Muehlenkamp cracks under pressure - admits Kola's & Haimi's Sobibor work not proven to be conclusively documented

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CWhite
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Re: Muehlenkamp cracks under pressure - admits Kola's & Haimi's Sobibor work not proven to be conclusively documented

Postby CWhite » 2 years 1 month ago (Wed Aug 02, 2017 12:50 pm)

I see the following post / bet has recently been posted on another site:

I, Greg Gerdes, am so confident that Roberto Muehlenkamp is a charlatan who has lied himself into a corner with these claims / allegations:

Roberto wrote:
Greg Gerdes wrote:Roberto, do you deny that the 16 so-called “huge mass graves” of Sobibor can be seen on page 7 (figure 6) of this link here:

http://sobibor.info.pl/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/Report-by-Y.Haimi-Autumn-2013.pdf

and are numbered by The N.A.F.H. as follows:

1 = Sobibor “huge mass grave” #1 / 49

2 = Sobibor “huge mass grave” #2 / 50

"Memory Hill" (AKA the - "mound of ashes / remains") = Sobibor “huge mass grave” #3 / 51

3/4 = Sobibor “huge mass grave” #4 / 52

5 = Sobibor “huge mass grave” #5 / 53

6 = Sobibor “huge mass grave” #6 / 54

7 = Sobibor “huge mass grave” #7 / 55

8 (8/15) = Sobibor “huge mass grave” #8 / 56

9 = Sobibor “huge mass grave” #9 / 57

10 = Sobibor “huge mass grave” #10 / 58

11 = Sobibor “huge mass grave” #11 / 59

12 = Sobibor “huge mass grave” #12 / 60

13 = Sobibor “huge mass grave” #13 / 61

14 = Sobibor “huge mass grave” #14 / 62

15 (8/15) = Sobibor “huge mass grave” #15 / 63

16 = Sobibor “huge mass grave” #16 / 64

Roberto's answer: No.


Exactly, I don't deny that at all, see my previous post under [url][link to post on the "other site"][/url]. Haimi's Figure 6:

Image

serves me nicely, for it shows that

a) graves nos. 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14 and 16 are [not] "huge" at all but rather small, and...


I can prove, with the same standard of proof applied in U.S. criminal courts, that the remains of no less than 25,343 people currently lie in no less than 12 graves graves/disposal pits for cremation remains within the boundaries of the former Nazi extermination camp at Sobibór.


Grave nr. 1 identified in archaeological investigations led by Prof. Kola in 2001 (large pit, containing only cremation remains)

Grave nr. 2 identified in archaeological investigations led by Prof. Kola in 2001 (large pit, containing only cremation remains)

Grave nr. 3 identified in archaeological investigations led by Prof. Kola in 2001 (large pit, containing both cremation remains and at the bottom larger human remains in wax-fat transformation)

Grave nr. 4 identified in archaeological investigations led by Prof. Kola in 2001 (large pit, containing both cremation remains and at the bottom larger human remains in wax-fat transformation)

5. Grave nr. 5 identified in archaeological investigations led by Prof. Kola in 2001 (large pit, containing both cremation remains and at the bottom larger human remains in wax-fat transformation)

6. Grave nr. 6 identified in archaeological investigations led by Prof. Kola in 2001 (large pit, containing both cremation remains and at the bottom larger human remains in wax-fat transformation)

Grave nr. 7 identified in archaeological investigations led by Prof. Kola in 2001 (smaller pit, containing only cremation remains, size probably larger than originally assumed according to recent archaeological finds by Yoram Haimi et al)

Grave nr. 8 identified in archaeological investigations by Yoram Haimi et al in 2011-2013 (smaller pit, containing only cremation remains)

Grave nr. 9 identified in archaeological investigations by Yoram Haimi et al in 2011-2013 (very small pit, containing only cremation remains)

Grave nr. 10 identified in archaeological investigations by Yoram Haimi et al in 2011-2013 (very small pit, containing only cremation remains)

Grave nr. 11 identified in archaeological investigations by Yoram Haimi et al in 2011-2013 (very small pit, containing only cremation remains)

Grave nr. 15 identified in archaeological investigations by Yoram Haimi et al in 2011-2013 (smaller pit, containing only cremation remains, linked to grave nr. 8 ).

* * * * *

So now we have four rather small graves (nos. 12, 13, 14 and 16)... The small skeleton graves nos. 12, 13, 14 and 16... contain corpses ... Six individuals were buried in the grave no. 12 and one in the grave no. 13. Another single burial (gave no. 14) was localized... approximately 15 meters in the north area (almost in the straight line) of the skeletal grave no. 14, in the south-west corner of the quarter 49c, hectare XVIII, the ceiling of the another skeletal grave no.16 (Fig.10) has been discovered.

[Note: that is a total of 10 skeletons in 4 of Sobibor's alleged 16 graves that Roberto Muehlenkamp claims have been located / proven to exist within the boundary of Sobibor.)

* * * * *

Greg Gerdes:

Roberto, do you deny ever making this statement:

Roberto Muehlenkamp, VNN post #916:

“…The conclusion that the mound in question is comprised of human ash is thus the conclusion that is borne out by all known evidence and belied by none. It is also the conclusion towards which various sources of evidence independent of each other converge. This convergence of various sources of evidence… is proof that the mound in question is comprised of human ash…”

Yes. - or - No. - ??


Roberto:

No






that I am willing to bet - $1,000.00 - that he cannot prove - with the same standard of proof applied in U.S. criminal courts - that the remains of no less than - 25,353 - people currently lie in the 16 graves identified in the Sobibor map above (using The National Association of Forensic Historians - http://nafcash.com/ - grave numbering system) in this internet forum / thread here:

https://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=11276

Atigun
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Re: Muehlenkamp cracks under pressure - admits Kola's & Haimi's Sobibor work not proven to be conclusively documented

Postby Atigun » 2 years 1 month ago (Sat Aug 12, 2017 9:14 pm)

Gotta' admit that Roberto's walls of text and C.W. White's/Gerdes' walls of "yes or no" questions are perfectly matched and perfectly unreadable.

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Re: Muehlenkamp cracks under pressure - admits Kola's & Haimi's Sobibor work not proven to be conclusively documented

Postby Stephen Cohen » 3 weeks 5 days ago (Fri Aug 23, 2019 12:07 pm)

Atigun wrote:Roberto apparently needs Judge Johnson to come rescue him. IOW, have a judge take judicial notice of the graves and their contents at the Reinhardt camps. Failing that, he will have to present evidence that he obviously doesn't have. Poor Roberto. Well, poorer by $1,000.00 USD unless he intends to renege on his bet.


Whatever came of the fact that Roberto reneged on this bet?

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Re: Muehlenkamp cracks under pressure - admits Kola's & Haimi's Sobibor work not proven to be conclusively documented

Postby Stephen Cohen » 3 weeks 22 hours ago (Wed Aug 28, 2019 12:12 pm)

Pia Kahn wrote:"Roberto:
I, Roberto Muehlenkamp am willing to bet US$ 1,000 (one thousand US Dollars) that I can prove, with the same standard of proof applied in U.S. criminal courts, that the remains of no less than 25,343 people currently lie within the boundaries of the former Nazi extermination camp at Sobibór.


I'll take that bet Roberto!"

This was the bet that was accepted. So please provide the evidence Roberto.

Instead of presenting the evidence, Roberto is trying to claim that this bet was not accepted. Someone who is honestly trying to find the truth, shouldn't be lying. This leads me to the conclusion that Roberto is not attempting to find the truth.


Oh wow, I see that Roberto Muehlenkamp actually reneged in two different ways on this bet. I hadn't realized that was the case.

What a weasel.


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