Czestochowa, Berman: origin of Treblinka story?

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kk
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Postby kk » 1 decade 3 years ago (Sun Jul 23, 2006 8:49 pm)

(Hannover)

And this is what they show us, some trinkets plopped on a couple pieces of paper by who knows who.


What made me laugh is the circa 1760 flintlock pistol in this picture,
proudly posing above the gold coins.
Was that part of a jewish treasure or was it the standard sidearm of an
Sturmbannfuehrer?
And did the jews hoard age old coins because of the collectors value?

What you can really search for, in the whole of the Balcan penninsula, are
treasures of golden english pounds which the SOE parachuted to the
resistance guerrila movements from 1942 onwards.
Many of these "fundings" are still burried there in ex-Yougoslavia,
Albania, Greece and maybe Bulgaria, because the (mostly communist)
leadership of these bands prefered to 'save' them for more opportunate
times. There are still amounts of 2000-20000 gold pieces burried
in tens of places there.
These are most likely the treasures to be found in Istria.

For a high SS-man to hoard a large treasure for his own benefit, without
the "Reich" knowing anything about it, as the standard 'holocau$t' industry
narration says, well, that is like having a rabbi handing over money to the gentiles.



Sorry to disturb the flow of this thread, but I think that CCS has something
there.Perhaps not the origins of the hoax, but at least the beginning of the
orthodox story.

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Postby Laurentz Dahl » 1 decade 3 years ago (Mon Jul 24, 2006 2:18 am)

kk wrote:What made me laugh is the circa 1760 flintlock pistol in this picture,
proudly posing above the gold coins.
Was that part of a jewish treasure or was it the standard sidearm of an
Sturmbannfuehrer?


That would be the part of the legendary treasure of Jewish pirate Long John Sylberman I presume... 8)

It's just like all the ridiculous photos presented in Kola's Belzec Report: dozens of photos showing shards of glass and coins, but not one single photo of human ashes, or of even one of the hundreds of soil samples allegedly taken. 

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Postby Laurentz Dahl » 1 decade 3 years ago (Mon Nov 13, 2006 10:11 pm)

The mirrorsite of deathcamps.org, www.death-camps.org has an interesting bit on Czestochowa in the bio for a certain Moshe Y Lubling:

Moshe Lubling was born in the town of Wolbrum in Upper Silesia, Poland. He lived with his wife Zelda and two children, Pinchas and Ester in Katowice and Sosnowiec where he was the founder and chairman of several Zionists chapters (Poali-Zion and Aoved). He and his family found themselves in the Czestochowa Ghetto at the beginning of the war. In Czestochowa he organized the slave workers and become the chairman of the famous Workers' Council in the ghetto. The council functioned as an intellectual centre for the resistance as well as negotiated with the Judenrat and the Gestapo for better conditions for the workers (a testimony about Moshe Lubling’s leadership was given by Tzvi Rosenvayn in Czestochowa Yidn, pp. 47-51 (“The Hunger Strike in the Czestochowa Ghetto”), a supplement book to Hurban Czestochowa. The article was translated by Mark Froimowitz for the Yizkor project.
According to these two books and several other eyewitnesses, Moshe Lubling was offered to be rescued by the Polish underground the night before the final liquidation of the ghetto, but refused. At the ghetto he organized acts of resistance and many a times was arrested by the Gestapo and the Judenrat.


According to the testimony of Shalom Kon in Sefer Milchamot Agetaot ('The Wars of the Ghettos'), Moshe Lubling was among the original four plotters of the revolt that in August 1943 burned the Treblinka death-camp.

After the gruesome experiences of the day, the four plotters of the revolt met by night around Dr. Chorazycki plank bed and discussed the plans. Their first problem was how to get hold of weapons and explosives which were needed. The four men were the above mentioned Dr. Chorazycki, the Czech army officer Zelo Bloch – a Jew, of course, 'Zev' Kurland from Warsaw and Lubling from Silesia (p. 535).

Moshe Lubling didn’t survive the revolt, but a letter that was smuggled from Treblinka reached his son Pinchas, who was left in Czestochowa, that told about the upcoming revolt. The letter is a historical document of unparallel significance (see Lieber Brener’s testimony in Hurban Czestochowa).


http://www.death-camps.org/treblinka/Ro ... rance.html


From Berman's testimony at the Eichmann Trial:


Presiding Judge: What is your full name?

Witness: Adolf Avraham Berman.

Attorney General: Doctor?

Witness Berman Yes.

Q. Do you live in Tel Aviv at 11 Rehov Bar Kochba?

A. Yes.

Q. You are a doctor of psychology?

A. Yes.

Q. Before the Second World War, you were the director of the
head office of the Jewish psychological and psychotechnical
institutions in Poland - :"Centos"?

A. Yes.

Q. After the outbreak of the Second World War you were one
of the directors of "Centos" in Warsaw?

A. Yes.

Q. "Centos" attended to tens of thousands of Jewish
children?

A. Yes.

http://ftp.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/people/ft ... ion-026-02

Q. Dr. Berman, you were subsequently one of the commanders
of the ghetto revolt?

A. Of the Jewish underground.

Q. We have already heard about this, but I simply did not
want to neglect your share in it. You saw the children who
participated in the ghetto battle?

A. Yes.

Q. Did you witness these little heroes?

A. Yes. I wanted to say something about this. When the
disaster came about, our line was one of general
mobilization, mobilization in two directions; first of all
in the direction of the Jewish anti-Nazi fighting
underground. And we did everything possible in order to
organize the youth, the workers, the intelligentsia, into an
armed anti-Nazi underground. I took part in setting up the
first organization of the armed Jewish underground
in the
Warsaw Ghetto, within the anti-Fascist bloc created at the
initiative of the Polish Labour Party, the P.P.R., in the
Warsaw Ghetto. Already at that time, youth and older
children were also participating in this bloc.

Q. Perhaps we can come to the revolt. At the time of the
revolt you were in the ghetto?

A. No. At the time of the revolt I was one of the
representatives of the ghetto fighters on the Aryan side to
the Polish underground.


The infamous shoe testimony follows:
Q. Let us now leave this matter. After the War you went to
visit Treblinka - is that so?

A. That is right.

Q. At this moment I am not asking for evidence about
Treblinka, for we shall present the chapter of the camps to
the Court at the appropriate time. But perhaps you are able
to tell us in general terms what you saw there?

A. When I came there it was some weeks after I had been
liberated by the Soviet army, this was in January 1945. I
saw a scene which I shall never forget: a tremendous
expanse, extending over many kilometers and on this area
there were scattered skulls, bones, in tens of thousands,
and very, very many shoes, amongst them tens of thousands of
shoes of little children
.

Q. Did you pick up one such pair which you have retained to
this day?

A. Yes, I have brought it here.

Q. You brought it here to show the Court?

A. Yes, I wanted to show it.

A. The pair of shoes of a child, you have retained to this
day?

A. I brought it as something very precious, for I knew that
over a million shoes like these were spread over all the
extermination fields of Europe. These are the shoes. [The
witness shows the Court a pair of children's shoes.]

A. Thank you very much, Dr. Berman.

Presiding Judge: Dr. Servatius, do you have any questions to
the witness?

Dr. Servatius: I do not have any questions.



A. By collaborators I meant, firstly, the gangs of Ukrainian
Fascists who helped them in all the extermination "actions"
and also to our great regret, the Warsaw Ghetto police force
which was also an instrument in the hands of the Nazi
murderers. And we, the Jewish underground, without
distinction of outlook, were against this Jewish police
force, as we were also against the policy of the Judenrat,
of cooperation with the Nazis.


Judge Halevi: Dr. Berman, did you receive any assistance,
did the Jews receive any assistance at the time of the
Holocaust?

Witness Berman Yes. I myself was in constant touch with the
Polish underground and with relief institutions for children
in the Aryan quarter, Polish institutions. And I can relate
that also from the point of view of help for the ghetto
fighters, and from the point of view of help for the rescue
of Jews we received a certain measure of assistance. I
cannot say that it was massive help, substantial, moreover
the possibilities, then, for the Polish underground, for the
Armia Ludova, for the P.P.R. - these possibilities were not
so great, but we obtained help. And I am proud of the fact
that the first revolver we received from the Polish anti-
fascists for the Jewish anti-fascist bloc, we received in my
room, in the room of the director-general of "Centos," in
the same way as I am proud of the fact that amongst the one
thousand workers of "Centos" there were hundreds who were
active in the undergound
. Subsequently the ghetto fighters
obtained help, not just on a single occasion, first of all
from the Polish progressive circles, first and foremost from
the Armia Ludova. In the efforts to save children, I also
acted myself to a certain extent. We also had connections
with the Polish institutions for aiding children, and with
the progressive parties, and also with the Catholic groups.
A certain number - I think it is nevertheless possible to
talk about thousands, not many thousands - but thousands of
Jewish children were saved thanks to the help of Polish
progressive as well as Catholic organizations.


Above is aptly demonstrated the conflict between the underground Jews like Berman, who wanted to fight and have the Jews stay in the ghetto, and the Judenrat and Ghetto Police, who were compliant with the Nazi policy of deportation. Herein lie also the motive for spreading rumors of Treblinka "gas chambers" among the Jews in the Warsaw ghetto.

Q. did you succeed in sending out news to any territory
outside the Nazi occupation, to the free world?

A. Yes. It was in this way: When I crossed over to the Aryan
quarter, this was on 6 September 1942, on the day of the
beginning of the big "Round-up" the big Umschlag when I was
also aware that this was the last minute, in the Aryan
quarter at the time, thanks to my contacts and those other
members of the Polish underground
, we established a Jewish
national underground committee
in the Aryan quarter, and
also a coordinating committee between the conspiratorial
Jewish national underground committee in the Aryan quarter
and the Jewish socialist organization, the Bund.
We were in
touch with all the Polish undergound organizations. I was
the representative attached to the Polish underground; we
were in contact with the circles connected to the Armia
Ludova with the P.P.R., and also with the circles connected
to the Armia Krajewa. We then decided to do everything
possible to alert the Jewish and the non-Jewish world to
what was happening in the ghetto and in the extermination
camps and to the Jewish people in Poland generally. And we
succeeded.
We secured a particular way of transmitting our
cables and our reports - fairly lengthy reports - on all our
activities, our operations for assistance and the struggle
of the ghetto fighters and all the ghettos, to London, to
Washington and also to Moscow
.

Presiding Judge: When did this begin?

Witness Berman From 1943. And there was a closer tie from
1944 and until the end. We also received cables from abroad,
from Jewish organizations.

Judge Halevi: What cables, and what did they say?

Witness Berman About rescue operations and about various
activities connected with the tragedy of the Jewish people
in Europe. I would also like to add, that then, in those
days, in the days of the Warsaw Ghetto, in the days of
Treblinka, Auschwitz and Majdanek, we then decided, and I
decided that one of my most important missions would be - a
struggle against this plague which was called Nazism and
Fascism, until its total liquidation
.


Reading this, it is indeed hard not to consider the possibility that Berman was one of the central people who created, spread and coordinated gassing rumours concerning Treblinka and other alleged death camps.

http://ftp.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/people/ft ... ion-026-03

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Postby Breker » 1 decade 3 years ago (Mon Nov 13, 2006 11:21 pm)

A. Yes. It was in this way: When I crossed over to the Aryan
quarter, this was on 6 September 1942, on the day of the
beginning of the big "Round-up" the big Umschlag when I was
also aware that this was the last minute, in the Aryan
quarter at the time, thanks to my contacts and those other
members of the Polish underground, we established a Jewish
national underground committee in the Aryan quarter, and
also a coordinating committee between the conspiratorial
Jewish national underground committee in the Aryan quarter
and the Jewish socialist organization, the Bund.

We find this quote in direct conflict with the legend. Can anyone explain how Jews in a Jewish ghetto could move about freely in the Aryan quarter, and even more, establish a "Jewish national underground committee" in this Aryan quarter? One can only conclude that this man is uttering complete rubbish, with a communist bent, or, these ghettos were not as we've been told.
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Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 1 decade 3 years ago (Wed Nov 15, 2006 2:46 am)

Hey Laurentz,

I like that phrase "intellectual centre for the resistance." --Like I wonder what that could mean? Where to hatch a lie.
----------

Berman tried the "kids" thing 3 times.

The psychological angle of persecuted kids:

1) His "Give the Child Some Joy" program which he talks about at the Eichmann trial

2) The Janusz Korczak taking the orphans to Treblinka, which I believe he also talks about at the Eichmann trial.

3) His holding up a pair of children's shoes.

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Postby Laurentz Dahl » 1 decade 2 years ago (Tue Nov 27, 2007 4:57 am)

Re: early reports &c on Treblinka.

There is an article entitled "The Tale of Warsaw and Treblinka", written by Elma Dangerfield and published Menorah Journal issue 31, 1943. Menorah was published in New York I believe.

Unfortunately, the only way for me to get access to this journal is to travel 200 miles (for various reasons). Any poster with access to an American (research) library would probably find it easy to locate the issue in question.

It would be interesting to see what version of the Treblinka legend Dangerfield offered her Jewish-American readers back in 1943.

I have not been able to find any comment on it online.


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