Bellinger's Himmler book / the Bellinger-Irving connection

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Hannover
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Re: Bellinger's Himmler book / the Bellinger-Irving connecti

Postby Hannover » 4 years 1 month ago (Tue May 05, 2015 8:20 am)

NLH:
English edition?
None that I know of. Of course, there are many who do not want that to occur.
And Joe being deceased doesn't help.
see:
http://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=8449

Thanks, Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Re: Bellinger's Himmler book / the Bellinger-Irving connecti

Postby NLH » 4 years 1 month ago (Tue May 05, 2015 8:55 am)

Hannover wrote:NLH:
English edition?
None that I know of. Of course, there are many who do not want that to occur.
And Joe being deceased doesn't help.
Revisionist scholar Joseph Bellinger has passed

Thanks, Hannover


Thanks Hannover, I didn't realise that, and sorry to hear it. Is their any way anyone else, like Barnes may consider publishing, or does Irving own the rights so that will never happen?

Also, apologies, I added some Irving quotes to my original comment after you replied. I didn't realise.
"Believe me, I came into Auschwitz in a much worse condition than I actually left it."
- Kitty Hart-Moxon, Jewish Holocaust Survivor.

June 1998 testimony, USC Shoah Foundation, Visual History Archive.
Part 2 - YouTube - 1:21:42

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Re: Bellinger's Himmler book / the Bellinger-Irving connecti

Postby Werd » 4 years 1 month ago (Tue May 05, 2015 9:31 am)

The German publishing house that put out Bellinger's book in 2005 was named Arndt Verlag.

https://openlibrary.org/publishers/Arndt_Verlag
Arndt Verlag Publisher - 10 works / 0 ebooks published between 2001 & 2003.


I don't even know if this publisher exists anymore. So if they went down, what happened to the rights of the German edition? Who has them since apparently, nobody ever was sued by Irving over this German language edition? That would seem to indicate Irving has no grounds to claim this German manuscript that was published by a now defunct publishing house as his property.

I would suggest that if an English edition ever did come out, it should have this Bellinger article as an appendix.

The Forgery of a Forgery
The Case of the Feckless Forger
By Joseph P. Bellinger
Published: 2009-02-07
http://codoh.com/library/document/702/

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Re: Bellinger's Himmler book / the Bellinger-Irving connecti

Postby k0nsl » 4 years 1 month ago (Tue May 05, 2015 12:00 pm)

Try contacting them at this e-mail address:
ARNDT01_k0nsl.png
ARNDT
ARNDT01_k0nsl.png (9.57 KiB) Viewed 2716 times


See also their website:

http://www.arndtverlag.de/homepages/himmlers-tod/biographie.htm

-k0nsl

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Re: Bellinger's Himmler book / the Bellinger-Irving connecti

Postby Werd » 4 years 1 month ago (Tue May 05, 2015 1:16 pm)

I see you contacted them. I take it you are asking them about publishing rights and whether or not Irving could or could not stop Barnes from publishing if they wanted to. Would I be correct?

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Re: Bellinger's Himmler book / the Bellinger-Irving connecti

Postby NLH » 4 years 1 month ago (Tue May 05, 2015 1:20 pm)

Thank you k0nsl, I have emailed them. I suggest others do to to show the interest and need for this book to be published in English.
"Believe me, I came into Auschwitz in a much worse condition than I actually left it."
- Kitty Hart-Moxon, Jewish Holocaust Survivor.

June 1998 testimony, USC Shoah Foundation, Visual History Archive.
Part 2 - YouTube - 1:21:42

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Re: Bellinger's Himmler book / the Bellinger-Irving connecti

Postby Marcy Fleming » 4 years 1 month ago (Tue May 05, 2015 1:32 pm)

Based on past Irving work and these new revelations I think it's reasonable for all revisionists to totally ignore David Irving in the future. Why waste your valuable time beating a dead horse. The man was never a holocaust revisionist or really any other kind of revisionist as far as I can tell from reading eight of his books. The Churchill Legend by Francis Neilson (1954) had more valuable debunking of Churchill than Irving's two massive volumes on same subject. Irving appears to write for the money, that's ok in a capitalistic society, but why should I give him any special credit as an allegedly revisionist historian ?
I distrust him as I do his US ally, Mark Weber, at IHR. I do read IHR occasionally for new pieces of interest but for the life of me I can't see what they accomplish for revisionism other than listing a few worthwhile links like CODOH as well as many dubious ones like antiwar.com.
If people with a reasonable argument disagree with me I'm always willing to entertain it.

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Re: Bellinger's Himmler book / the Bellinger-Irving connecti

Postby Werd » 4 years 1 month ago (Tue May 05, 2015 8:49 pm)

http://www.fpp.co.uk/Himmler/index.html

His legal battles mostly behind him, David Irving has resumed work on Heinrich Himmler: 2,000 pages of handwritten draft already -- including right, in an original Vienna prison ring-binder.

Image

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Re: Bellinger's Himmler book / the Bellinger-Irving connecti

Postby Inquisitor » 4 years 1 month ago (Thu May 07, 2015 4:26 am)

Marcy Fleming wrote:Based on past Irving work and these new revelations I think it's reasonable for all revisionists to totally ignore David Irving in the future. Why waste your valuable time beating a dead horse. The man was never a holocaust revisionist or really any other kind of revisionist as far as I can tell from reading eight of his books. The Churchill Legend by Francis Neilson (1954) had more valuable debunking of Churchill than Irving's two massive volumes on same subject. Irving appears to write for the money, that's ok in a capitalistic society, but why should I give him any special credit as an allegedly revisionist historian ?
I distrust him as I do his US ally, Mark Weber, at IHR. I do read IHR occasionally for new pieces of interest but for the life of me I can't see what they accomplish for revisionism other than listing a few worthwhile links like CODOH as well as many dubious ones like antiwar.com.
If people with a reasonable argument disagree with me I'm always willing to entertain it.


I am of the same opinion. I have little use for the opinions of those who continue to either ignore or thumb their noses as legitimate Revisionist scholars and works. Both Irving and Weber make those vague "well its true that this part of the story is false, but that part must certainly be true, and millions did die...," type claims, but offer no tangible, physical evidence to support these assertions, and instead point to questionable documents and claims by individuals only, etc. Anyone can SAY anything(actually or allegedly), but without evidence...why should we believe such claims at all?

I've been at this too long and studied too hard and too much, to listen to those who only seem to want to discuss half the story, or ignore abundant evidence that puts their claims in very serious doubt, to say the least.

Like you said - why waste your time?

________

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Re: Bellinger's Himmler book / the Bellinger-Irving connecti

Postby NLH » 3 years 6 months ago (Tue Dec 08, 2015 12:18 am)

NLH wrote:Thank you k0nsl, I have emailed them. I suggest others do to to show the interest and need for this book to be published in English.


I never did get a response. Anyone else? If not, can others try?
"Believe me, I came into Auschwitz in a much worse condition than I actually left it."
- Kitty Hart-Moxon, Jewish Holocaust Survivor.

June 1998 testimony, USC Shoah Foundation, Visual History Archive.
Part 2 - YouTube - 1:21:42

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Re: Bellinger's Himmler book / the Bellinger-Irving connection

Postby Werd » 3 years 6 months ago (Tue Dec 08, 2015 2:07 am)

Well the only person I could think of to translate a German copy would be Carlos Porter. Why? Because he managed to get CRIMES AGAINST THE WERMACHT translated into English a few years ago. But there was a problem.
[Note: I was paid to translate this about 5 or 6 years ago, but the operation went bust, one of the organizers went to jail, and the translation got lost.
So here it is, warts and all.

http://www.cwporter.com/seidl1.htm

I think he is talking about Theses and Dissertations Press and Germar Rudolf. T and D couldn't put it out like it was promised in the back of other holocaust handbooks when T and D were putting them out before Barnes. Lulu.com has put out many Porter books in the last few years and many anti Zionist works. Lulu would surely put out a book on Himmler's murder given their propensity to publish revisionist titles. The only issue would be paying him to get it done.

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Re: Bellinger's Himmler book / the Bellinger-Irving connection

Postby NLH » 3 years 6 months ago (Wed Dec 09, 2015 1:45 pm)

I have Mr. Porter looking into this aswell now. A question, where is the manuscript? Does Irving still have it? We have tried contacting Arndt, the publishers, but nothing yet. Maybe they still have it?

Does anyone have a copy of the book in German that they might send Mr. Porter if he agrees to do it?

I might see what Irving says, but if anyone can help that would be great.
"Believe me, I came into Auschwitz in a much worse condition than I actually left it."
- Kitty Hart-Moxon, Jewish Holocaust Survivor.

June 1998 testimony, USC Shoah Foundation, Visual History Archive.
Part 2 - YouTube - 1:21:42

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Re: Bellinger's Himmler book / the Bellinger-Irving connection

Postby Werd » 3 years 6 months ago (Thu Dec 10, 2015 1:23 am)

NLH.

Nice going on getting Porter to look into this. It would be great to find anyone in that company that could settle copyright issues and get an English translation going. Just get a German book and rework the typeset for English readers.

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Re: Bellinger's Himmler book / the Bellinger-Irving connection

Postby NLH » 3 years 6 months ago (Thu Dec 10, 2015 3:55 am)

I did ask who owns the copyright, where the manuscript is, whether it was possible to translate it into English, amongst other things, and this was his response.

My question is, knowing he cannot read German, and how Irving is (or says he is) with regards to sources and documentation, then why employ him to do this? And why not answer my very specific questions? And he did say over $11,000 in earlier comments in this thread.

I worked with Bellinger in the 1990s. I paid him $10,000 to write the book. He does not read German and cannot research or, it turns out, write. I have have never read more than the first chapter or two. Arndt Verlag did a deal within, more than that I will not say.

My own work on Himmler is fast approaching completion, but it is far too long and needs cutting.

David Irving
Croy, Inverness (UK), Thursday, 10 December 2015
"Believe me, I came into Auschwitz in a much worse condition than I actually left it."
- Kitty Hart-Moxon, Jewish Holocaust Survivor.

June 1998 testimony, USC Shoah Foundation, Visual History Archive.
Part 2 - YouTube - 1:21:42

Werd
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Re: Bellinger's Himmler book / the Bellinger-Irving connection

Postby Werd » 3 years 6 months ago (Thu Dec 10, 2015 4:20 am)

I don't trust what Irving says about Bellinger. Bellinger can't read German? So how the hell did his book end up in German if he does not know it? That would mean someone took an English manuscript and put it into German, correct? So then where is this manuscript? As for employing someone to translate a German version of Bellinger's book if that is all there is, Bellinger can not do it. He passed away. I am insinuating Carlos Porter should be the one to translate the German book into English if that is what needs to be done.


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