'The Auschwitz Debate' - tonight BBC4 (UK)

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Richard Perle
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'The Auschwitz Debate' - tonight BBC4 (UK)

Postby Richard Perle » 1 decade 5 years ago (Tue Feb 15, 2005 11:19 am)

I spied this in my TV guide. There is no mention of what it is but it's on BBC4 at 21:50 after the Auschwitz docudrama, repeated at 24:50.
Auschwitz Debate? It sounds like some kind of, well, debate with revisionists. You can be sure the revisionists will be the weakest and the nuttiest they can find.

Might be worth watching if you have access to the channel, even if just to get angry at how revisionists and their argument are represented.

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Postby Ajax » 1 decade 5 years ago (Tue Feb 15, 2005 11:25 am)

Hi Richard.

You are being a bit optimistic, aren't you? Any 'debate' on the 'holocaust' aired on the BBC will never feature a revisionist. Instead, we'll just have a panel of so-called 'experts' who will have slight disagreements but will always come together on the one big thing.

I am looking forward to seeing it, though.

/Ajax
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Postby Haldan » 1 decade 5 years ago (Tue Feb 15, 2005 11:30 am)

I don't have this channel, don't know if that's positive or not. I take 2 medications for blood pressure. If this is what I think it will be it would probably put my blood pressure up 50%.

If you want to control society, you have to control the media. The average citizen believes what he reads in his newspaper and what he sees on TV. For this reason, the overwhelming majority of the people in Western society accept the official holocaust story and reject revisionism - about which they know nothing, because the media invariably present the revisionist arguments in a grossly distorted way. For example, they mendaciously claim that the revisionists deny the persecution of the Jews or the existence of the concentration camps.

(How the revisionists are presented in the media By Jürgen Graf)


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<?php if ($Holocaust == false ) {deny_repeatedly(); } else { investigate(); } ?>
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Richard Perle
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Postby Richard Perle » 1 decade 5 years ago (Tue Feb 15, 2005 11:45 am)

Ajax wrote:Hi Richard.

You are being a bit optimistic, aren't you? Any 'debate' on the 'holocaust' aired on the BBC will never feature a revisionist. Instead, we'll just have a panel of so-called 'experts' who will have slight disagreements but will always come together on the one big thing.

I am looking forward to seeing it, though.

/Ajax


I don't think I was being too optimistic. My thoughts that they might drag out some lame revisionists to humiliate on TV isn't that unlikely. Just like Popular Mechanics misrepresented the 9/11 truth movement recently by dismantling some crazy theories that only nuts believe and claiming that the entire movement is based around those crzy ideas.

I'm not even slightly optimistic that they'd actually undo six weeks worth of docudrama indoctrination with a serious debate with competent revisionists as a finale.

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Postby theTRUTH » 1 decade 5 years ago (Tue Feb 15, 2005 12:01 pm)

Do US PBS stations carry the Auschwitz Debate this week?
Watch it in the UK and let us know what they say.
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Postby Turpitz » 1 decade 5 years ago (Tue Feb 15, 2005 12:30 pm)

Nice misleading title as usual from the journaille. It is very reminiscent of the recent swill about Auschwitz, there was only one viewpoint on that as well, or so I have been told and no real, informed revisionists were allowed to air a differing opinion.

I always thought that a single opinion, constantly repeated was the very definition of propaganda? Or maybe it doesn’t apply when one resides in a democracy?

And just to think, there are many people who actually pay money to be stupefied by this bile.

The very fact that no other opinions are ever allowed to see the light of day on the mass media, surely must speak volumes?

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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 5 years ago (Tue Feb 15, 2005 1:20 pm)

Richard Perle:
My thoughts that they might drag out some lame revisionists to humiliate on TV isn't that unlikely.

Reminds me of 'Revisionist' Charles Provan who Esquire did a story on. He was a nice guy, but pathetically ignorant of the facts.

Lacking an informed, actual Revisionist, the 'debate' could well be the usual "Revisionists say this ... "; false arguments which they then proceed to knock down, the proverbial strawman.

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If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Postby Ajax » 1 decade 5 years ago (Tue Feb 15, 2005 1:32 pm)

I'm standing with my prediction that they are going to fill the room with establishment experts; I think the idea of bringing in a weak revisionist is more of an American thing. They are more likely to condemn revisionists in absentia, which is for them a tried and tested tactic.

The tactic usually is to say offer something nebulous along the lines of "revisionists say the 'holocaust' never happened", without being so polite as to define what 'holocaust' actually means. As for the breaking down of the story into its component parts - forget it.

The day they invite someone like Rudolf or Mattogno into the studio will be the day I eat my proverbial hat; the establishment would never risk that.
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Postby Richard Perle » 1 decade 5 years ago (Tue Feb 15, 2005 1:33 pm)

When it comes to revisionism, it's strange how the media doesn't approach the big guns like they do with any other subject. I'm sure the most respected revisionists would jump at the chance to get their work into the mainstream.

Yes, I think you're right about the format they're likely to use.

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Postby simon1003 » 1 decade 5 years ago (Tue Feb 15, 2005 2:50 pm)

Here's the page for the BBC4 Auschwitz debate, I don't know any of the people taking part -

http://www.bbc.co.uk/bbcfour/features/a ... bate.shtml

But you can ask a question of the panel with an online form.

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Postby Ajax » 1 decade 5 years ago (Tue Feb 15, 2005 5:47 pm)

The 'debate' wasn't up to much - everyone agreed with the basic story and there was a minor sniffing around the minor issues, if that.

I knew most of the the panellists -

David Cesarani, aka "Ratface", university professor and former boss man of London's Wiener Library. Always pops up on the news when the 'holocaust' is covered. Jewish.

Eva Hoffman - author, writer of Lost in Translation. Jewish.

Peter Novick - probably the most 'controversial' of all the panellists; author of the books The Holocaust in American Life and The Holocaust and Collective Memory, which analysed the overplaying of the 'holocaust' in modern American society and media. He was attacked for a while by more orthodox folk, but was soon welcomed back into the fold when Norman Finkelstein took things a lot further and really got going. Jewish.

Lawrence Rees - the man behind the Auschwitz documentary. I don't think he's Jewish, but possible given the subject matter and the issues he has specialised in.

Reiner Luyken - a writer for the German left-leaning newspaper Die Zeit and the 'debate's' token non-Jew. One of those Germans who, despite being born after the war, feels wholly responsible for the 'holocaust' and sees it as 'dangerous' that 72% of Germans today believe that they are not responsible for the sins, perceived or otherwise, of their fathers and grandfathers.

The host was David Aaronvitch - writer, media critic and columnist. Jewish.
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Postby Richard Perle » 1 decade 5 years ago (Tue Feb 15, 2005 6:10 pm)

Yep. Garbage.

All they really debated was whether the holocaust was unique or relevant today. I kept watching to see if they mentioned revisonism at all, which they didn't. I'm suprised they didn't talk about the evil nature of us deniers.

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Postby Ajax » 1 decade 5 years ago (Tue Feb 15, 2005 6:28 pm)

Richard Perle wrote:I'm suprised they didn't talk about the evil nature of us deniers.


Me too - I was sort of expecting this after the documentary itself ended on a note that mentioned those who 'deny' the 'holocaust'.
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Postby simon1003 » 1 decade 5 years ago (Wed Feb 16, 2005 4:38 am)

David Cesarani isn't much of a historian, at one point he spoke about how the holocaust was absolutely unique and that no other genocide had come close.

In doing this he pissed on the graves of between 6 and 10 million Ukrainians who were starved to death in a famine man-made by Stalin and his NKVD a full ten years before the alleged holocaust.

It was also interesting to note that Novick quoted the six million figure again, they just can't help themseleves can they?

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Postby Ted » 1 decade 5 years ago (Wed Feb 16, 2005 8:06 am)

Anyone that missed the program can watch it here.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/mediaselector/chec ... =1&bbram=1


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