Stroop Report: A Fraud

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Carto's Cutlass Supreme
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Stroop Report: A Fraud

Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 1 decade 2 years ago (Tue Aug 07, 2007 3:25 pm)

First of all it's a leather bound sentimental book entitled "The Warsaw Ghetto is No More" with a lot of photos, meant as a present for Himmler.

How many fake sentimental books were created? Well the leather bound-in-human-skin Ilse Koch album that was mentioned at her trial, but then when the bluff was called, no one could produce it as evidence. Then we have Kurt Franz sentimental album of Treblinka with the album having the title "Good Times." These fraud album books work great at trials, for evidence.

The intro of the report has a German being killed when a hand grenade in his hand is hit by a bullet. How likely is that? That's the kind of thing you find in a movie.
SS Untersturmfuehrer Dehmke fell in this skirmish with the bandits; he was holding in his hand a hand-grenade which was hit by the enemy and exploded, injuring him fatally.
http://www.holocaust-history.org/works/ ... trp012.htm


And if it's a limited edition gift to Himmler, why is Stroop explaining the most basic things about the ghetto in the very beginning?

It seems like passages could be someone posing as Stroop, with the goal of eliciting sympathy for Jews. For instance:
Not infrequently, the Jews stayed in the burning buildings until, because of the heat and the fear of being burned alive they preferred to ,jump down from the upper stories after having thrown mattresses and other upholstered articles into the street from the burning buildings. With their bones broken, they still tried to crawl across the street into blocks of buildings which had not yet been set on fire or were only partly in flames.

http://www.holocaust-history.org/works/ ... trp016.htm


Is the above something Stroop would write, or something that Adolf Berman's crowd would write? Along with the Janusz Korzcak who led his orphans to the death camps. Or Berman himself holding up a pair of children's shoes at the Eichmann trial.

Or consider the following:

Our setting the block on fire achieved the result in the course of the night that those Jews whom we had not been able to find despite all our search operations left their hideouts under the roofs, in the cellars, and elsewhere, and appeared at the outside of the buildings, trying to escape the flames. Masses of them - entire families - were already aflame and jumped from the windows or endeavored to let themselves down by means of sheets tied together or the like. Steps had been taken so that these Jews as well as the remaining ones were liquidated at once. During the whole night there were shots from buildings which were supposed to be evacuated. We had no losses in our cordoning forces. 5,300 Jews were caught for the evacuation and removed.

http://www.holocaust-history.org/works/ ... trp027.htm


First of all, on the previous page, Stroop said the Germans leave the ghetto at night. Secondly why sheets? The Jews knew about how the Germans burning buildings, with all the access to armaments factory materials in the ghetto, why not have some rope on hand? The sheets is another psychologically powerful image of the Adolf Berman type: people associate the image of climbing out of buildings with tied sheets, with fire disasters. Only to be liquidated at once!

And families aflame who were then liquidated? Fits with Berman's techniques but doesn't fit with SS culture at all, except the Hollywood stereotype of SS culture. Is Himmler supposed to read this or the guy whose face melts off in Raiders of the Lost Ark?

Creating a completely fake document would not be as effective as inserting lines and paragraphs into a real document. The above quote if from an "addendum." It's described as a "copy of a teletyped message."

This would also explain the doctor Tsvi Nussbaum, who claims he's the little boy with his hands raised in the world's most well-known holocaust photo. He bears an uncanny resemblance, but claims he was not in the ghetto but at Hotel Polski. Well maybe that's because that photo was taken at Hotel Polski and not in the ghetto. Maybe it's an inserted photo.
Last edited by Carto's Cutlass Supreme on Tue Aug 07, 2007 9:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 1 decade 2 years ago (Tue Aug 07, 2007 6:02 pm)

I'm reading more if it. It reads like fiction.

Stroop supposedly mentions "T.II" as if anyone would automatically know that's "Treblinka II." It's as if the author trying to speak in a voice that is a German general, and is trying to make up technical terms.

And the German casualties are often so small as to not be believable. Take the April 30, 1943 report found at:
http://www.holocaust-history.org/works/ ... trp045.htm

•30 dugouts discovered and blown up.
•1599 Jews caught
•179 Jews killed in battle

And consider that many Jews are armed: Stroop supposedly writes "The number of Jews in possession of arms was much higher than before among the Jews caught during the last few days."

And consider that the Stroop Report is full of incidences of Jews refusing to be taken alive, yet can no one effectively point a gun?

But here's the unbelievable part: German losses that day: 1 wounded police officer.

Yeah right.

See top of this page:
http://www.holocaust-history.org/works/ ... trp046.htm

Reading from there for the next couple of days, it's like they take around 10,000 prisoners, shoot hundreds of armed Jews, and no German deaths.
----------------
Another odd thing is that with hundreds of Jewish deaths, and thousands rounded up every day for 10 days, there's firms like "Toebbens" still operating who haven't been ordered to evacuate. What? Would the Jews at that factory just be complacently going to their job everyday, as they hear bombs and see fires? That doesn't make sense.

" The firm Toebbens was requested to evacuate, this miniature Ghetto by noon on 10 May 1943."
http://www.holocaust-history.org/works/ ... trp056.htm
Last edited by Carto's Cutlass Supreme on Tue Aug 07, 2007 10:00 pm, edited 4 times in total.

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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 2 years ago (Tue Aug 07, 2007 6:27 pm)

A must read on Warsaw and Stroop:

'1943 Warsaw 'uprising' debunked by French professor'
http://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?t=1281

brief excerpts:
Following the first Soviet air attack against central Warsaw on August 21, 1942, bomb shelters were built, on German orders, everywhere in the city, including the ghetto, for the protection of the residents. The Germans furnished the Jews with the cement and other necessary materials for these shelters, which legend has transformed into 'blockhouses' and 'bunkers.' [8] So extensive was this 'network of subterranean refuges and hiding places' that, according to one prominent Holocaust historian, 'in the end, every Jew in the ghetto had his own spot in one of the shelters set up in the central part of the ghetto.' [9]

The number of Jewish dead is unknown. [13] An often-cited figure of 56,065 is, in fact, the number of Jews who were apprehended. The great majority of these were deported, many to the transit camp at Treblinka from where they were taken to Majdanek (Lublin). [14] German deaths in the operation totalled 16. (This included one Polish policeman.)

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If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 2 years ago (Tue Aug 07, 2007 6:46 pm)

Carto's Cutlass Supreme wrote:Stroop supposedly mentions "T.II" as if anyone would automatically know that's "Treblinka II." It's as if the author trying to speak in a voice that is a German general, and is trying to make up technical terms.


The claim is that Stroop sent captured Jews to 'TII' (Treblinka) for extermination. But why would Stroop transport Jews to Treblinka just to have them killed? If the tale was true it would have been more logical & efficient to execute them locally and save the great expense in fuel, railroad cars, manpower, and time. There was a war on and all resources were in critical demand.

The false claims about The Stroop Report make no sense and as usual there is no proof.

It's the 'holocaust' story line in a nutshell.

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 1 decade 2 years ago (Tue Aug 07, 2007 6:49 pm)

Hey Hannover,

That's interesting but Faurisson doesn't deny the validity of the report. It seems like a lot of revisionists just quibble over the phrases in it. Like what the term "liquidated" means and such. Or what 56,000 really means. For instance at the Zundel trial when Hilberg was on the stand.

I'm almost done reading it. There's never been a single grenade thrown at the Germans. Though the Germans are always capturing stores of grenades. The Germans are discovering 30-40 dugouts a day, and yet there's never been a booby trapped door, by tying a string to a grenade pin and attaching it to something.

I think this report is a fraud. Written by the same people who wrote "A Year In Treblinka."

The writers know how long the ghetto uprising really lasted, so they just duplicate the supposed daily reports for the most part. Sentences like, "we found 30 dugouts today", with some added daily oddity to make it interesting to read.

The only time the Jews use a grenade is to alert other Jews of an escape due to the noise of the grenade, not it's destructive power.
Last edited by Carto's Cutlass Supreme on Tue Aug 07, 2007 10:01 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 2 years ago (Tue Aug 07, 2007 6:58 pm)

Carto's Cutlass Supreme wrote:Hey Hannover,

That's interesting but Faurisson doesn't deny the validity of the report. It seems like a lot of revisionists just quibble over the phrases in it. Like what the term "liquidated" means and such. For instance at the Zundel trial when Hilberg was on the stand.

CCS:
There is no doubt a report was made, commanding officers do such things after completion of their mission, but it's the content enhancement of this report that is the issue. Forget any quibbling, we're blowing it apart.

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Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 1 decade 2 years ago (Tue Aug 07, 2007 8:17 pm)

I finished reading it. What a fraud.

They finally used a grenade near the end. A woman threw it. Didn't kill anybody. The Jews never once used a bomb, yet here's what the Germans recovered:
7 Polish weapons, 1 USSR weapon, 1 German weapon, 59 pistols of different calibers, several hundred grenades, both Polish and self-made, a few hundred Molotov cocktails, self-made bombs, infernal maschines with detonators.

Large amounts of dynamite, ammunition for weapons of all calibers, including ammunition for automatic weapons.

Source:
http://www.holocaust-history.org/works/ ... trp075.htm


In short:

Here's the 2 strongest points of why it's a fraud:

* Germans Are Hardly Ever Killed: Days go by without a single German soldier killed, yet hundreds of armed Jews shot, and thousands captured daily. This not-believable ratio occurs while the Germans have the perilous task of uncovering the usual 30-50 dugouts per day which would make them vulnerable to being shot, to triggering booby traps etc. They're constantly opening up manholes to the sewer, yet no one is ever underneath to shoot them, and no wire or string attached to the manhole ever sets off a grenade: The sewer cover is never booby trapped. The ratio of Jewish deaths to German deaths, where both are armed, is around 500 to 1 I'd say. Yet the Jews have all kinds of equipment: stolen German uniforms, German arms, German helmuts.

* The Jews Don't Set Off a Single Bomb. The Stroop Report is supposedly a technical report where all major events should be mentioned, but the Jews never use grenades or bombs. They have them. The Germans constantly uncover caches of them. But the author forgets to have the Jews using them. Until the very last couple of days, where a couple grenades are thrown but they don't kill anybody. Grenades are used once as a "noise signal." LOL.

This is a battle lasting nearly a month and not a single German died from a grenade or a bomb, except one German in the very beginning, one of the few Germans even killed, who had his own grenade in his hand hit by a bullet fired by a Jew.

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Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 1 decade 2 years ago (Wed Aug 08, 2007 1:10 am)

From Stroop Report
In order to force the bandits in the sewers to come to the surface, 183 sewer entrances were opened at 1500 hours, and smokecandles were lowered into them at an ordered x-time, thereupon the bandits, seeking escape from what they supposed to be poison gas, crowded together in the center of the former Ghetto, and we were able to pull them out of the sewer entrances there.
http://www.holocaust-history.org/works/ ... trp071.htm


And not one of the 183 entrances was booby trapped. The Stroop Report never mentions a single booby trap ever. How hard is it to fix a hand grenade to a fixed place. Attach end of a line to the pin, and attach other end of line to the manhole cover of the sewer?

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Postby jnovitz » 1 decade 2 years ago (Wed Aug 08, 2007 1:41 pm)

The photos are good value too

the jumping man
http://www.deathcamps.org/occupation/st ... tos38.html

and the special unit of rabbis that was captured

http://www.deathcamps.org/occupation/st ... tos09.html

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Postby Hektor » 1 decade 2 years ago (Wed Aug 08, 2007 2:42 pm)

jnovitz wrote:The photos are good value too

the jumping man
http://www.deathcamps.org/occupation/st ... tos38.html

and the special unit of rabbits that was captured

http://www.deathcamps.org/occupation/st ... tos09.html


At least some of the pictures seem to be authentic:
Image
Image
Image
The picture discredit intended extermination as well. Why bother getting them out of their bunkers a live, when you could have done the (alleged extermination job) with a handgrenade immediatly....

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Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 1 decade 2 years ago (Wed Aug 08, 2007 3:58 pm)

The text to the little boy photo with his hands up states "Forcibly pulled out of dugouts."

Do they look like they've been forcibly pulled out of a dugout? Nicely dressed little boy, and a woman with a big purse?

http://www.holocaust-history.org/works/ ... 014.htm.en

It fits with what the little boy, possibly Tsvi Nussbaum said: it's near the Hotel Polski.

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Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 1 decade 2 years ago (Fri Aug 10, 2007 4:15 pm)

The Germans allegedly lost 15 men and one Pole in the month long operation.

And the Jews allegedly had 60,000 killed or captured then exterminated.

That is one German killed for every 4,000 Jews killed or captured. Which isn't believe considering the following:

The Stroop Report tells us the Jews had all kinds of weapons. But on top of that, it tells us they had built bunkers under the guise of building air raid shelters. They had machine guns, rifles, dynamite, and grenades.

Plus the November 1942 report had already come out of the Jewish Underground, so we know that the Jews thought that they would be transported to death camps, which would make many of them not want to be taken alive.

They're in bunkers and the don't want to be taken alive, and they have a lot of weapons, yet:

For every 1 German killed, we have 4000 Jews killed.

Which is 60,000 divided by 15. Is that believable? No.

Or if you include the one Pole working with the Germans, then we have for 3,750 Jews killed or captured for every Nazi force person killed.

56,065 is number in Stroop Report, plus an estimated 5,000 more for Jews killed in rubble. Comes to 60,000.

The person who made the forgery goes over the top to make it look German, and thus on the second day of the Nuremberg trial we have a gullible Robert Jackson telling the court:
I hold a report written with Teutonic devotion to detail, illustrated with photographs to authenticate its almost incredible text, and beautifully bound in leather with the loving care bestowed on a proud work.

http://www.yale.edu/lawweb/avalon/imt/proc/11-21-45.htm
page 125

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Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 1 decade 2 years ago (Fri Aug 10, 2007 4:56 pm)

Then there's this picture of Askaris:
http://www.holocaust-history.org/works/ ... img039.jpg

Askaris are African troops from the World War I era. Would they have really been used in the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising? The people in the photo look white, but look at those ridiculous uniforms.

I've never heard of a single other reference to Askaris being used by the Germans during WWII. They had them in WWI in Tanzania.

See askaris at wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Askaris

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Postby Laurentz Dahl » 1 decade 2 years ago (Fri Aug 10, 2007 5:33 pm)

Carto's Cutlass Supreme wrote:Then there's this picture of Askaris:
http://www.holocaust-history.org/works/ ... img039.jpg

Askaris are African troops from the World War I era. Would they have really been used in the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising? The people in the photo look white, but look at those ridiculous uniforms.

I've never heard of a single other reference to Askaris being used by the Germans during WWII. They had them in WWI in Tanzania.

See askaris at wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Askaris


The Ukrainian HiWis (auxiliary forces) were nicknamed askers. I suppose it could be derived from Askari and referring to the black color of the uniform (like the original Askari were of black skin color). They were also called "the blacks." The uniform they wear is the standard one issued at Trawniki and other places I think.

I'm not very familiar with the history of the Stroop Report. Where was it supposedly found, and by who?

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Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 1 decade 2 years ago (Fri Aug 10, 2007 7:07 pm)

Hi Laurentz,

O.K. that explains the askaris, because the report does mention "Trawniki men."

The Stroop Report is supposedly a "commemorative book" that General Stroop made of his destruction of the Warsaw ghetto. On the front, embossed in German script was "The Warsaw Ghetto Is No More" which is the title of the book.

It has 3 parts:
1) an introduction
2) copies of daily reports sent to a general Kruger of some central Cracow office
3) A collection of photos, so that it is partly a photo album.

One of those photos is the most famous holocaust photos there is: the little boy with his arms raised.

It's an incredibly important document for various reasons. One being it shows the Jews fought back in this instance. That assertion serves with modern-day Israeli beliefs that justify present day fighting due to supposedly not fighting their own genocide back then, except incidences like the rare and heroic case of the Warsaw ghetto uprising.

The document was used to sentence General Stroop to death.

The soldier who happened to be in the background of the little boy photo (Bloethe) was hunted down till they found him in East Germany in 1967, and he then got death also.

The document is used by believers to support the Treblinka death camp, with it's mentioning of "T II."

A 10 to 1 casualty ratio between Nazis and Jews would be incredible. 100 to 1 would be really hard to believe. But here eventhough it's hard to gauge who was a combatant and who was a civilian, we're looking at a death ratio of 400 to 1 or something like that. Which isn't believable.

Stroop had 16 deaths for the whole operation. Take this sentence from the report:

"Of the total of 56,065 caught, about 7,000 were destroyed in the former Ghetto during large-scale operation. "

Just with those 7,000 deaths alone you have a 437 to 1 ratio.

Yet many were armed Jews fortified in bunkers possessing grenades and even machine guns.

This site is good, but the link to the "Holocaust History" site has a more readable version. Except that version leaves out the number of people listed at the beginning of the report.
http://www.yale.edu/lawweb/avalon/imt/d ... 061-ps.htm


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