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“Will Dr. Shermer accept my challenge? I doubt it. When he crossed swords with revisionist historian Mark Weber, it was a disaster for Shermer and the traditional view of the Holocaust. Weber made Holocaust revisionism look too good for Shermer’s liking, and the traditional view of the Holocaust severely deficient. Furthermore, many who saw the debate said that Shermer appeared amateurish, and at times, even foolish. Since that disaster, Shermer has never (to my knowledge) engaged another Holocaust revisionist in public debate. It appears as though Shermer is fearful of undermining the media-created, public image of himself as the “Great Guru of Skepticism.” To cross swords with Holocaust revisionists would call public attention to the severe deficiencies in his own work and Holocaust historiography in general. His strategy seems to be as follows: Never again engage a revisionist in debate, just write about them in mainstream, establishment media outlets. In this way, he can selectively create any image of revisionists and revisionist historiography he so chooses, without ever having to worry about the negative fallout resulting from an expose of the fallacies, errors and omissions in his work on the Holocaust.”
Mortimer wrote:I don't know of the Weber-Shermer debate being available online but the Noontide Press has it available on vhs or dvd -
http://store.noontidepress.com/index1.html
Agrarian Reformer wrote:Mortimer wrote:I don't know of the Weber-Shermer debate being available online but the Noontide Press has it available on vhs or dvd -
http://store.noontidepress.com/index1.html
That site is really screwed up. I click on 'audio' and it takes me to 'New and Noteworthy'. I click on 'video' and it takes me to the same page. Can't even find the debate in question.
Yes, this is something I'd like to see. I kind of thought he was a sensible person before I started reading up on the holohoax and his position on it. This 'Mr.Sceptic' BS really needs to end.
"Michael Shermer accuses real skeptics of denying history because, in part, they refuse to share his delusional belief that the Germans were able to murder millions of Jews without leaving a trace. In his sophomoric and sophistic attempt to “prove” this accusation, he has denied forensic science, criminology and archeology. In accusing others of practicing pseudo history, he not only has engaged in it himself, but also had to forgo the scientific method and the very fundamental principles of skepticism which he claims guides his belief system. In his own words, again from Denying History: “The best way to beat a lie detector is to believe the lie yourself… Deception becomes self-deception.” Really? Well then, let’s use the alleged Treblinka holocaust as a case study in denial and self-deception. Here’s another montage of Michael Shermer quotes from Denying History: “The culmination of years of research… our purpose… to present the historical facts that refute Holocaust denial… To debunk the deniers can’t we just go there and see them for ourselves? The answer, of course, is “yes.”… We can no longer ignore the deniers, calling them names and hoping they will go away… We cannot remain silent anymore. It’s time to respond… Not only is it defensible to respond to the deniers, it is, we believe, our duty… Many of our arguments draw on specialized research into the claims of the deniers that took us… to the Nazi extermination camps themselves… we went to Europe to conduct research at the camps, in particular at… Treblinka, Sobibor, Belzec… We wanted to see for ourselves just what evidence there is at the camps and to take the opportunity to examine firsthand the claims… Much of the research is the type of work professional historians normally do… analyzing ground and aerial photographs… in order to make proper interpretations, we must review the physical evidence… Like criminologists solving a crime, we piece together the myriad bits of evidence until a conclusion emerges from the morass of data… How is it that so much physical evidence can come to be doubted?”
“Reviewing the physical evidence?” - “Analyzing ground and aerial photographs?” - “Like criminologists solving a crime?” Well now Michael, real skeptics and scholars have been waiting for years for you to publish the results of your alleged firsthand examination of the physical evidence and analysis of aerial photographs of Treblinka. If you’re so incredulous that people can come to doubt so much physical evidence and photographic proof, then why do you refuse to publish the results of your alleged research? If there’s so much physical evidence – then let’s see it! What’s wrong Shermer? Your silence is deafening. What happened to your duty to respond? (After all, you do want to put an end to holocaust denial – don’t you?) Who’s self-deceiving? Who’s denying the REAL HISTORY of Treblinka? Who’s denying common sense, iron logic, critical thinking, forensic science and the fundamental principles of skeptical inquiry and the scientific method? Who’s denying reality?"
Agrarian Reformer wrote:I hope Weber is okay with me converting it and uploading it onto youtube.
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