The walking dead of Sobibor

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Hotzenplotz
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The walking dead of Sobibor

Postby Hotzenplotz » 1 decade 4 years ago (Mon Aug 28, 2006 8:23 am)

In Sobibor, the dead must have been walking; taking a train ride, in fact. To see why, take at look at this map which was drawn by SS-man Erich Bauer:

Image

The decisive features of this map can be found on maps by other witnesses as well. For a collection see
http://www.deathcamps.org/sobibor/maps.html

The fenced-in area in the north-western part of the camp, the camp within the camp, is where the exterminations supposedly took place, the upper camp or camp III. The upper camp is connected with the lower camps by a small gauge ("narrow track") railway, as we are told. More precisely, what we see is that the mass graves are connected with Sobibor's station. The railway leads directly to the platform.

What could possibly be the purpose? SS-men travelling between the two parts of the camp? Illogical. First of all, there would be no need for a railway to transport a couple of men for just something like 200 metres. Sounds like a loona park. Secondly, there would be no reason for the tracks to lead to the station. If the railway was to facilitate quick transport between the two parts of the camp, it should end right in the middle of the lower camp, not in front of the "pre-camp". Or was it built for SS-men from the upper camp going "downtown" or on holidays? Absurd. They didn't leave that often and certainly could have walked the 200 metres. Why not use a car or truck, anyway? Or was the railway for supplying coal to the crematoria? There were no crematoria. For transporting the belongings of the "gassed"? No, they were taken away from them already in the lower camps. We know the deportees had to walk naked along the "tube" ("Schlauch") leading to the "gas chambers".

I therefore conclude that the deportees, after having been gassed and dumped in the mass graves, arose from the dead to take a train ride back to Sobibor station!

The Sobibor small gauge railway is an instance of the characteristical appearance of details within a story of lies that don't fit in logically. It's a remnant of the true, untold story, the story of the transit camp Sobibor. Within this story, the railway makes perfect sense: Lots of Jews came from the disinfection installations/ shower rooms (a.k.a. "gas chambers") in the upper camp who had to be channeled back to the station swiftly - for transport to the eastern territories. Sometimes several thousands a day. Some of them were old, some children. Instead of whipping them along, the SS chose to build a small gauge railway which ended exactly where it should, at the station, so that the deportees could change to the next train.

I have called the appearance of details which do not fit into the story "characteristical": There are many examples of this phenomenon. Take the hair-cutting stories (illogical in an extermination setting if one doesn't believe the infamous explanation that "the hair was used to make mattrasses for the German Ladies", perfectly logical in a disinfection setting), the stories that people were given soap before being gassed ("for camouflage"), the existence of a hospital in Auschwitz, etc. All of these facts have to be reinterpreted by the mythologists to fit their story. They allow us to catch a glimpse of what really happened.
Last edited by Hotzenplotz on Mon Aug 28, 2006 8:46 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Postby Laurentz Dahl » 1 decade 4 years ago (Mon Aug 28, 2006 8:40 am)

Nice find.

However, in our upsidedown cloud cuckoo world of today, common "sense" would probably have it that the nazis at Sobibor were so evil that they had to kill their victims twice.

Rutger Hauer they had to gas at last thrice of course...

Is there any comments on this narrow gauge rail in the exterminationist literature, for example in Arad?

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Postby Hotzenplotz » 1 decade 4 years ago (Mon Aug 28, 2006 8:54 am)

Laurentz Dahl wrote:Is there any comments on this narrow gauge rail in the exterminationist literature, for example in Arad?


Not that I know of. I havn't read Arad, though. Gitta Sereny in "Into that Darkness" doesn't explain its function. Usually the only comment we get is that the railway "connected the upper with the lower camp".

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Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 1 decade 4 years ago (Tue Aug 29, 2006 12:18 am)

That might be a little discovery. I don't believe anyone else has ever mentioned that. I don't think Mattogno or Graf ever has, or Arad.

You meant "Northeast part of the camp" by the way.

Look at the Blatt model at Deathcamps.org. There's no room there for much wood. The only way it makes sense is for recently deloused people returning to the train area, picking up their deloused clothes on the way.

The arrivees would likely take off their clothes first, and the Germans would likely delouse them at the bottom of the map. While that's happening, arrivees walk up and get in line for body delousing. No hurry since the building could only process so many. When you're done they transport you by these rails back to pick up your clothes, and continue on a clean train.

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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 4 years ago (Tue Aug 29, 2006 12:53 am)

What stands out like a liar's big nose is the area designated as 'mass graves'.

Those alleged mass graves have never been shown to actually exist.

If the laughable yarns were true they would excavate and make a enormous media event of it.

Remnants of such alleged mass graves are impossible to obliterate.

The claimed 'mass graves' do not exist. Doesn't get any simpler than this.

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Postby Laurentz Dahl » 1 decade 4 years ago (Sun Sep 03, 2006 6:25 am)

I noticed that the stretch of the narrow gauge leading from the "extermination area" to the Sobibor railway station is present on the Rutherford ma of Sobibor in 1943, but not on the one for May 1942. Perhaps the exterminationists claim that the narrow gauge was used for transporting fuel for the alleged cremations?

Of course, a narrow gauge rail not existing before June 1942 could as well be explained within the transit camp hypothesis. Maybe there was no narrow gauge there at first, and the deportees were herded on foot through the adjacent forest on the small roads that are visible on the air photos, and later a narrow gauge was built when there was need for higher speed and efficiency in the process.

It would not surprise me much if no witness statements about the narrow gauge being used for fuel transports &c exists.

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Postby Laurentz Dahl » 1 decade 4 years ago (Sun Sep 03, 2006 6:29 am)

If one juxtaposes the Bauer map shown above with the Blatt-Bauer map

Image

which shows the station platform, the hypothesis that the narrow gauge was built to feed deportees back to the train station from the disinfection("gas chamber")/holding area seems even more likely IMHO.

Interestingly, the above map shows the narrow gauge as running through the compound of buildings designated as "valuable huts", "storage sheds", "sorted items awaiting shipment" &c on the Rutherford maps. Perhaps the rail cars stopped halfways and the deportees were given back some/all of the belongings they had left there before going to the desinfection.

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Postby Laurentz Dahl » 1 decade 4 years ago (Wed Sep 20, 2006 9:27 am)

According to Arad, the narrow gauge rail road leading from the ramp to the "Lager III" was built in order to transport sick and incapacitated victims to the gas chambers.

Another technical improvement introduced in Sobibor was a narrow railway trolley that ran from the disembarking platform to the burial pis in Camp III. It was to replace the carts pushed by prisoners or the horse-drawn carts on which the dead, the sick, and those unable to walk from the train were transferred to the pits. According to Oberscharfuhrer Hubert Gomerski, who was in charge of Camp III, the length of the narrow railway was about 300-400 meters. It included five or six trolleys and a small diesel locomotive.
Scharfuhrer Erich Bauer testified:

...Part of the trolleys and rails originated from the sawmill that bordered the Sobibor camp. Additional trolleys and rails arrived by tran from Trawniki. The locomotive of this train came later, about two months after the trolley was in operation. [...] the trolley was laid to transport the sick and handicapped Jews from the arriving trains to Camp III. I know that these people, including the handicapped and sick, children, and particularly infants, were taken to the so-called Lazarett, and there they were shot by those serving in Camp III... It was known in the camps that this Lazarett was used not for healng but for the extermination of the people...
(Arad, p.123-4)

The "Lazarett" is marked on the map above with the number 47.

So, where were the sick, handicapped &c killed, at the Lazarett or in the gas chambers? Why take the trouble of building 3-400 meter long narrow gauge rail road complete with a locomotive and trolleys? Was it more efficient to cram in those hardly mobile victims into the gas chambers, when they could be shot a hundred meters or so from the ramp, at the Lazarett?

The sad obscurantist lemmings over at the Mathis/Romanov smearing blog chided me and Hotzenplotz for being skeptic against the Gospel of Arad.... May the spirit of Saint Torquemada be with you! 8)

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Postby Laurentz Dahl » 1 decade 4 years ago (Thu Sep 21, 2006 1:52 am)

On p.33 in his book Arad claims that

A narrow railoway with a trolley led from the railway station up to the burial pits, bypassing the chambers. People who had died in the trains or those who were unable to walk from the platform to the gas chambers were taken by the trolley.


So the Gospel according to Yitzhak tells us that the sick and infirm were taken by the trolleys directly to the pits and there supposedly shot.

The funny thing is that in this chapter on the construction of Sobibor, Arad indicates that this narrow gauge railway was present already from the beginning, while in the passage from the same book quoted in my previous post it was a part of the new structures of Phase II. Notice that Arad writes that the trolley led to the pits, which were supposedly excavated during Phase II.


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