years earlier than Colls

Check this out:

In sandy soil, on the other hand, they can find objects that are more than 50 metres deep.

http://heritage-key.com/world/archaeolo ... e-free-gpr

However:

if the artefacts are in wet soil, there will be less of a difference, electrically, between the soil and the artefacts. This means that the velocity change of the wave will be reduced and the reflections produced will be weaker and more difficult to detect.

Is Colls going to claim that she encountered ground water at 4 meters?

That would prove yet another problem for the holohoax fabricationists, wouldn't it?

Because the Soviets, the Poles and Krege never said a word about ground water or even wet soil.

And you wouldn't have a gravel pit, like the Germans did between Treblinka I and II, in an area that had such a high water table.

Not to mention the fact that the Germans would never have dug deep graves in the first place in an area with such a high water table.

[Clem]

Thomas Kues:

This is clearly the largest in surface of the 10 pits identified.

Whoa there Thomas, hold your horses.

How many pits has Caroline Sturdy Colls actually claimed to have “discovered” at Treblinka? (Please give the exact number with the exact quote and a link.)

kues' answer: - ?


It is known - WITH 100 % CERTAINTY - that - AT LEAST - __?__ pits and/or trenches have been located / proven to exist at Treblinka - using one or more of the following geophysical methods: Ground Penetrating Radar, Magnetrometry, Resistivity and Conductivity, EM61 High Resolution Metal Detection, GEM19 Overhauser GPS Magnetic Gradiometer, EM38 Terrain Conductivity Meter or GPS Mapping - by a team led by Richard Krege?

Kues' answer: - ?


Have the results of Krege’s geophysical investigation of Treblinka ever been made available for public inspection / verification - Yes. - or - No. - ??

Kues' answer: - ??


It is known - WITH 100 % CERTAINTY - that - AT LEAST - __?__ pits and/or trenches have been located / proven to exist at Treblinka - using one or more of the following geophysical methods: Ground Penetrating Radar, Magnetrometry, Resistivity and Conductivity, EM61 High Resolution Metal Detection, GEM19 Overhauser GPS Magnetic Gradiometer, EM38 Terrain Conductivity Meter or GPS Mapping - by a team led by Caroline Sturdy Colls?

Kues' answer: - ?


Have the results of Caroline Sturdy Colls’ geophysical investigation of Treblinka ever been made available for public inspection / verification - Yes. - or - No. - ??

Kues' answer: - ??


Thomas Kues:

Since some 800,000 Jews in total were deported to Treblinka during the camp’s period of operation (July 1942 – August 1943), this would mean…

What this would mean Thomas, is that there would have been one or more very large latrine pits in the camp to handle all the crap coming out of all those Jews for all those months.

So Thomas, which “of the 10 pits identified” by you are the latrine pits?

kues' answer: - ?

[Signton]

There are now 17 mass graves claimed to exist at Treblinka. (11 by Colls and 6 by Wiernink.)

I have yet to see an iota of proof that any of these alleged mass graves contain so-much-as an ounce of human remains.

Are there any hoaxters lurking around here who would like to show me the proof that these alleged mass graves contain human remains?

What's the very best proof that you can proffer?

[Signton]

ClaudiaRothenbach:

Some years ago, Richard Krege proved with ground penetrating radar that there is only undisturbed soil on the site.

Richard Krege never "proved" anything.

Claudia, do you really believe that the Treblinka soil is undisturbed? Do you really believe that no trash pits and latrines were dug? Do you really believe that the locals didn't dig in the trash pits? Do you really believe that the Soviets and Poles didn't dig in the trash pits and make other excavations?


Astro:

In October 1999 a 'small team of Australian researchers' spent three weeks doing a very detailed ground-survey, they took earth-core samples down to six feet as well as their ground-penetrating radar. Their detailed scans were saved on laptops and then copied onto CD-roms and sent to various experts world-wide for evaluation. They found no ashes, no bones, and concluded with 100% certainty that Treblinka had never been used as a 'death-camp'. That video seems to be, alas, all that remains of the Report.

I have no doubt that they found no ashes and no bones. And any sane person would conclude, "with 100% certainty, that Treblinka had never been used as a 'death-camp'."

If Krege really did a legitimate GPR scan of Treblinka, he would have found soil disturbance.

Who here really belives that the soil of Treblinka is "undisturbed?"

Anyone?

[Signton]

Eric Hunt:

I don't think we've talked about the map of alleged graves the BBC / Colls have now produced.

Nor has anyone here talked about the similarities of "the map of alleged graves the BBC / Colls have now produced" and Wiernik's map.

The only real discrepancy, besides the size of the pits, is the pit labeled #4 by Kues.

And when you look at its location, you can figure out the orgin of the pit from this Zdzisław Łukaszkiewicz quote:

"A series of test excavations were performed at the place where the [gas] chambers had to have been located, in order to find their foundation walls if possible. Pits 10 - 15 meters in length and 1.5 meters deep were dug. Undisturbed layers of earth were uncovered by this."

The location of this pit (#4) is where the gas chambers were alleged to have been.