Dishonesty - Auschwitz death toll again

[Malle]

One thing caught my interest today. In another forum a certain Jonathan Harrison are trying to do the old famous rope trick again with the Auschwitz death toll. Like most of the Holohoaxers he tries to give the impression that the 4 million figure was something that the Soviets invented (which is true) and all other reliable sources are around 1-2 millions.

A quick summary of death figures for Auschwitz Jews given in various sources, 1945-78, summarized in Van Pelt's submission to the Lipstadt trial:

1. Extraordinary State Commission, 29/5/45: "no less than four million citizens of the USSR., Poland, France, Jugoslavia, Czechoslovakia, Rumania, Hungary, Holland, Belgium, and other countries" (no figure for Jews)

2. Nachman Blumental, Höss Trial, 1946: 1.3-1.5m.

3. Höss memoirs, 1946: 'most likely less than 1.2m'

4. Reitlinger, 1953: 840,800 but Poland and Baltic states uncertain

5. Poliakov, 1956: 2m-2.3m

6. Hilberg, 1961: 1m

7. Wellers, 1978: 1,352,980

http://www.hdot.org/trial/defense/van/ii

That isn’t correct. The figures from the Holohoaxers vary from 66.206 to 8.000.000. You can read about it in this thread:

http://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?t=16

I wonder if they can decide what figure we should use?

[friedrich braun]

I still don't know why the 6 million figure didn't change when the Auschwitz numbers went down. Is it because they claim that the most of the 4 million (original figure) were gentiles?

[Malle]

I still don't know why the 6 million figure didn't change when the Auschwitz numbers went down. Is it because they claim that the most of the 4 million (original figure) were gentiles?

Could be, but its also known as Holocaust mathematics.

Read here:
http://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?p=37#37

[Mythos]

9,000,000
persons according to the documentary film Nuit et Brouillard (Night and Fog, title used in the English-speaking world) (1955), whose historical advisers were the historian Henri Michel and the woman historian Olga Wormser-Migot[11]
[11] Nuit et Brouillard, a 32 minute film in black and white untiringly spread in all of France's colleges and other secondary schools as well as on French television over the last forty years. Director: Alain Resnais. Historical advisors: Henri Michel (Chairman of the World War II History Committee) and Olga Wormser-Migot. Text: Jean Cayrol. 1956 Jean Vigo Award. In that film, it is said that "nothing distinguished the gas [singular] chamber from an ordinary block." The concrete ceiling of the "gas chamber" is shown in it "ploughed up by the fingernails" and it is added about this: "even the concrete was getting torn up." It is asserted there that, with the bodies, "manufacturing soap is intended." "As to the skin" of the bodies , the image shows us that the Germans were tanning it. Those stories of scratched concrete, of human soap and of skin tanned by the Germans are of the order of the myth. With the camera lingering on the Birkenau landscape, the commentator says: "Nine million dead are haunting this landscape." This sentence is uttered towards the end of the film.

So, the alleged Auschwitz death toll could be claimed to be about 100,000 -9,000,000.

[PotPie]

I still don't know why the 6 million figure didn't change when the Auschwitz numbers went down. Is it because they claim that the most of the 4 million (original figure) were gentiles?

Its been woven into ethnic and religious mythology and has nothing to do with fact.

[Iks]

Hi,

I'm only have a passive interest in revisionism and the holocaust, meaning that I dont actively research but always read articles about the issue when I stuble across them. I didn't want to start a thread for a question that might have been asked lots of times before but I guess it fits in this one here.

On a forum someone said that the lists of deaths in Auschwitz can be looked at in some russian archive and that the numbers you find there arent allowed to be mentioned in Germany. That was countered by someone who posted this link in response:

http://www.h-ref.de/abc/t/totenbuecher.php

Its a site about "arguments against Auschwitz deniers" which basicly says those death records contain 80000 deaths and since none of them lists any gaschambers its taken as proof that no gaschambers existed. It then says that only the deaths of those who worked in the labor camp there are in that book and those who werent able to work were directly sent to extermination without registration. They werent inmates of the laborcamp so they arent on the deathlists.

My question now is how would you argument against that? Is there a site for kind of debunking holocaust denier debunking or something like that? Like a central site with all the arguments of both sides. The problem is that most people who try to look into the issues when sitting in germany will always find sites like http://www.h-ref.de/ since all sites that argument against the propagandized version of the holocaust are banned or cant be accessed. And when you dont know that 1st its not listed on most search engines and 2nd how to work around that problem you will stop there. True that central site will also be blacklisted but then you have something you can link to if someone is interested or to quickly find arguments you can use.

[Hannover]

Iks:

The simplest approach is to realize the alleged murder weapons at Auschwitz/Birkenau, the "gas chambers", are simply impossible as alleged. There is absoutely no proof Jews, or anyone else, were gassed.

Arguments about how many Jews were allegedly gassed is illogical, since the alleged 'gas chambers' cannot have functioned as alleged. It's the old 'How many angels can dance on the head of a pin?' argument. In man-on-the-street language it's simply 'garbage in, garbage out'.

From there you simply move to the alleged enormous mass shootings into pits for which there are no mass graves to support the claims.

It's all very simple.

For details and sub-topics there are many threads on each, have a look.

A good rational, logical, science oriented thread on the alleged Auschwitz gas chambers is on page 1 of the forum:
'Cyanide Chemistry at Auschwitz'
http://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?t=4111

Welcome to The CODOH Revisionist Forum.

Regards, Hannover

[grenadier]

Hi IKs and welcome.
In my humble opinion the best way to learn is to study the literature, so let me recommend to you Rudolf's excellent introduction "Lectures on the Holocaust", it's available for digital download free of cost.
http://www.vho.org/GB/Books/loth/
There is a german edition as well.

As for the Sterbebücher;
The number of deaths in the Auschwitz Sterbebücher is circa 69.000.
It is important to keep in mind that these were only registered inmates and that not all volumes are available, missing are the camp's early months, the year of 1944 and January 45.

Of interest from a revisionist perspective is the fact that in 1991 a german journalist had access to a sample of the data and it turns out that many of the admitted inmates were people over 60 years old or children under 10! Had the story been true - only those capable of work were registered, the others gassed - there wouldn't have been registered inmates belonging to such age groups.

Also, from extrapolating from the figures on the death books, several revisionist authors have calculated the Auschwitz death toll as around 120.000 to 140.000.

I hope this helps you,
Best regards.