Red Coloring in Fatal CO Poisonings

[Friedrich Paul Berg]

The "Statement of Kurt Gerstein," has been a key document for the holocaust claims. Gerstein had supposedly witnessed diesel exhaust gassings of Jews with a stopwatch in his hand. He claimed that after the gassing "The bodies were tossed out, blue, wet with sweat and urine...." Most of the other self-styled "witnesses" to such gassings also claimed the corpses were "blue" or "bluish." But Diesel gassings in half-an-hour are practically impossible as is clear now from the Flanagan evidence which is available on this Revisionist Forum http://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?t=4423 . No doubt, the other "witnesses" were simply tailoring their testimony to suit the wishes of prosecutors. The prosecutors werenot merely trying to gain a few more convictions but had a broad, educational purpose which was to build a solid basis for their gassing theory so as to criminalize the Nazis and Germans forever and ever. Since they had no forensic evidence or documents for such gassings, the courtroom "testimony" of "eyewitnesses" was everything.

But we now know that diesel mass gassings just do not work. To evade this diesel problem, some exterminationist true-believers are now insisting that gasoline engines were used instead. Supposedly, Gerstein and others were wrong about the engine but were right about the gassings otherwise. Gasoline exhaust gassings are possible because of the far greater CO levels--but, the corpses would have displayed a characteristic "cherry red" or "bright red" color and this is spelled out in countless handbooks and textbooks on forensic pathology. Non-fatal cases of CO poisonign may appear bluish but, if you are dead from CO, you are RED. The hoaxers have sidestepped one problem but are now confronted by an even bigger problem. Although one might mistake a gasoline engine for a diesel engine, how can one possibly mistake "red" for "blue?" The revised hoax is as bogus as the old hoax. Diesel gassings never happened and neither did gasoline exhaust gassings.



Characteristic Reddish Coloring of a non-fatal case
due to CO poisoning
Figure is from www.acsu.buffalo.edu/~lcscott/carbonmonoxide.html




Figure with caption are from: Forensic Pathology--A Color Atlas on CD-ROM by Jay Dix, CRC Press (Boca Raton, Fl., USA), page 8



Figure with caption are from: Forensic Pathology--A Color Atlas on CD-ROM by Jay Dix, CRC Press (Boca Raton, Fl., USA), page 23.



Figure with caption are from: Forensic Pathology--A Color Atlas on CD-ROM by Jay Dix, CRC Press (Boca Raton, Fl., USA), page 111.



Figure with caption are from: Forensic Medicine: Colour Guide (Edinburgh; New York: Churchill Livingstone, 2003) page 12.

Friedrich Paul Berg
Learn everything at www.nazigassings.com
Nazi Gassings Never Happened! Niemand wurde vergast!

[Hannover]

Pseudo-science 'holocaust' site Nizkor attempts a rebuttal to Berg here:
http://www.nizkor.org/features/techniqu ... el-01.html
Check out all their points of disinformation, if you accept any of them, then discuss them here.

In relation to the color issue, they say that Berg says:

2. Eyewitnesses described the corpses from a diesel gassing as blue in color - but acute carbon monoxide poisoning victims are red.

So what is their rebuttal?

Point (2) above is often true, though not always.

That's it? That's their rebuttal? I guess only the Germans could turn people blue.

As an aside, you gotta love this one:

Did you know ... that only one of the 'Operation Reinhard' death camps may have used a diesel engine? (At Belzec and Sobibor, petrol engines were used.)

I wish those absurd infants could keep their lies straight:

In discussing the Gerstein 'statements'; Leon Poliakov, who is a French speaking, Jewish 'historian', said: "there is little to add to this description [the Gerstein statement] which holds good for Treblinka, Sobibor as well as for the Belzec camp. The latter installations were constructed in almost the same way and also used the exhaust carbon monoxide gases from Diesel motors as death agents."

Oops!

According to Poliakov, more than a million and a half people were killed with Diesel exhaust. (fn. 10) - for more on the alleged 'diesel gassings' and see why judeo-supremacists would attempt to alter the lie, see http://www.codoh.com/gcgv/gcdiesel.html

- Hannover

[Wahrheit]

I wish those absurd infants could keep their lies straight:

Isn't it the truth? As Berg and Hannover point out, many holostorians and anti-revisionists are proclaiming the lack of foundation for gassings with diesel engines at the Reinhardt camps. This is thanks to the shredding they suffered by Berg's work regarding the toxicity of diesel exhaust.

Yet there are certain things which, once said, will come back to haunt them.

United States Holocaust Memorial Museum's Website states:

In 1942, systematic mass killing in stationary gas chambers (with carbon monoxide gas generated by diesel engines) began at Belzec, Sobibor, and Treblinka, all in Poland. As victims were "unloaded" from cattle cars, they were told that they had to be disinfected in "showers." The Nazi and Ukrainian guards sometimes shouted at and beat the victims, who were ordered to enter the "showers" with raised arms to allow as many people as possible to fit into the gas chambers. The tighter the gas chambers were packed, the faster the victims suffocated.

http://www.ushmm.org/wlc/article.php?la ... d=10005220

Also, from another promoter website on Sobibor (a site now claimed by establishment to use gasoline engines too):

At fist there were three gas chambers housed in a brick building. The Nazis used carbon monoxide produced by diesel engines to kill their victims. Later, three more gas chambers were added. Operations began in April 1942, immediately after the arrival of Franz Stangl. Operations ended following a successful inmate revolt on 14 October 1943. It is estimated that the number of deaths reached 250,000, the majority of the victims were Jews.

http://www.cympm.com/sobibor.html

And finally, from the Jewish Virtual Library:

Wirth rejected Cyanide B which was later used at Auschwitz. This gas was produced by private firms and its extensive use in Belzec might have aroused suspicion and led to problems of supply. He therefore preferred a system of extermination based on ordinary, universally available gasoline and diesel fuel.

[...]

The access paths, including the "tube," in Treblinka named "Street to Heaven" by the SS-men, were model led on those in Belzec and Sobibor; the same applied to the "reception camp" and "accommodation camp."
During the first stage, three gas chambers were in operation, each of them, much like those in Sobibor,4 x 4 m. in size and 2.6 m. high. A diesel engine producing poisonous carbon monoxide, as well as a generator which supplied the whole camp with electricity, were housed in a built-on room. The entrance doors of the gas chambers opened into a passage in front of the building; each door was 1.8 m. high and 90 cm. wide.

http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jso ... ard.html#6

And the switch-a-roo collapses.

[jnovitz]

A distinction should be drawn between liver mortis, which is blood leaking out of the vessels and infusing the tissue - a process that happens several hours after death and the distinctive cherry pink of carbon monoxide poisoning, shown in the top photo.

The cherry pink is caused by the binding of carbon monoxide by haemoglobin which turns a dark red color. It is, or at least was, common to blow carbon monoxide over meat before displaying it in shops, so that the meat would take a dark red hue and look more appealing.

People killed by carbon monoxide would appear flushed immediately after death but not covered in giant red blotches of liver mortis.

Regarding "blue coloring" this was seemingly confirmed by the post war testimony of Pfannestiel who said they were colored blue and this was because they died of suffocation. With medical training he would know the symptoms of CO poisoning and appeared to be explicitly ruling it out.

This suggests that the problem of diesel exhaust was well known albeit not explicitly spelt out.

It also suggests that Pfannestiel was remarkably cooperative in his testimony, perhaps protective of the Gerstein legend, for reasons one can only speculate why.

One possible reason was that Gerstein (and Pfannestiel as well?) were genuinely part of a wide spread anti-nazi underground movement. Hence by naming Pfannestiel, Gerstein was confident that he would back up his story. This leads the question dangling doesnt that still rather drop both Pfannestiel and Gerstein in it? Well we know that Pfannestiel suffered no consequences after the war from inspecting Treblinka.

And Gerstein supposedly hung himself in a French jail. Curiously the French seemed to have hidden this fact from the Nuremberg tribunal which appeared to believe he was simply in hiding.

Statement of Hielscher. (Tr. p. 5982 ff.) On cross-examination, the witness testified to the trustworthiness of the witness Gerstein, who since submitting the affidavit can no longer be traced and is presumed to be hiding.

http://www.mazal.org/archive/nmt/01/NMT01-T829.htm

[Friedrich Paul Berg]

I am a bit puzzled by Jnovitz's comment. He wrote: "The cherry pink is caused by the binding of carbon monoxide by hemoglobin which turns a dark red color. " I am not aware that the binding of carbon monoxide to hemoglobin causes a "dark" red color at all. From the literature, I know only of a bright red result. That is also described as a "characteristic" "cherry-red" color. My understanding is that blood which is rich in carboxyhemoglobin is itself a bright red and this color shows through the skin unless the skin is heavily pigmented.

I suspect Pfannenstiel's (please note the correct spelling) career would have advanced much further if he had not been implicated by Gerstein--but that is, of course, speculation on my part. He was listed several times after the war in "Who's Who in Medicine." When he was forced to testify about his trip with Gerstein, he not only spoke of a "blue tinge" to the faces of the victims but also spoke of a "6-cylinder diesel engine" as the source of the toxic gas. My guess is that he dared not say anything that would refute the prosecution story or appear hostile to the legend. He went along with some of the key features of Gerstein's account even though he knew they were false and made no sense technically at all.

Friedrich Paul Berg
Learn everything at www.nazigassings.com
Nazi Gassings Never Happened! Niemand wurde vergast!

[Atigun]

On a practical note, many diesel trucks are equipped with a sleeper berth. Drivers routinely use these berths with the engine running. The engines are left running at idle so that either the heater or the air conditioner can be operated. Truck cabs are not sealed gas proof. Truck exhaust systems utilize mechanical fasteners and even flex tubing that is subject to failure. One type of truck known as the cabover model actually has the engine mounted inside the cab with only upholstery covered aluminum to protect the driver from any supposedly lethal exhaust leaks. However, to my knowledge, no driver has ever died from CO poisoning while asleep in a sleeper berth. To say that no diesel truck has ever developed an exhaust leak is absurd.

This is some support from 'everyday life' for Mr. Berg's original research that has truly driven a stake into the heart of one of the holocaust's most egregious myths.

[jnovitz]

I am not aware that the binding of carbon monoxide to hemoglobin causes a "dark" red color at all. From the literature, I know only of a bright red result. That is also described as a "characteristic" "cherry-red" color. My understanding is that blood which is rich in carboxyhemoglobin is itself a bright red and this color shows through the skin unless the skin is heavily pigmented.

This is a little bit how long is a piece of string.

My experience with carboxyhaemoglobin comes from working at a stat bench running blood gas assays for the Emergency Department. I only very occasionally received suspected carbon monoxide cases but when I did it the blood in the syringe appeared a very dark red compared with bright red for normal blood.
This is because in a syringe (or artery) there is more blood that suffused through a capillary bed. Either way its more intensely red on binding CO, but not to the pointing of being blotchy as some of your photos show.

I suspect Pfannenstiel's (please note the correct spelling) career would have advanced much further if he had not been implicated by Gerstein--but that is, of course, speculation on my part. He was listed several times after the war in "Who's Who in Medicine." When he was forced to testify about his trip with Gerstein, he not only spoke of a "blue tinge" to the faces of the victims but also spoke of a "6-cylinder diesel engine" as the source of the toxic gas. My guess is that he dared not say anything that would refute the prosecution story or appear hostile to the legend. He went along with some of the key features of Gerstein's account even though he knew they were false and made no sense technically at all.

Pfannenstiel's exact words (translate) were
"No doctor was present. I noticed
nothing special about the corpses, except that some of them showed
a bluish puffiness about the face. But this is not surprising
since they had died of asphyxiation. If my memory serves me
correctly, I returned to Lublin that same day with Dr. Gerstein."

As a medical doctor he would have used the word asphyxiation precisely and would also be well aware of the classical symptoms of carbon monoxide poisoning -which medically is distinct from asphyxiation.

Along with his emphasis on the diesel engine, it points to an awareness of the non-lethal levels of carbon monoxide in diesel exhaust and willingness to create a scenario that saw death through depletion of oxygen.

To me it seems unlikely that simply threats to his career alone would be sufficient to induce such cooperation, besides you would still think he would inform his family and close friends of the truth which could be revealed either on his retirement or after his death. And assuming the NPD is not some kind of Jewish front there are always avenues in German society where this could be expressed to some extent.

Frankly, I would not find acceptable as a member of faculty or hospital a man who calmly inspected gigantic murder factories and I would find it surprising any Germans would either.

It appears to me that we are insufficiently aware of resistence networks to Hitler and Nazism and how they operated and perhaps this is an issue that historians have wished not to shine too bright a light on.

[Friedrich Paul Berg]

Jnovitz has an advantage over me because of his experience with blood samples. My thoughts and conclusions are based almost entirely on the medical literature.

On my website I have included a lengthy response to a foolish essay by Charles Provan which Germar Rudolf actually published in his otherwise excellent journal. What follows is a portion of my response to Provan.

Blue Women on the Beach –
and the False Toxicity of CO2 in Diesel Exhaust
by Friedrich Paul Berg
......
When prisoners are executed with cyanide in the USA , they are not generally blue after death either. If they were blue, some eyewitness reporter would have certainly said so and made it general knowledge. Nonetheless, medical examiners will describe such corpses as
”cyanotic” because of post-mortem appearances of very small parts of the corpse. Such deaths are probably the true basis of the word “cyanosis” to begin with--and the usage has simply been carried over to describe deaths where no cyanide is actually involved. An excellent analysis [15] of the exact nature of the perceived “blueness” or cyanosis in fatal cases of CO poisoning concluded with the following sentences:

“The ‘blue' blood of reduced haemoglobin is still optically red when seen on its own, and differs more through its dark appearance (low brightness) than an actual colour difference. This paradox is the subject of a further study.”

In subsection 3 of his essay, Provan gives the infamous portion of the Gerstein statement which mentions “blue bodies” followed by a portion of another statement supposedly given by Pfannenstiel on June 6, 1950 to the court in Darmstadt, West Germany. According to that statement from Pfannenstiel:

“I noticed nothing special about the corpses. Some were tinged bluish in the face.”

After this passage, Provan immediately jumps in with the following:

“Note that both witnesses described the color of the victims of the diesel gassing at Belzec as blue.”

Once again, Provan is asking readers to make a leap of faith. The simple, obvious fact is that Pfannenstiel did not really describe the victims as “blue” at all--but merely that “Some were tinged bluish in the face.” They were not even tinged “blue”--but only “bluish!” And most, showed nothing special at all. As to “carbon monoxide” or carbon dioxide, Pfannenstiel makes no mention of them either, anywhere, ever!

Although, one should expect the vast majority of dead victims to show some variation of the usual, classical, intense reddish coloring, based on countless medical references, including Provan's--Pfannenstiel actually denied having seen any reddish coloring anywhere ("I noticed nothing special about the corpses”); not even a reddish tinge is mentioned! Out of what Gerstein insisted were 700 to 800 corpses from one gassing, none showed any variation of the classical, red coloring! That is simply incredible and demonstrates, I believe, the kind of pressure Pfannenstiel must have been under to say something, no matter how absurd, consistent with the Gerstein statement. Obviously, Pfannenstiel threw the prosecutors a bone, even if only a small one—to get them off his back. He lied--and who can really blame him? Even Galileo bowed his head and threw the pope some bones to avoid the same horrific end as Giordano Bruno. .... We cannot point a telescope to Belzec to observe the past—but, there are supposedly many corpses still buried at Belzec. Due to Jewish religious objections about disrespecting Jewish dead, however, the Polish authorities have blocked any forensic exhumations.

According to Forensic Pathology by Bernard Knight MD, p. 507 which Provan quotes as follows on page 161 of The Revisionist:

“At autopsy the most striking appearance of the body is the color of the skin, especially in areas of post-mortem hypostasis. The classical ‘cherry-pink' color of carboxyhemoglobin is usually evident if the saturation of the blood exceeds about 30%.”

References:
[15] G. H. Findlay, “Carbon monoxide poisoning: Optics and histology of skin and blood,” British Journal of Dermatology, vol. 119 (1988); pp. 45-51.

Friedrich Paul Berg
Learn everything at www.nazigassings.com
Nazi Gassings Never Happened! Niemand wurde vergast!

[Friedrich Paul Berg]

The subject of cyanide victims was raised above. In that regard I received an e-mail telling me that the supposed victims of cyanide at Auschwitz were supposedly "blue" or "greenish" which is also completely contrary to reality.

It is Carlo Mattogno who wrote the following in his book Auschwitz: The First Gassing. Rumor and Reality---Holocaust Handbook Series, Vol.20
by Carlo Mattogno, Theses and Dissertations Press 2005--page 82. I received the information by e-mail from someone who probably prefers to remain anonymous.


Clearly, what is consistent about the "eyewitness testimony" is that the "eyewitnesses" are ALL liars. And their lies are major lies which are totally contrary to what they would have seen, if they saw anything at all. They were ALL providing "copy-cat," false testimony not based on anything to do with actual cyanide gassings. However, it served the purpose of the prosecutors which was to provide a veneer of credible evidence. Since the defendants had no expertise in cyanide gassings either, they were nearly helpless against the onslaught of such false evidence.

Friedrich Paul Berg
Learn everything at www.nazigassings.com
Nazi Gassings Never Happened! Niemand wurde vergas

[Friedrich Paul Berg]

The following essay abstract actually appears on the Nizkor website at the following address:

Link here (edited by Webmaster)

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Title: Should coroners be able to recognize unintentional carbon
monoxide-related deaths immediately at the death scene?

Source: J Forensic Sci; VOL 40, ISS 4, 1995, P596-8

Title Abbreviation: J Forensic Sci

Author: Risser D; Bjonsch A;

Mesh Headings: Adolescence*; Adult*; Age Distribution*; Aged*; Aged,
80 and over*; Austria; Carbon Monoxide Poisoning*; Child*; Coroners
and Medical Examiners*; Female; Human; Male; Middle Age*; Postmortem
Changes*;

Abstract: The aim of this retrospective survey of unintentional carbon
monoxide-related deaths in Vienna was to determine whether the
cherry-pink coloring of livor mortis is a reliable finding for the
coroner to suspect a carbon monoxide-related death immediately at the
death scene. In addition, we investigated the recognition pattern of
unintentional carbon monoxide-related deaths by Viennese coroners
between 1984 and 1993. Therefore, we analyzed autopsy reports of
postmortems performed at the Viennese Institute of Forensic Medicine
between 1984 and 1993. The study involved 182 unintentional carbon
monoxide-related deaths: 92 females and 90 males. We found a strong
association between the carboxyhemoglobin level and the cherry-pink
coloring of livor mortis. In 98.4% of unintentional carbon
monoxide-related deaths livor mortis were clearly cherry-pink. During
the 10-year study period Viennese coroners recognized only 61% of
unintentional carbon monoxide-related deaths immediately at the death
scene. The percentage of unrecognized carbon monoxide fatalities with
a clear cherry-pink coloring of livor mortis almost doubled from 1984
to 1993. The older the victim, the worse the coroners recognition. In
summary, we have shown that coroners should be able to recognize
unintentional carbon monoxide-related deaths immediately at the
death-scene, because fresh corpses with carboxyhemoglobin levels
greater than 31% show a clear cherry-pink coloring of livor mortis.
Therefore, coroners should be encouraged to examine naked corpses
thoroughly, especially regarding the color of livor mortis. Thus, a
carbon monoxide-related death can be recognized immediately and the
source of gas release identified as soon as possible protecting people
who otherwise would also be at risk of poisoning.(ABSTRACT TRUNCATED
AT 250 WORDS)

Publication Type: JOURNAL ARTICLE

Entry Month: 9602

Secondary Source ID: TOXBIB/96/078551

Year: 95

Coden: I5Z

Address: Institute of Forensic Medicine, University of Vienna,
Austria.

ISSN: 0022-1198

+++++++++++++++++++++++++

The above abstract suggests an extremely interesting essay that completely supports my view that the vast majority of Reinhard Camp victims would have appeared RED if they had been killed with carbon monoxide from either diesel exhaust or from gasoline engine exhaust--and especially since they would have been naked according to the holocaust legend. The exceptions possible according to the above essay would have been the extremely old for whom death could occur long before the carboxyhemoglobin levels could rise above 30%.

The Gerstein Statement as well as the countless copy-cat testimonies by self-described "eyewitnesses" to similar gassings are all undermined by the forensic medical literature regarding the appearance of CO victims. In unearthing such literature, even Nizkor has been useful.

Friedrich Paul Berg
Learn everythiong at www.nazigassings.com
Nazi Gassings Never Happened! Niemand wurde vergast!

[Friedrich Paul Berg]

The following link gives that all-important essay I discussed above which shows that "cherry-pink" is the color one can expect with 100% certainty shortly after death in all corpses of white people where the carboxyhemoglobin level was greater than 31%. Deaths with carboxyhemoglobin levels below 31% occur only with those who are very sick or old already.

http://nazigassings.com/RisserBoenschSchneider.html

What that all means is that Kurt Gerstein never saw any fatal victims of CO when he said "the corpses were blue.." And all of the copy-cat "eyewitnesses" such as Pfannenstiel and many others who came afterward were also LIARS. The revised holocaust theory that gasoline engine exhaust must have been used instead of diesel exhaust falls apart because such deaths (from gasoline exhaust) would have definitely been from CO. Such corpses would have been cherry-pink which is completely contrary to the "eyewitness" testimony except for one instance of an alleged "experimental" gassing at Sachsenhausen which was supposedly seen by Dr. Theodor Friedrich Leidig. See: NS Massentoetungen durch Giftgas, Kogon, Langbein, Rueckerl -- Seite 83. German edition.

Friedrich Paul Berg
Learn everything at www.nazigassings.com
Nazi Gassings Never Happened! Niemand wurde vergast!

[Friedrich Paul Berg]

You might want to look at the gems that have just been posted on my super website.

http://www.nazigassings.com/TheEyewitnessesLied.html

It all goes to prove that that the holocaust really is just another dirty jewish hoax.

Friedrich Paul Berg
Learn everything at www.nazigassings.com
Nazi Gassings Never Happened! Niemand wurde vergast!

[Friedrich Paul Berg]

There is an important ABC News story about the widespread use in the USA, with FDA approval, of carbon monoxide to make old meat look bright red and fresh.

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/Consumer/stor ... 064&page=1

Meat products have hardly any blood (the carrier of hemoglobin) remaining within the tissues because of the slaughtering processes which includes several minutes of blood-letting. What could be more anemic than that? And yet, the ABC News story clearly shows that the effects of CO on dead meat are still extremely intense and all the more reason to reject the CO gassing charges against the Nazis.

Will it persuade exterminationists that Gerstein and other so-called "eyewitnesses" to gassings in the Reinhardt camps were all liars? Of course, not--but it certainly should! The holocaust gassing claims really are all rubbish, folks.

Friedrich Paul Berg
Learn everything at www.nazigassings.com

Nazi Gassings Never Happened! Niemand wurde vergast!

[Friedrich Paul Berg]

The only "pigment" involved here is carboxyhemoglobin.
I suspect American morticians will soon be using CO to make corpses look pretty, and life-like--if they haven't been using CO already for just that purpose. Perhaps that was what the fiendish Nazis had been doing to impress visitors as well. Visitors from the ICRC would have been so impressed to see that even the corpses of Jews appeared "healthy." Why not--it's no more crazy or obscene than any other part of the holocaust hoax?

Another example of the "pigmentation" caused by carboxyhemoglobin is the following from G. Austin Gresham's excellent book:



Read the caption for the image above.

Friedrich Paul Berg
Learn everything at www.nazigassings.com
Nazi Gassings Never Happened! Niemand wurde vergast!

[MrNobody]

There is an important ABC News story about the widespread use in the USA, with FDA approval, of carbon monoxide to make old meat look bright red and fresh.

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/Consumer/stor ... 064&page=1

Perhaps you should save the "web page complete" or use the print screen to capture the page as an image, I've been doing this of late since most pages lately seem not to be archived or they are being removed on purpose.