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Carto's Cutlass Supreme
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Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 1 decade 5 years ago (Sat Mar 05, 2005 4:17 pm)

Hey Barrington,

Wouldn't you say your last post should be a new topic? And if you got that from a website, why wouldn't you furnish the link to that website?

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Postby Bergmann » 1 decade 5 years ago (Sat Mar 05, 2005 7:15 pm)


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Postby comrade seinfeld » 1 decade 5 years ago (Mon Mar 07, 2005 9:36 pm)

Hannover wrote:Add to that list:

- Choice given to inmates of Auschwitz to stay & wait for the communists or retreat with the SS, thousands went with the SS; those left behind were not executed to prevent them from 'talking', they were all ages, many in perfect health

- Russian photos of healthy inmates of all ages at Auschwitz upon 'liberation'

- Jewish births at Auschwitz and other 'extermination camps'

- medical facilities at Auschwitz and other sites for Jews of all ages; but we're told they were gassed if they couldn't work

- so many so called 'survivors'

- no huge mass graves as alleged

- tons of inmates released from Auschwitz

- The fact that many countries now arrest & imprison anyone who scrutinizes the story as it is alleged, only lies need that behaviour ... afterall, what are they afraid of?

More later.

Hannover


As far as I can tell there is no evidence of any Jewish births at Auschwitz as claimed above. If there was concrete irrefutable evidence of such, then it would certainly by the last nail in the coffin of an alleged extermination program in regard to the Jews. In the past you have made the claim that there were Jewish births in Auschwitz, but you have never given a reference.

I would be inclined to think that it would not have been likely that there would be Jewish births, quite apart from the question of an alleged extermination program. Firstly, apart from the Theresienstadt Family Camp, the Jewish male and female inmates would surely be housed in separate barracks. Secondly, conditions were so bad for the female inmates in terms of food and such, surely they would all be like the anorexic women we see today, who are simply too undernourished to be able to carry a baby to term, or perhaps even able to conceive.

If you have a reference I would be certainly interested, but, in the past, there has not been a valid reference, which is not a reflection on you, but probably due to a misconception referring to non-Jewish women.

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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 5 years ago (Mon Mar 07, 2005 10:25 pm)

Sure, here's just a sample:
In January 1945, at least 602 women and children, including children born in Auschwitz, were sent to camps in Berlin in five transports.

http://www.warsawuprising.com/paper/aus ... htm?id=673

and:
Yarod got very emotional and asked if he was going to Auschwitz.
"I was born in Auschwitz," the shopkeeper told the soldier. "I was born in Auschwitz," he kept saying.

http://polish-jewish-heritage.org/Eng/J ... chwitz.htm


- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Postby comrade seinfeld » 1 decade 5 years ago (Tue Mar 08, 2005 12:49 am)

Hannover wrote:Sure, here's just a sample:
In January 1945, at least 602 women and children, including children born in Auschwitz, were sent to camps in Berlin in five transports.

htt
[p://www.warsawuprising.com/paper/auschwitz_museum.htm?id=673/quote]
and:
Yarod got very emotional and asked if he was going to Auschwitz.
"I was born in Auschwitz," the shopkeeper told the soldier. "I was born in Auschwitz," he kept saying.

http://polish-jewish-heritage.org/Eng/J ... chwitz.htm


- Hannover



No, the above is not right at all. The first reference is to Poles, and not Jews, which the issue of the "Holocaust" is about. The only Jews involved were those existing on Aryan papers. If there there were any babies born in Auschwitz they were Poles, according to the above link.
http://www.warsawuprising.com/paper/aus ... htm?id=673


The second reference makes it quite clear that the person concerned, Yarod, was well and truly alive before the German occupation of Poland. If the person concerned was born in Auschwitz, it must have been the township pre-war, before there was a concentration camp.


'The shopkeeper, Yeshayahu Yarod, said, "No, come back a few days later."

'Nornberg said he couldn't. "I'm going to Poland."

'Yarod got very emotional and asked if he was going to Auschwitz.

'"I was born in Auschwitz," the shopkeeper told the soldier. "I was born in Auschwitz," he kept saying.

'Nornberg was very confused, because he'd always assumed the old man was an old-time pioneer, a soldier in all of Israel's wars; but he realized that the man standing before him must have been born before the war.

'"Then [Yarod] told me that in a small town where he lived, on the eve of war, he was the witness to the gabai [services director] burying the Torahs. He went to draw a map."&'9;

'The old man - who was about the soldier's age when he'd witnessed the burial - had kept it a secret throughout the war, when his family was deported, he himself surviving several death camps, and immigration to Israel in 1950. The grocer never told, because he promised the gabai he wouldn't.'
http://polish-jewish-heritage.org/Eng/J ... chwitz.htm

It is clearly incidental to the issue of an extermination program at Auschwitz or elsewhere in relation to the Jews, whether Jewish babies were born in German camp hospitals, since, as I said in my previous post, the Jewish women were hardly in a position to sustain new-born babies.

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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 5 years ago (Tue Mar 08, 2005 1:27 am)

Sorry Comrade, no cigar:
A few weeks ago I appealed for any Holocaust Survivors to write to me as a Research Fellow in Holocaust Education at the Imperial War Museum London UK. This has resulted in a lady who was born in Auschwitz just before Liberation contacting me.
http://www.aish.com/components/feedback ... n=1&rpp=25


- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Postby Richard Perle » 1 decade 5 years ago (Tue Mar 08, 2005 10:20 am)

As far as I can tell there is no evidence of any Jewish births at Auschwitz as claimed above. If there was concrete irrefutable evidence of such, then it would certainly by the last nail in the coffin of an alleged extermination program in regard to the Jews.


Looks like Seinfeld has to seriously reconsider his beliefs.

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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 5 years ago (Tue Mar 08, 2005 1:38 pm)

So much for the 'policy of extermination. Here's a gem, those 'evil Nazis' allowed pregnant Jews to go to term.
I WAS BORN IN MAUTHAUSEN CONCENTRATION CAMP

By Eva Nathan Clarke

Daughter of Bernd Nathan and Anka Bergman

http://www.11tharmoreddivision.com/hist ... hausen.htm

and:
",,, 870 infants born in the Ravensbrück concentration camp, largely to Jewish and Gypsy women, between 1943 and 1945"
http://www.humanitas-international.org/ ... ildren.htm

but yet Jews claim Ravensbrück was a death camp:
"The conditions of life in Ravensbrück were as shameful and difficult as in all the other concentration camps--death by starvation, beating, torture, hanging, and shooting happened daily. The women who were too weak to work were transferred to be gassed at the Uckermark "Youth Camp" located nearby Ravensbruck or to Auschwitz. Others were killed by lethal injections or used for "medical" experiments by the SS doctors. Several SS companies surrounded the camp where the prisoners had to work day and night until they died by weakness and illness"
http://www.jewishgen.org/ForgottenCamps ... ckEng.html

and:
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 5 years ago (Tue Mar 08, 2005 2:08 pm)

Ahem, here's more:
Dr. Boas, born in the camp that housed Anne Frank, has gathered together the diaries of five teens who recorded their passage from child to adult during
http://www.trlib.org/teens-read-it-holocaust.asp

and

"Pregnant Women and Children Born in KL Auschwitz"
http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:37Aw ... aust&hl=en

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Postby Bergmann » 1 decade 5 years ago (Thu Mar 10, 2005 8:23 am)

comrade seinfeld wrote:As far as I can tell there is no evidence of any Jewish births at Auschwitz as claimed above. If there was concrete irrefutable evidence of such, then it would certainly by the last nail in the coffin of an alleged extermination program in regard to the Jews. In the past you have made the claim that there were Jewish births in Auschwitz, but you have never given a reference.

You may want to check out Danuta Czech's "The Auschwitz Chronicle" on Jewish babies born in Auschwitz.

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Postby comrade seinfeld » 1 decade 5 years ago (Thu Mar 10, 2005 8:27 pm)

Hannover wrote:Sorry Comrade, no cigar:
A few weeks ago I appealed for any Holocaust Survivors to write to me as a Research Fellow in Holocaust Education at the Imperial War Museum London UK. This has resulted in a lady who was born in Auschwitz just before Liberation contacting me.
http://www.aish.com/components/feedback ... n=1&rpp=25


- Hannover


Firstly, I am not interested in winning any "cigar", but simply finding out what is the truth about the "Holocaust", which everyone in this forum should be concerned about, irrespective of personal political agenda.

Secondly, I am not impressed by the above contribution by Hannover, as there are simply no details subject to confirmation available in regard to the above link. There is no indication that it concerns a Jew, which, as I said, the debate is all about (i.e., was there an extermination plan in relation to the Jews -- obviously there was no extermination plan in relation to the Slavs). (When the exterminationists talk about the "Holocaust", they do not exclude non-Jewish supposed victims, who are necessary to perform a supporting role.) Possibly this "chris. archbold" simply wants to emphasize that there were no Jewish births in Auschwitz (if that is the case), and that only non-Jews were born, especially since Hannover has provided a link to what is apparently a Zionist-exterminationist forum -- which is a good thing as we need to study the enemy!

There are other posts in this thread dealing with the question of whether Jews were born in Auschwitz, and, if necessary, I will reply to them as soon as possible.

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Postby comrade seinfeld » 1 decade 5 years ago (Thu Mar 10, 2005 10:12 pm)

Hannover wrote:So much for the 'policy of extermination. Here's a gem, those 'evil Nazis' allowed pregnant Jews to go to term.
I WAS BORN IN MAUTHAUSEN CONCENTRATION CAMP

By Eva Nathan Clarke

Daughter of Bernd Nathan and Anka Bergman

http://www.11tharmoreddivision.com/hist ... hausen.htm

and:
",,, 870 infants born in the Ravensbrück concentration camp, largely to Jewish and Gypsy women, between 1943 and 1945"
http://www.humanitas-international.org/ ... ildren.htm

but yet Jews claim Ravensbrück was a death camp:
"The conditions of life in Ravensbrück were as shameful and difficult as in all the other concentration camps--death by starvation, beating, torture, hanging, and shooting happened daily. The women who were too weak to work were transferred to be gassed at the Uckermark "Youth Camp" located nearby Ravensbruck or to Auschwitz. Others were killed by lethal injections or used for "medical" experiments by the SS doctors. Several SS companies surrounded the camp where the prisoners had to work day and night until they died by weakness and illness"
http://www.jewishgen.org/ForgottenCamps ... ckEng.html

and:


I am afraid that the above links provided by Hannover are all wrong.

http://www.11tharmoreddivision.com/hist ... hausen.htm
The baby Eva Nathan Clarke was born to her mother Anka Nathan Clarke right on arrival at Mauthausen, in the process of the Germans moving the concentration camp inmates around at the war's end. She was put in a hospital in the Russian section of the camp, and seven days later the camp was liberated by the Americans. This is obviously hardly indicative of any systematic policy of the Germans allowing Jews to breed in their concentration camps, especially since it was supposedly the case that towards the end of the war Himmler ordered an end to extermination.

http://www.humanitas-international.org/ ... ildren.htm
According to this link the children were simply killed after being born. I know it doesn't make sense, but that's what it says in Hannover's link!

http://www.jewishgen.org/ForgottenCamps ... ckEng.html
Well, if that is what the exterminationists say then we will just have to take them at their word!

http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/GE ... ration.htm
There is no indication that there were Jews involved, and even if there were it was, as I said before, in the period when supposedly the extermination program was terminated, so it not in any way indicative of what was the real systematic policy of the Germans in regard to allowing Jews to breed in their camps.

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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 5 years ago (Thu Mar 10, 2005 11:11 pm)

Well, comrade seinfeld seems content to deny Jewish sources of statements that demolish their own 'extermination' fantasies. It certainly has been hell for the judeo-supremacists to keep track of their stories and nothing better demonstrates this than their admissions of 'born in the camps'.

Regretfully, he ignores my Mauthausen point:
... those 'evil Nazis' allowed pregnant Jews to go to term.

The child WAS born in the camp, AND the Germans helped the woman into a hospital.

Then c. seinfeld admits they were born, but falls back 'they were killed' after being born, which makes zero sense. Why would the Germans who were supposedly 'exterminating' all those that couldn't work simply kill the pregnant mother? That's what the mythology states. Oops.

seinfeld states:
Well, if that is what the exterminationists say then we will just have to take them at their word!

Well gee, what kind of rebuttal is that? None, that's what. Looks like an admission in my favor.

Then seinfeld goes on to say about my link:
http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/GE ... ration.htm
There is no indication that there were Jews involved, and even if there were it was, as I said before, in the period when supposedly the extermination program was terminated, so it not in any way indicative of what was the real systematic policy of the Germans in regard to allowing Jews to breed in their camps.

While he ignores at the bottom of the text:
Image
Ahem.

And then the creme de la creme, he says:
... that towards the end of the war Himmler ordered an end to extermination.

He nor anyone else can produce this fictitious 'Himmler order'. I challenge him to produce it.

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 5 years ago (Fri Mar 11, 2005 1:26 am)

Take note of these which comrade seinfeld ignored, again:
Dr. Boas, born in the camp that housed Anne Frank, has gathered together the diaries of five teens who recorded their passage from child to adult during
http://www.trlib.org/teens-read-it-holocaust.asp

and from Yad Vashem:
"Pregnant Women and Children Born in KL Auschwitz"
http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:37Aw ... aust&hl=en

Oh well.

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Postby comrade seinfeld » 1 decade 5 years ago (Fri Mar 11, 2005 1:42 am)

Hannover wrote:Well, comrade seinfeld seems content to deny Jewish sources of statements that demolish their own 'extermination' fantasies. It certainly has been hell for the judeo-supremacists to keep track of their stories and nothing better demonstrates this than their admissions of 'born in the camps'.

Regretfully, he ignores my Mauthausen point:
... those 'evil Nazis' allowed pregnant Jews to go to term.

The child WAS born in the camp, AND the Germans helped the woman into a hospital.

Then c. seinfeld admits they were born, but falls back 'they were killed' after being born, which makes zero sense. Why would the Germans who were supposedly 'exterminating' all those that couldn't work simply kill the pregnant mother? That's what the mythology states. Oops.

seinfeld states:
Well, if that is what the exterminationists say then we will just have to take them at their word!

Well gee, what kind of rebuttal is that? None, that's what. Looks like an admission in my favor.

Then seinfeld goes on to say about my link:
http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/GE ... ration.htm
There is no indication that there were Jews involved, and even if there were it was, as I said before, in the period when supposedly the extermination program was terminated, so it not in any way indicative of what was the real systematic policy of the Germans in regard to allowing Jews to breed in their camps.

While he ignores at the bottom of the text:
Image
Ahem.

And then the creme de la creme, he says:
... that towards the end of the war Himmler ordered an end to extermination.

He nor anyone else can produce this fictitious 'Himmler order'. I challenge him to produce it.

- Hannover


It is my considered opinion that Hannover is not checking the actual links he is putting forward to see what is actually said, and is just copying from some list of what are, apparently, misleading links. I have made clear my opinion of his links in my previous posts in this thread, so that people can draw their own conclusion. I have yet to check other links concerning this subject of whether the Jews were allowed to breed in the German concentration camps, but, even if there was no extermination program concerning the Jews, I would presume that the Germans would be reluctant to encourage such a practice, since the point of concentrating able-bodied Jewish women was to use them as forced labour.

As far as the reference to the Himmler order stopping the alleged extermination program is concerned, then it is certainly a matter for debate whether there was such an order (which naturally presupposes there was an extermination program), which is what the exterminationists contend. But, if, as in the previous posts, an attempt is being made to undermine the exterminationist notion by implying that there were Jewish women in the alleged death camps actually giving birth to children, and allowed to nurture their babies, then, in the context of the exterminationist allegations, it would have to be relevant to the period prior to the alleged Himmler order. I don't think that is too hard to understand.

As Bergmann said:
"You may want to check out Danuta Czech's "The Auschwitz Chronicle" on Jewish babies born in Auschwitz." That sounds rather promising, and I think that I have come across reference to that in the past. I will indeed check it out, even if it means going to a university library. But I wonder if Bergmann could expand on his reference to some extent (e.g., chapters and page numbers), especially if it is possible to deal with it online -- which I will check out myself.


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