Mainstream revisionism

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simon1003
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Mainstream revisionism

Postby simon1003 » 1 decade 5 years ago (Wed Feb 16, 2005 4:44 pm)

Does it exist now? I don't think so.

If not, how long until a revisionist work gets into any bestseller chart?

I wouldn't hold my breath for at least 10 years.

This forum does an admirable job, and I would like to think that it can't be long before Mattogno or Rudolf get invites to live debates, but realistically is it going to happen?

The media of the world (with a few small exceptions) is against revisionism.

I'm sure I'm not alone when I wonder how long free speech on the internet, such as on this forum will last.

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Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 1 decade 5 years ago (Thu Feb 17, 2005 1:08 am)

Maybe that's where you come in. You could buy a DV camera, get imovie, make a little video about why you don't believe in the holocaust, burn it to a CD or DVD, and send it to key people. Warning: That's what Zundel did and he's in jail.

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Postby Richard Perle » 1 decade 5 years ago (Thu Feb 17, 2005 11:29 am)

Has anyone ever tried talking to the anti-zionist Jewish groups about revisionism? I wonder how they('d) take it. If anyone has a chance of getting the word out it is Jews themselves. I imagine they might be resistent to revisionism but in the end it would be in their interest to embrace it.

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Postby TMoran » 1 decade 5 years ago (Thu Feb 17, 2005 2:31 pm)

Richard Perle:
Has anyone ever tried talking to the anti-zionist Jewish groups about revisionism? I wonder how they('d) take it. If anyone has a chance of getting the word out it is Jews themselves. I imagine they might be resistent to revisionism but in the end it would be in their interest to embrace it.


There are no real anti-Zionist Jewish groups. Only some that feign such a thing, like Peace Now or Tikkun Magazine. I have met or know plenty of Jews who pretend to be for Palestinian rights but you mention the Holocaust and they almost have a nervous breakdown. Since the Holocaust has been so utterly spewed on the world and the 'facts' are so sourced to Jews that the Holocaust lie is an idictment of Jewishness itself.

If it got out and accepted that the Holocaust is a lie it would mean the end of Jewishness as we know it.

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Postby Richard Perle » 1 decade 5 years ago (Thu Feb 17, 2005 3:23 pm)

The main anti-zionist Jewish groups appear genuine to me, even though they are mostly against zionism for religious reasons.

http://www.jewsagainstzionism.com/
http://www.jewsnotzionists.org/
http://www.nkusa.org/

The first two sites there have holocaust sections where they are critical of zionist leaders during the war.

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Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 1 decade 5 years ago (Thu Feb 17, 2005 4:11 pm)

At the moment that revisionism is seen as possibly entering the mainstream, it will be co-opted by Jews. If it finally hits the front page of the paper, the main quoted source won't be Mark Weber, it will be some new-to-the-scene Jewish scholar.

If it hits mainstream, there will be all sorts of surprises and cooptations, and explanations given, presented by new "authorities on the subject" faces.

When the anti-war in Iraq movement got big, and the website called Indymedia got big along with it, suddenly there was the Guerrilla News Network, which were Jews coopting that movement (founder Josh Shore for instance) Their website made the reader feel like they were in the underground left. Funny how the website never mentioned a thing on Palestine though, and had lots of articles on leftist Jewish intellectuals.

On the other side of the spectrum, the conservative right was coopted by radio talk show host Michael Savage, who changed the conservative right to pro-Israel and anti-Arab. Savage is a Jew whose real name is Michael Weiner.

Savage Nation official site:
http://www.homestead.com/prosites-prs/index.html

A site critical of Savage:
http://www.michaelsavagesucks.com/default.asp

Guerrilla News Network:
http://www.gnn.tv

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Postby Richard Perle » 1 decade 5 years ago (Thu Feb 17, 2005 5:50 pm)

GNN has been around since long before the Iraq war. I used to post to their forum before the site got 'updated' and had been since 2000, or 2001 at the latest. I can't recall whether they've dodged Palestinian issues in their main content. There was always a lot about that subject on the forums with only one prominent pro-Israel shill taking the zionist side.
There are a lot of Jewish anti-neocon anti-war writers out there who I respect.

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Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 1 decade 5 years ago (Thu Feb 17, 2005 7:07 pm)

Hi Richard Perle,

That's interesting. Because I know that the Pro-Zionist poster you're talking about was called "IsraelForever"! I remember him too.

GNN was around before the Iraq war, but the Iraq war was a long time in the making, and I'm sure indymedia came around way before them. I believe GNN largely copied and coopted indymedia, and then became the organization that got all the media attention. Shore was definitely Jewish, and Lappe probably was, but they kept it secret. The third founder was from Haiti.

I did a study some years ago. I started on May 16, 2004 in their archive, and went back to Apr. 22, 2003. I came up with the following:

Guerrilla News Network had a total of 318 articles in it's archive for a period of over a year. (from April 22, 2003, to May 16, 2004). Of these, there were only 4 articles on Israel/Palestine. (1)

That is one article for every 3 months. The last time an article appeared on Israel/Palestine was back in early March. Since December, there's been 2 articles. Consider also, that the majority of the 318 articles in the archive are on the mideast. That's a bit odd isn't it?


Meanwhile indymedia would have something about Palestine on their main page most every day.

This is applicable to holocaust revisionism in that it's likely something similar would happen if revisionism got big.

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Postby Richard Perle » 1 decade 5 years ago (Thu Feb 17, 2005 7:46 pm)

Yes, "Israelforever" was the guy.

I really don't think GNN copied indymedia. They have always had their own unique style with the leftist underground pretentions and the rather odd penchant for mixing hip hop into things. The articles they feature are the usual ones associated with the left, but they have had many exclusives. The lack of Palestinian articles is odd, though, and I hadn't noticed it. I assumed they had the same anti-zionist stance that most left-leaning websites have.

Anyway, back to the holocaust, you're probably right about revisionism and the mainstream. I only fear that even if the holocaust is exposed - perhaps 10 years down the line - then nothing really will change. I honestly don't see peoples attitudes towards Israel and negative Jewish influences changing. There'll probably be a limited hangout where the industry will say, "OK, there weren't gassings, but many Jews were shot and we were persecuted". The shootings being much harder to debunk, if they even should be. (I'm not talking about the massive shootings like Riga but smaller reports)
I don't see it suddenly being OK to point out organized negative Jewish influence on US foreign policy, for example; and people won't suddenly shed their reluctance to point the finger at Jews.
To completely undo the harm would involve measures approaching those taken by Nazi Germany in it's early days. That would be impossible in today's climate even without the holocaust smokescreen.

That's how I see it.

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Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 1 decade 5 years ago (Thu Feb 17, 2005 9:03 pm)

Yes, Israelforever. That's a one in a million that we both remember that guy!

I think revisionism getting into the mainstream would greatly raise everyone's consciousness on so many levels. Like these:

•People would realize that governments lie and make their own conception of history. Right down to what you think is objective reality, like Encyclopedia Britannica.

•That things aren't patently good and evil, it's quite possible to understand the Germans, and everyone else, and why they do the things they do.

•That Germans don't have to feel guilt, that Jews don't have to feel paranoia, and Americans don't have to any longer delude themselves into thinking they're God's chosen force of the world to make things right. Regarding WWII they certainly feel that way.

•Jews can collectively move away from a group evolutionary strategy based on deceit, and don't have to raise their kids with a paranoid and fearful worldview that promotes that evolutionary strategy.

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Postby TMoran » 1 decade 5 years ago (Fri Feb 18, 2005 6:58 am)

Carto's Cutlass:
At the moment that revisionism is seen as possibly entering the mainstream, it will be co-opted by Jews. If it finally hits the front page of the paper, the main quoted source won't be Mark Weber, it will be some new-to-the-scene Jewish scholar.

If it hits mainstream, there will be all sorts of surprises and cooptations, and explanations given, presented by new "authorities on the subject" faces.


That's a fact. That is and will be one of their tricks. To come out and make it look like they are the ones who have been bringing it all on. Of course they will have all the access they want to spread the lie. And, and, most likely the people will fall for it. The one thing revisionists have is the history of the likes of main stream Jewish orgs. like the ADL and the myriad of the rest.

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Postby Richard Perle » 1 decade 5 years ago (Sun Mar 06, 2005 7:59 pm)

I find it interesting that Jews Against Zionism has given it's full support to Jeff Rense because of the many anti-zionism articles he features.

http://www.rense.com/general54/thank.htm

I don't recall whether rense was posting revisionist articles at the time of this 'thankyou note', but he has been at it full swing in recent months. I realise that at least one member of this board expressed dismay at what rense might do to harm revisionism by associating it with his other topics. My point for posting this is that maybe this shows that the anti-zionism Jews could be open to revisionism. They aren't exactly well known, but the way I see it, Jews have the best chance of exposing the holocaust fraud.


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