Roberto Muehlenkamp & 'Holocaust' Industry cite incinerator patent application as proof of impossible cremation numbers

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Roberto Muehlenkamp & 'Holocaust' Industry cite incinerator patent application as proof of impossible cremation numbers

Postby Hannover » 1 year 11 months ago (Mon Jul 24, 2017 11:27 pm)

Zionist Roberto Muehlenkamp & Co. elsewhere has cited a letter from SS Fritz Sander of Sept. 14, 1942 about generalized cremation capability of an incinerator in a patent application, as if that proved that the alleged massive numbers of cremations at Auschwitz, including the alleged multiple cremations per oven.* were indeed possible, which they certainly were not.

Image
letter from Fritz Sander

The problem for Roberto is that he cites a letter about an incinerator patent application, but the incinerator was never built !!! :lol:

Image
Sketch of the "continuous-operation corpse incineration oven for mass use" from the patent application

more here:
'The Ovens in the Camps are Incinerators Now'
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=7842

* As for the alleged multiple cremations per oven (muffle), which would have been impossible because it would have damaged the 'ovens', the crematorium builder, SS Prufer stated in the Soviet interrogation session of 5th March, 1946:
Soviet interrogator:
"How many bodies were cremated per hour at Auschwitz?"

Prüfer responded:
"In a crematory with 5 ovens and 15 muffles, fifteen bodies were cremated."

Now go & look to see what the number of 'gassings' per day are alleged to have been.

At his interrogation on 19th March 1946 Prüfer elaborated as follows:
I have mentioned the enormous load to which the overtaxed ovens were subjected. I told Chief Engineer Sander I was worried about whether the ovens could withstand the excessive load. In my presence, two bodies were placed in one muffle, instead of a single body, and the ovens were unable to handle the load"

and:
SS Kurt Prufer, told the officers of SMERSCH (according to documents found in the Moscow archives) that only one body at a time could be cremated per muffle and that the cremation time took 60 minutes, and that they tried to cremate 2 bodies at a time; but the temperature inside the muffle went so high that it damaged the oven. :lol:

facts:
- There was a total 52 muffles of Auschwitz, never used simultaneously.

- 38 is the most that were ever online simultaneously.

- The 6 at Auschwitz I were taken out of action as soon as the new ones at Birkenau came online. These were in turn liable to long periods of breakdowns and even idleness.

more here:
'Debate extracts with Nessie over Auschwitz crematoria'
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=10953

IOW, the massive cremations in the time lengths alleged are impossible in even modern crematorium. :lol:

- Hannover

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If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Re: Roberto Muehlenkamp & 'Holocaust' Industry cite incinerator patent application as proof of impossible cremation numb

Postby Hegwood » 1 year 11 months ago (Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:56 am)

Why did the Germans ever build crematory ovens in Auschwitz in the first place? They must have been expensive to build and maintain. Apparently they were often unavailable due to breakdowns. Meanwhile about 270 miles away the operators of Treblinka were able to simply pile thousands of corpses at a time on huge grates ignite them with a "few dry branches" and watch them burn to ashes. No complicated coke burners, no retorts with fire brick lining, no massive chimneys, just a few rail tracks to make a huge grate and a little wood for kindling.

An alternative to the wood kindling was the use of the corpses of a few fat women.

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Re: Roberto Muehlenkamp & 'Holocaust' Industry cite incinerator patent application as proof of impossible cremation numb

Postby Revisionist » 1 year 11 months ago (Tue Jul 25, 2017 1:08 pm)

Mattogno wrote in "Dissecting the Holocaust" that the fastest cremation time measured in his cited studies was 48 minutes. But it had some special conditions. It matches well with Prufer's statement because the average cremation time in the mentioned studies was about an hour.

We have specific types of ovens in our case which raises another point: Mattogno wrote that Topf and Sohne used fire bricks which can handle max. 3000 cremations before they are used up. The inicinerator won't push the limits of the fire bricks.

Next problem: How much fuel for the crematories was availabe in Auschwitz? I don't have the numbers right now but they should be documented somewhere. Now we have to know how much is used for an average cremation. This will give us a good estimate how many cremations could have taken place. This point definitly limits the cremation number.

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Re: Roberto Muehlenkamp & 'Holocaust' Industry cite incinerator patent application as proof of impossible cremation numb

Postby Dresden » 1 year 11 months ago (Tue Jul 25, 2017 3:02 pm)

Hegwood said:

"An alternative to the wood kindling was the use of the corpses of a few fat women"

and.....

Rachael Auerbach stated:

"Blood, too, was found to be first-class combustion material"
- R. Auerbach, THE DEATH CAMP TREBLINKA: A DOCUMENTARY
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Re: Roberto Muehlenkamp & 'Holocaust' Industry cite incinerator patent application as proof of impossible cremation numb

Postby Atigun » 1 year 11 months ago (Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:35 pm)

Indeed, Chil Rajchman, a Treblinka inmate and eyewitness, reported that the blood of 250,000 Jews who were buried in one giant grave accidentally caught fire and burned like fuel for an entire night and the next day. The grave was 12 meters deep but the heat of the fire brought the buried blood to the surface where it continued to burn.

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Re: Roberto Muehlenkamp & 'Holocaust' Industry cite incinerator patent application as proof of impossible cremation numb

Postby Dresden » 1 year 11 months ago (Tue Jul 25, 2017 10:45 pm)

Atigun wrote:Indeed, Chil Rajchman, a Treblinka inmate and eyewitness, reported that the blood of 250,000 Jews who were buried in one giant grave accidentally caught fire and burned like fuel for an entire night and the next day. The grave was 12 meters deep but the heat of the fire brought the buried blood to the surface where it continued to burn.


I wonder if Gentile blood has the same magical properties, and whether one could tell the difference by the color of the flames.

I would wager that Gentile blood is non-flammable.
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Re: Roberto Muehlenkamp & 'Holocaust' Industry cite incinerator patent application as proof of impossible cremation numb

Postby Revisionist » 1 year 11 months ago (Tue Jul 25, 2017 11:51 pm)

Regarding AR camps:
Why didn't they just cremate the bodies right after the killings? In Auschwitz they didn't have this kill,bury, dig up then cremation scheme. They put the bodies directly in the ovens right after the gassings.
And AR should have installed cremation ovens since they are far more efficient than open air burnings.

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Re: Roberto Muehlenkamp & 'Holocaust' Industry cite incinerator patent application as proof of impossible cremation numb

Postby Hannover » 1 year 11 months ago (Wed Jul 26, 2017 3:12 am)

Revisionist wrote:Regarding AR camps:
Why didn't they just cremate the bodies right after the killings? In Auschwitz they didn't have this kill,bury, dig up then cremation scheme. They put the bodies directly in the ovens right after the gassings.
And AR should have installed cremation ovens since they are far more efficient than open air burnings.

I assume you meant to say:
'In Auschwitz they didn't have the alleged 'kill, bury, dig up, then cremate scheme'. Supposedly they put the bodies directly in the ovens right after the gassings.'

Your point is a good one. It all simply makes no sense. IOW, 'that dog don't hunt'.
See my take down of Roberto Muehlenkamp & Andrew Mathis here:
'Challenge to Roberto Muehlenkamp, Andrew Mathis & Believers on alleged Auschwitz / Birkenau 'gassings''
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=11231

Best, Hannover

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Re: Roberto Muehlenkamp & 'Holocaust' Industry cite incinerator patent application as proof of impossible cremation numb

Postby Hegwood » 1 year 11 months ago (Wed Jul 26, 2017 9:50 am)

Revisionist,

I hope you did not take my sarcastic comment about "why the Germans bothered to build crematory ovens at Auschwitz" seriously.

There were crematory ovens at Auschwitz because they were needed. The camp had a large semi-permanent population, some of whom died of natural causes and were cremated. In addition there was an epidemic of typhus that killed thousands and their bodies had to be cremated quickly to stem the spread of the disease.

There were no crematoria at Treblinka because there was no need for them. I don't know how many people died at Treblinka but it was relatively few.

The alleged thousands of deaths at Treblinka are based on the Yankel Wienik yarn, "A Year in Treblinka" which should be classified as a tall tail. It is only appropriate as an entry in a liars convention. There is no reason to believe anything described in that work.

Personally, I have not read the whole tale. I've tried but it just makes me mad and I quit.
I have read chapter 9 and could not believe someone would write such non-sense. That someone would write, and expect others to believe, that it was possible to cremate corpses by piling them thousands at a time on an open air grate, set them on fire, and have them burn to ashes just boggles my mind. Further the comment about using the corpses of fat women to kindle the fire is indescribably stupid.

The story is so impossible, preposterous, ridiculous that it should be humorous, yet it is not only taken seriously but is used to describe the operation of other alleged death camps Belsec and Sobibor.

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Re: Roberto Muehlenkamp & 'Holocaust' Industry cite incinerator patent application as proof of impossible cremation numb

Postby Hektor » 1 year 11 months ago (Wed Jul 26, 2017 3:12 pm)

Correct me, if I'm wrong.
The SS / camp authorities DID REFUSE the offer for this incinerator, right?

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Re: Roberto Muehlenkamp & 'Holocaust' Industry cite incinerator patent application as proof of impossible cremation numb

Postby Revisionist » 1 year 11 months ago (Wed Jul 26, 2017 4:27 pm)

Revisionist,

I hope you did not take my sarcastic comment about "why the Germans bothered to build crematory ovens at Auschwitz" seriously.


I didn't and it helped to develop my thoughts on this matter. I have started reading Mattogno's text I mentioned earlier again. He writes in the beginning about the pre war time where Germans had to deliver huge amount of coal to their former enemies. Because of this problem they started to develop crematory ovens with lower coal consumption rates. Makes sense in my eyes.

In 1942-43 they have to deal with a World War. Why not use devices which saves you a lot of valuable fuel? It's not like the germans were swimming in resources.

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Re: Roberto Muehlenkamp & 'Holocaust' Industry cite incinerator patent application as proof of impossible cremation numb

Postby Lothario » 1 year 11 months ago (Thu Jul 27, 2017 8:03 am)

Revisionist wrote:Regarding AR camps:
Why didn't they just cremate the bodies right after the killings? In Auschwitz they didn't have this kill,bury, dig up then cremation scheme. They put the bodies directly in the ovens right after the gassings.
And AR should have installed cremation ovens since they are far more efficient than open air burnings.


I can't recall where I read it, but one explanation given for this is that after the Germans found and exhumed the remains of the Katyn massacre, they realised they needed a better way to get rid of the bodies. Therefore they decided to dig up and cremate the bodies. Same reasoning applies to the einzatsgruppen.

There is just one problem with this explanation. The Germans discovered the Katyn massacre at end of 1942/beginning of 1943, while, according to Thomas Dalton in Debating the Holocaust, the decisisions to exhume the buried bodies and cremate them were taken in October 1942 (Sobibor), December 1942 (Belzec) and April 1943 (Treblinka). So at least for Sobibor the decission was taken before anyone knew about Katyn.

Also note that the separate decision dates run counter to the orthodox narrative that the killings were centrally planned and coordinated.
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Re: Roberto Muehlenkamp & 'Holocaust' Industry cite incinerator patent application as proof of impossible cremation numb

Postby Revisionist » 1 year 11 months ago (Thu Jul 27, 2017 5:46 pm)

Wasn't Krema I already in operation when AR started?


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