Sobibor escapees voluntarily returned / water table

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Hannover
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Sobibor escapees voluntarily returned / water table

Postby Hannover » 1 decade 1 year ago (Fri Sep 05, 2008 2:42 pm)

This is revealing to say the least. An alleged 'death camp', but inmates decided to return. 'Death camp', right.
That several escaped prisoners voluntarily returned to the camp – something which seems almost incredible if Sobibσr indeed was the death camp it is made out to be – is also attested to by one of the local SS officers who assisted in the hunt for the escapees. On March 26, 1961, the former squadron commander of the 1st Squadron of the SS-Polizei-Reiterabteilung III, Erich Wullbrandt, testified before a court in Braunschweig, West Germany:
“During the night and even before, in the evening, a few of the escaped Jews returned to the camp voluntarily. I actually saw four or five prisoners return. They reported to the camp watch by the entrance gate and were taken in by the Hilfswilligen [Ukrainian auxiliaries] who were stationed there. I cannot recall them being ill-treated. The Hilfswilligen took them to the barracks where the other prisoners were. I have no idea what happened to them later. I could not say whether they were shot in the end.”

(ZStL-251/59-5-833; quoted in Jules Schelvis, Sobibor. A History of a Nazi Death Camp, Berg/USHMM Oxford/New York 2007, p. 176).
taken from:
The Ground Water Level at Sobibor 1942-1943, by Thomas Kues
http://www.codoh.com/newrevoices/nrtksgwl.html

This is too easy.

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If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Postby Greg Gerdes » 1 decade 1 year ago (Fri Sep 05, 2008 3:31 pm)

The tunnel had to originate at the stove in the carpentry and exit behind the minefield, a distance of about 35 meters. According to the plan, its height and width would have to be 75 x 75 centimeters and it would need to be 80 centimeters beneath the earth's surface, so that it would not touch the mine holes. It could not go any deeper, because there was a danger that it might strike water."


75c = 30.3 inches
+
80c = 31.5 inches
=
62 inches

So the bottom of the tunnel would have been approximately 62 inches below the surface, at which point "there was a danger that it might strike water."

2 meters = 79 inches

So without a doubt, according to the article, 2 meters would have been the maximum depth of any alleged grave - mass or otherwise.


Remember, Reder claimed that not only were the "huge mass graves" 15 meters deep, but that he dug them himself with an excavator and also personally dragged the bodies from the gas chambers and threw them into the pits.

And, one of - if not the - most "authoritative eyewitness" for the entire jewish holohoax - Gerstein himself, claimed that the "huge mass graves" were 12 meters deep.

If that was the case, then the graves would more accurately have been described as ponds.

BTW, 15 meters = 49 feet!

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Re: Sobibor escapees voluntarily returned / water table

Postby PotPie » 1 decade 4 months ago (Tue Oct 06, 2009 8:00 am)

Of course Thomas Kues' finding will be ignored, as the general holocaust historiography formula is basically this:

1) If anything surfaces from the Germans that contradicts the extermination of the Jews, it's automatically brushed off as Nazi propaganda.

2) If anything surfaces from non-German sources that condtradicts the extermination of the Jews, it's ignored.

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Re: Sobibor escapees voluntarily returned / water table

Postby Mala » 5 years 7 months ago (Mon Jul 14, 2014 2:27 pm)

Greg Gerdes:

So without a doubt, according to the article, 2 meters would have been the maximum depth of any alleged grave - mass or otherwise.


Speaking of Gerdes and the water table at Sobibor, I was perusing the N.A.F.H. website

http://www.nafcash.com/

and came across this:


Sobibor - The 16 alleged “huge mass graves” (#1/49 though #16/64 of the alleged 75) are shown and numbered in the map on page 3 in this link here:

http://sobibor.info.pl/wp-content/uploa ... 2-2013.pdf

Alleged “huge mass grave” #16/64 is the fraudulently alleged “ash mound” / mausoleum / monument.

NOTE: The N.A.F.H. acknowledges that “huge mass graves” - #12/60, #13/61 and #14/62 - have actually been located / proven to exist and contain human remains. (See above link.)


Click on the link and go to pages 8 and 9. There are photos showing the water table at a reported 3.30 meters.

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Re: Sobibor escapees voluntarily returned / water table

Postby Werd » 5 years 7 months ago (Mon Jul 14, 2014 3:58 pm)

Well the holocaust controversies team still haven't come up with an explanation as to how pits at Belzec and Treblinka were dug thirty meters deep. The same number is claimed for Belzec as well as Treblinka as seen here.
Excavators at Belzec
Perhaps the Jews used the kabbalah, created a golem, animated it with life, and he dug the pits for them. :lol:

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Re: Sobibor escapees voluntarily returned / water table

Postby Mala » 5 years 7 months ago (Fri Jul 18, 2014 5:31 pm)

Holocaust controversies claims that there are 30 meter deep graves at Belzec, Chelmno, Sobibor and Treblinka?

I hadn't heard that one before.

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Re: Sobibor escapees voluntarily returned / water table

Postby Hannover » 5 years 7 months ago (Fri Jul 18, 2014 6:21 pm)

Mala wrote:Holocaust controversies claims that there are 30 meter deep graves at Belzec, Chelmno, Sobibor and Treblinka?

I hadn't heard that one before.
Indeed, they say a lot of embarrassing & ridiculous things which cannot stand up to even basic scrutiny.
Ask them to show us the alleged mass graves for the falsely alleged millions of Jews at those sites.
Ask them to show us the alleged human remains for the falsely alleged millions of Jews at those sites.
They have not, they cannot.
Case closed.

recommended: E. Hunt's "Treblinka Archaeology Hoax" Video / READY TO VIEW
Also search here: Belzec, Chelmno, & Sobibor for easily refuted absurdities about those sites.

The 'holocaust' storyline is one of the most easily debunked narratives ever contrived. That is why those who question it are arrested and persecuted. That is why violent, racist, & privileged Jewish supremacists demand censorship.
Truth needs no protection from scrutiny.

The Internet has demolished the lies. The tide is turning.


- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Re: Sobibor escapees voluntarily returned / water table

Postby Werd » 5 years 7 months ago (Fri Jul 18, 2014 9:19 pm)

Mala wrote:Holocaust controversies claims that there are 30 meter deep graves at Belzec, Chelmno, Sobibor and Treblinka?

I hadn't heard that one before.

As you will see in that thread of mine, Roberto Muehlenkamp has quoted Yitzak Arad who claimed pits in Treblinka were 30 meters deep and he just passed over it. Didn't bat an eyelash. He just hopes no one will quiz him on it. He would have to come up with a severely tortured expalnation as to not only how someone could mistake 30 meters for some other set of meters, but also as to how the same damn number showed up in two seperate camps.

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Re: Sobibor escapees voluntarily returned / water table

Postby Mala » 5 years 7 months ago (Sat Jul 19, 2014 12:49 pm)

Werd:

As you will see in that thread of mine, Roberto Muehlenkamp has quoted Yitzak Arad who claimed pits in Treblinka were 30 meters deep and he just passed over it. Didn't bat an eyelash. He just hopes no one will quiz him on it...


I do plan on quizzing him on the subject.


Hannover:

Ask them to show us the alleged mass graves for the falsely alleged millions of Jews at those sites.

Ask them to show us the alleged human remains for the falsely alleged millions of Jews at those sites.


I will ask them about the alleged mass graves.

I will start a new thread.

Thanks.

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Re: Sobibor escapees voluntarily returned / water table

Postby borjastick » 5 years 7 months ago (Sat Jul 19, 2014 1:55 pm)

You are making some assumptions that Roberto will discuss things with you, he probably won't. Roberto and his mates don't want to answer awkward questions or if they agree to they will then try to duck and dive, spin and obfuscate. Why? Because they cannot give you genuine answers, it would be their downfall.

Truth is their enemy.
'Of the four million Jews under Nazi control in WW2, six million died and alas only five million survived.'

'We don't need evidence, we have survivors' - israeli politician

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Re: Sobibor escapees voluntarily returned / water table

Postby Hektor » 5 years 7 months ago (Sun Jul 20, 2014 1:15 pm)

Werd wrote:
Mala wrote:Holocaust controversies claims that there are 30 meter deep graves at Belzec, Chelmno, Sobibor and Treblinka?

I hadn't heard that one before.

As you will see in that thread of mine, Roberto Muehlenkamp has quoted Yitzak Arad who claimed pits in Treblinka were 30 meters deep and he just passed over it. Didn't bat an eyelash. He just hopes no one will quiz him on it. He would have to come up with a severely tortured expalnation as to not only how someone could mistake 30 meters for some other set of meters, but also as to how the same damn number showed up in two seperate camps.

Didn't they got some answer to this from their very own Sturdy Colls investigation?

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Re: Sobibor escapees voluntarily returned / water table

Postby Hannover » 5 years 7 months ago (Sun Jul 20, 2014 1:40 pm)

As you will see in that thread of mine, Roberto Muehlenkamp has quoted Yitzak Arad who claimed pits in Treblinka were 30 meters deep and he just passed over it.
Yitzak Arad? Seriously? He's just another shyster who Revisionists have completely demolished.
Read on.
In his “standard work” about the Reinhard camps, Yitzhak Arad quotes an excerpt from the report of the resistance movement of the Warsaw Ghetto, but shamelessly distorts the text by replacing the embarrassing “steam chambers” with “gas chambers”! 37
source: Hannover @ Juergen Graf on David Irving & the Aktion Reinhardt Camps

much more here:
Treblinka 'expert' Arad taken to task here:
vali @ Lubomyr Prytulak's letter to Arad i.e. - Treblinka

A nice bit of demolition here:
'Lies and obfuscations about Himmler’s Sobibor directive'
http://revblog.codoh.com/2011/05/lies-a ... directive/

Kola, Arad, others demolished on Sobibor 'gas chambers'

Search Arad at this forum and learn

The 'holocaust' storyline is one of the most easily debunked narratives ever contrived. That is why those who question it are arrested and persecuted. That is why violent, racist, & privileged Jewish supremacists demand censorship.
Truth needs no protection from scrutiny.

The Internet has demolished the lies. The tide is turning.


- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Re: Sobibor escapees voluntarily returned / water table

Postby Mala » 5 years 7 months ago (Mon Jul 21, 2014 12:33 pm)

borjastick:

You are making some assumptions that Roberto will discuss things with you, he probably won't. Roberto and his mates don't want to answer awkward questions or if they agree to they will then try to duck and dive, spin and obfuscate. Why? Because they cannot give you genuine answers, it would be their downfall.

Truth is their enemy.


You're right. The best he/they ever seem to do is give misleading half-truths to questions.

But since this thread is about "Sobibor escapees voluntarily returned / water table," I won't discuss HC or it's members here.

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Re: Sobibor escapees voluntarily returned / water table

Postby Mala » 5 years 7 months ago (Thu Jul 24, 2014 12:36 pm)

Hannover:

Ask them to show us the alleged mass graves for the falsely alleged millions of Jews at those sites.

Ask them to show us the alleged human remains for the falsely alleged millions of Jews at those sites.

They have not, they cannot.



Actually, they can show us SOME graves and SOME human remains if they really wanted to.


Look on pages 4 and 15 in this link:

http://sobibor.info.pl/wp-content/uploa ... 2-2013.pdf

And on page 12 in this link:

http://sobibor.info.pl/wp-content/uploa ... n-2013.pdf


So why aren't they showing the world these discoveries?

Don't these "huge mass graves" prove their alleged holocaust claims?

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Re: Sobibor escapees voluntarily returned / water table

Postby ivam » 5 years 7 months ago (Thu Jul 24, 2014 4:06 pm)

all that is visible there are 5 to 6 skelletons, which clear headshotwound, so executions.

no mass grave, no gas chamber no hundred thousands of corpses.

the reason they dont show it or did deeper is because they fear not to find anything more.


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