Is this the first mention of a homicidal gassing?

Read and post various viewpoints or search our large archives.

Moderator: Moderator

Forum rules
Be sure to read the Rules/guidelines before you post!
User avatar
Hotzenplotz
Valued contributor
Valued contributor
Posts: 148
Joined: Tue Apr 26, 2005 1:09 pm

Is this the first mention of a homicidal gassing?

Postby Hotzenplotz » 1 decade 5 years ago (Tue Aug 16, 2005 1:25 pm)

During WWII, German author Thomas Mann addressed each month the German people via BBC. This is an excerpt from his broadcast from January, 1942, only 4 months after the first alleged gassing (in September '41).

Thomas Mann wrote:Deutsche Höhrer!
Die Nachricht klingt unglaubwürdig, aber meine Quelle ist gut. In zahlreichen holländisch-jüdischen Familien, so wurde ich unterrichtet, in Amsterdam und andern Städten, herrscht tiefe Trauer um Söhne, die eines schaurigen Todes gestorben sind. Vierhundert junge holländische Juden sind nach Deutshcland gebracht worden, um als Versuchsobjekte für Giftgas zu dienen. Die Virulenz dieses ritterlichen und durch und durch deutschen Kriegsmittels, einer wahren Siegfried-Waffe, hat sich an den jungen Untermenschen bewährt. Sie sind tot, - gestorben für die 'neue Ordnung' und die Kriegsingeniosität der Herrenrasse. Eben dafür waren sie allenfalls gut genug. Es waren ja Juden.
Ich sagte: Die Geschichte klingt unglaubwürdig, und überall in der Welt werden viele sich sperren, sie zu glauben. Starke Reste jener Glaubensunwilligkeit, unter der wir Deutschlandflüchtlinge all diese Jahre her so bitter gelitten haben: der Unwilligkeit, an die wahre Natur des Nationalsozialismus zu glauben, die für menschenumöglich zu halten, sind selbst heute noch überall vorhanden: Die Neigung - um nicht zu sagen: Die Tendenz, solche Geschichten als Greuelmärchen anzusehen, bleibt zum Vorteil des Feindes weit verbreitet. Sie sind aber keine bloßen Geschichten: sie sind Geschichte. [...]


"German Listeners!
The message sounds spurious, but my source is a good one. In numerous Dutch Jewish families, in Amsterdam and other cities, as I have been told, there is great sorrow for sons who have died a horrible death. Four hundred young Dutch Jews have been transported to Germany to serve as test objects for poison gas. The virulency of this chivalrous and thorougly German means of war, a true Siegfried-weapon [Siegfried is a German mythological hero -H], has stood the test with the young sub-humans. They are dead, - gone for the 'new order' and the brilliancy in warfare of the master race. Just for this they were good enough. After all, they were Jews.
I said: the story sounds spurious, and everywhere in the world many will refuse to believe it. Strong remnants of this unwillingness to believe which for so many years made us fugitives from Germany suffer bitterly: the unwillingness to believe in the true nature of national socialism, to think it possible for humans, are even today prevalent everywhere: the disposition - not to say: the tendency to consider such stories atrocity fairy tales, remains common - to the advantage of the enemy. But they are not mere stories: they are history [...] "

I have retained the peculiar sentence structure of the original maybe it sounds a bit funny in English. I refrained from adding ironic comments where he speaks of the story sounding spurious...

Edit: sexed-up translation ;-)
Last edited by Hotzenplotz on Wed Aug 17, 2005 11:21 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Hannover
Valuable asset
Valuable asset
Posts: 10182
Joined: Sun Nov 24, 2002 7:53 pm

Postby Hannover » 1 decade 5 years ago (Tue Aug 16, 2005 2:01 pm)

As far as I know that is the first of the false WWII claims.
Spurious indeed.

We should remember that the London Daily Telegraph in March, 1916, claimed that 700,000 Serbians had been 'gassed', and that as early as 1919 the '6,000,000 Jews' was introduced:
http://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?t=586

see:
http://vho.org/GB/Books/HHS.html
'Don Heddesheimer, The First Holocaust. Jewish Fund Raising Campaigns With Holocaust Claims During And After World War One'

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

widukind
Member
Member
Posts: 24
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2003 5:32 am

Postby widukind » 1 decade 5 years ago (Tue Aug 16, 2005 2:30 pm)

In the preface to the book Dissecting the Holocaust, Faurisson mentions the rumors of a gassing as early as December 1941.

The earliest rumors of a gassing of Jews by the Germans apparently circulated in December of 1941 in the Warsaw ghetto.[1] (...)

[1] "Stockholm, Dec. 21 (JTA). - More than 1,000 victims of spotted fever in the densely crowded Warsaw ghetto have been put to death by gas [...], it is learned today from reliable sources" (The Jewish Telegraphic Agency Bulletin, December 22, 1941, p. 1).


Source : Dissecting the Holocaust, The Growing Critique of 'Truth' and 'Memory', 2003

widukind

User avatar
Hannover
Valuable asset
Valuable asset
Posts: 10182
Joined: Sun Nov 24, 2002 7:53 pm

Postby Hannover » 1 decade 5 years ago (Tue Aug 16, 2005 6:35 pm)

Thanks, widukind.

Take note that the Thomas Mann bit is curiously only one month after the alleged Warsaw rumours.

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

User avatar
Hotzenplotz
Valued contributor
Valued contributor
Posts: 148
Joined: Tue Apr 26, 2005 1:09 pm

Postby Hotzenplotz » 1 decade 5 years ago (Wed Aug 17, 2005 11:53 am)

I have added some more of Thomas Mann´s speeches to the German forum.
http://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?t=2387

Especially the January 1945 speech is interesting since Mann tells us about the "death factories" that had been discovered by the Red Army, but virtually every single piece of information is wrong according to the standard story. (chlorine gas, death books with 715,000 entries in Maidanek, bone powder used to fertilize German soil, nice story, isn´t it?)

Maybe I´m going to translate the crucial part another time.

User avatar
Hannover
Valuable asset
Valuable asset
Posts: 10182
Joined: Sun Nov 24, 2002 7:53 pm

Postby Hannover » 1 decade 5 years ago (Wed Aug 17, 2005 12:13 pm)

Revealing about Mann, he's cluelessly repeating the judeo-Bolshevik propaganda.

Ofcourse if you question the chlorine chambers and fertilizer nonsense you go to jail in much of today's Europe, Australia, & Canada

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

User avatar
Hektor
Valuable asset
Valuable asset
Posts: 3621
Joined: Sun Jun 25, 2006 7:59 am

Re: Is this the first mention of a homicidal gassing?

Postby Hektor » 6 years 5 months ago (Fri Jun 13, 2014 8:24 am)

Hotzenplotz wrote:During WWII, German author Thomas Mann addressed each month the German people via BBC. This is an excerpt from his broadcast from January, 1942, only 4 months after the first alleged gassing (in September '41).

Thomas Mann wrote:Deutsche Höhrer!
Die Nachricht klingt unglaubwürdig, aber meine Quelle ist gut. In zahlreichen holländisch-jüdischen Familien, so wurde ich unterrichtet, in Amsterdam und andern Städten, herrscht tiefe Trauer um Söhne, die eines schaurigen Todes gestorben sind. Vierhundert junge holländische Juden sind nach Deutshcland gebracht worden, um als Versuchsobjekte für Giftgas zu dienen. Die Virulenz dieses ritterlichen und durch und durch deutschen Kriegsmittels, einer wahren Siegfried-Waffe, hat sich an den jungen Untermenschen bewährt. Sie sind tot, - gestorben für die 'neue Ordnung' und die Kriegsingeniosität der Herrenrasse. Eben dafür waren sie allenfalls gut genug. Es waren ja Juden.
Ich sagte: Die Geschichte klingt unglaubwürdig, und überall in der Welt werden viele sich sperren, sie zu glauben. Starke Reste jener Glaubensunwilligkeit, unter der wir Deutschlandflüchtlinge all diese Jahre her so bitter gelitten haben: der Unwilligkeit, an die wahre Natur des Nationalsozialismus zu glauben, die für menschenumöglich zu halten, sind selbst heute noch überall vorhanden: Die Neigung - um nicht zu sagen: Die Tendenz, solche Geschichten als Greuelmärchen anzusehen, bleibt zum Vorteil des Feindes weit verbreitet. Sie sind aber keine bloßen Geschichten: sie sind Geschichte. [...]


"German Listeners!
The message sounds spurious, but my source is a good one. In numerous Dutch Jewish families, in Amsterdam and other cities, as I have been told, there is great sorrow for sons who have died a horrible death. Four hundred young Dutch Jews have been transported to Germany to serve as test objects for poison gas. The virulency of this chivalrous and thorougly German means of war, a true Siegfried-weapon [Siegfried is a German mythological hero -H], has stood the test with the young sub-humans. They are dead, - gone for the 'new order' and the brilliancy in warfare of the master race. Just for this they were good enough. After all, they were Jews.
I said: the story sounds spurious, and everywhere in the world many will refuse to believe it. Strong remnants of this unwillingness to believe which for so many years made us fugitives from Germany suffer bitterly: the unwillingness to believe in the true nature of national socialism, to think it possible for humans, are even today prevalent everywhere: the disposition - not to say: the tendency to consider such stories atrocity fairy tales, remains common - to the advantage of the enemy. But they are not mere stories: they are history [...] "

I have retained the peculiar sentence structure of the original maybe it sounds a bit funny in English. I refrained from adding ironic comments where he speaks of the story sounding spurious...

Edit: sexed-up translation ;-)
Could be, is that somewhere available on audio?
I only got the 1941 mentioning of gassings.... of injured soldiers.

User avatar
hermod
Valuable asset
Valuable asset
Posts: 2076
Joined: Sun Feb 03, 2013 10:52 am

Re: Is this the first mention of a homicidal gassing?

Postby hermod » 6 years 5 months ago (Fri Jun 13, 2014 9:41 am)

As Hannover said, there was gassing atrocity propaganda during WW1. And it's now said that Napoleon gassed up to 100,000 rebellious Black slaves in sailing gas chambers with sulfur dioxide in the 1800s. The 'information' came from a French Black historian campaigning for "reparations" and commemorations of slave trade in France (http://www.claude-ribbe.com/).

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... laims.html

http://vnnforum.com/showthread.php?t=158560

About Thomas Mann, does that matter his wife was Jewish and he was a deeply anti-Nazi bisexual writer campaigning against the NSDAP even before the Nazis were in power (see his 1930 public address "An Appeal to Reason" in Berlin & numerous subsequent anti-Nazi essays and lectures)? Could an ounce of impartiality and reliable information about the Nazis be expected from such a man? Or weren't any defamatory tricks harmful to his Nazi enemies the only thing to be expected from him?

More about Thomas Mann's broadcasted anti-Nazi atrocity propaganda here: http://revblog.codoh.com/2010/08/thomas ... legations/
"But, however the world pretends to divide itself, there are ony two divisions in the world to-day - human beings and Germans. – Rudyard Kipling, The Morning Post (London), June 22, 1915

User avatar
hermod
Valuable asset
Valuable asset
Posts: 2076
Joined: Sun Feb 03, 2013 10:52 am

Re:

Postby hermod » 6 years 5 months ago (Fri Jun 13, 2014 9:57 am)

widukind wrote:In the preface to the book Dissecting the Holocaust, Faurisson mentions the rumors of a gassing as early as December 1941.

The earliest rumors of a gassing of Jews by the Germans apparently circulated in December of 1941 in the Warsaw ghetto.[1] (...)

[1] "Stockholm, Dec. 21 (JTA). - More than 1,000 victims of spotted fever in the densely crowded Warsaw ghetto have been put to death by gas [...], it is learned today from reliable sources" (The Jewish Telegraphic Agency Bulletin, December 22, 1941, p. 1).


Source : Dissecting the Holocaust, The Growing Critique of 'Truth' and 'Memory', 2003


You can find it here: http://www.jta.org/1941/12/22/archive/1 ... d-by-nazis
"But, however the world pretends to divide itself, there are ony two divisions in the world to-day - human beings and Germans. – Rudyard Kipling, The Morning Post (London), June 22, 1915

User avatar
hermod
Valuable asset
Valuable asset
Posts: 2076
Joined: Sun Feb 03, 2013 10:52 am

Re: Is this the first mention of a homicidal gassing?

Postby hermod » 6 years 5 months ago (Thu Jun 19, 2014 3:52 am)

Just found this.

October 1941: even earlier 'report' of an experimental gassing a Auschwitz

The first reference to the initial gassing at Auschwitz is found in a note of October 24, 1941:

"At Oswiecim (Auschwitz), at the beginning of October, 850 Russian officers and non-commissioned officers (prisoners of war) who were brought there have been subjected to die by gas in order to experiment with a new type of war gas that is to be used on the Eastern Front [jako probe nowego typu gazu bojowego, ktory ma byc uzyty na froncie wschodnim]."[3]

Until the middle of 1942, in the sources, the account of the first gassing does not appear to fall under a systematic extermination plan, but constitutes a simple scientific experiment among many others.



3. Zeszyty oswiecimskie. Numer specjalny (1). Wydawnictwo Panstwowego Muzeum w Oswiecimiu, 1968, p.11.

http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v09/v09p193_Mattogno.html


No way it could be Zyklon B as hydrogen cyanide is far too volatile to be used as a "war gas".
"But, however the world pretends to divide itself, there are ony two divisions in the world to-day - human beings and Germans. – Rudyard Kipling, The Morning Post (London), June 22, 1915

User avatar
Zulu
Valued contributor
Valued contributor
Posts: 508
Joined: Mon May 11, 2009 9:44 am

Re:

Postby Zulu » 6 years 5 months ago (Thu Jun 19, 2014 12:39 pm)

Hannover wrote:As far as I know that is the first of the false WWII claims.
Spurious indeed.

We should remember that the London Daily Telegraph in March, 1916, claimed that 700,000 Serbians had been 'gassed', and that as early as 1919 the '6,000,000 Jews' was introduced:
'Holocaust' claimed during and after World War ONE !


As matter of fact, the same Daily Telegraph reported twice the gassing of 700 000 people with 26 years of interval.

1. On March 22, 1916. Austrians and Bulgarians murdered 700,000 Serbians including by gassing.

Gassing Serbians, Daily Telegraph March 22 1916.jpg

2. On June 25, 1942. Germans slauthered 700,000 Polish Jews including by gassing

Gassing Jews, Daily Telegraph June 25 1942.jpg

Source: Vincent Reynouard video "Une demi-heure pour découvrir le révisionnisme"
French only: https://archive.org/details/UneDemi-heu ... isionnisme
French with English subtitles: https://archive.org/details/VincentReyn ... hSubtitles


Return to “'Holocaust' Debate / Controversies / Comments / News”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot] and 8 guests