Zimmerman of 'holocaust' Hist. Proj. routed on cremations

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Hannover
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Zimmerman of 'holocaust' Hist. Proj. routed on cremations

Postby Hannover » 1 decade 6 years ago (Fri Sep 19, 2003 8:33 pm)

As is so easy to do with the so called 'holocau$t' History Project, more of their fraudulence is revealed.

This is courtesy of Cat Scan from CODOH (Committe for Open Debate on the Holocaust story):

Coke consumption for cremations

Zimmerman has addressed these issues in his reply to Mattogno on
the website of The Holocaust History Project.

See his "My Response to Carlo Mattogno" at
http://www.holocaust-history.org.

Actually, Zimmerman doesn't address the issue at all, except to say that in the first place that there might have been other coke deliveries, and second that maybe they used wood from the surrounding forests. Oh yes, and he quotes some eyewitnesses from Dachau!

Actually, these are literal straw-graspings. There is enough data to make it clear -- as well as a document specifying coke consumption -- to show what the amounts of coke involved were, and the fact is that you simply can't burn a body -- ANY BODY -- with 3.5 kg of coke, but that 20-30 kg are required. (That's anywhere from 44 to 66 pounds). Auschwitz never received anywhere near enough coke to burn the alleged million victims.

Substituting a dumb story about using wood doesn't help. Coke is essentially concentrated coal, created in order to get a pure substance that will last comparatively long and generate high heat. You can't get similar BTU's with wood, unless you use _lots_ of it (probably a ratio of 10:1, especially with what must have been green wood, and I doubt if there were 30 kg x 1 million x 10 = 30 million kilos of wood in those little copses near the crematoria. My ratios may be off but the implied 1:1 ratio is ridiculous.

For this and other reasons Zimmerman has abandoned the claim that a million people were cremated in the crematoria, and now claims that no more than 500,000 were. That number can't be sustained either, with what we know of energy consumption, but at least it's an improvement.
Of course, he also implies -- but does not state -- that the other 500,000 were burned in pits. Well, since over half of the Auschwitz victims are supposed to have been killed in the last six months the camp was in operation, those must have been some mighty big pits. Yet giant pits of the kind that would be required -- assuming it was even possible to do this -- do not show up in the aerial photos.

In the same way there's the issue of how effective pit burning is with newly dead bodies. The answer is not effective at all. Even pit burnings with long dead bodies do not consume the bodies entirely, nor, for that matter, were the bodies from Dresden entirely consumed. The burning dries out and shrinks the mass, which is then buried somewhere else (again, as at Dresden), it also kills any pathogens. It doesn't generate sufficient heat to make the bodies "disappear."

So where are all of these hundreds of thousands of bodies?
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Postby SergeyRomanov » 1 decade 6 years ago (Fri Sep 19, 2003 8:57 pm)

Zimmerman has abandoned the claim that a million people were cremated in the crematoria


OK, let's see Zimmerman's old claim. Citation, please.

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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 6 years ago (Fri Sep 19, 2003 9:24 pm)

Sergey,

That is the number currently used by True Believers in general. It was not stated that Zimmerman originated the number.

A quick Google search does the job of producing the typical unsubstantiated religious dogma and fraudulent numbers:
These ovens were where more than 1 million bodies, most of them Jews, were burned over a three-year period...

http://www.service.com/PAW/morgue/cover ... VER25.html


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Postby SergeyRomanov » 1 decade 6 years ago (Sat Sep 20, 2003 7:05 am)

Nope, you did not get it. CatScan alleges that Zimmerman said that 1.000.000 corpses were cremated in crematoria. This is not " used by True Believers in general". Thus, if the original citation will not be provided, I'll assume that CatScan lied about Zimmerman.

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Postby TMoran » 1 decade 6 years ago (Sat Sep 20, 2003 9:49 am)

SergeyRomanov says:
"Nope, you did not get it. CatScan alleges that Zimmerman said that 1.000.000 corpses were cremated in crematoria. This is not " used by True Believers in general". Thus, if the original citation will not be provided, I'll assume that CatScan lied about Zimmerman."

======================================================================

Zimmerman wrote two treatments. One can be found on The Holocaust History Project (THHP) and the other was in the form of a book. Having read Zimmerman's treatment on THHP I get a picture of him burning himself out. It's perhaps the most tormented writing I've ever seen.

A few years ago I had a fairly extensive e-mail exchange with Zimmerman. In one of them, along with other absurdities he said Mark Van Alstine (deceased) arrived at pin pointing Bunker I or II in the Allied aerial recon shots by viewing them in John Ball's book 'Air Photo Evidence' using a lupe. Seeing how the photos were printed with 'dot matrix' looking at them with a lupe only makes things worse.

The biggest indictment for Zimmerman's book is that not even his own associates refer to it during any debates.

As far as "lied", mistaken or distortions go we may have a little boo boo with whether or not Zimmerman opted for a lower figure in order to make the oven cremations more feasible but Zimmerman's attempts are totally corrupt.

Since those persons and organizations that are so closely reliant on the Holocaust story get their way with things so easily as if they were cutting butter they can tend to put out material recklessly and Zimmerman's stuff is an ideal example.

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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 6 years ago (Sat Sep 20, 2003 1:29 pm)

Sergey,
It would be helpful to actually read my posts.

For this and other reasons Zimmerman has abandoned the claim that a million people were cremated in the crematoria, ......

the claim, Sergey, not his claim.


And ofcourse, you failed to address the lack of alleged massive pits.

You failed to address the fuel issue.

You failed to address the problems of pit burning.

You failed to explain away the lack of physical evidence to support the allegations.

In fact, you dodged the points completely.

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Postby SergeyRomanov » 1 decade 6 years ago (Sat Sep 20, 2003 1:36 pm)

Pits, fuel, etc. are interesting points, but first we must establish that CatScan can be trusted in matters related to Zimmerman (we're talking about him, don't forget about it).

the claim, Sergey, not his claim.


Of course "his", since he could not abandon "not his" claim.

Besides, who ever made a claim about 1.000.000 cremated in crematoria?

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Postby Moderator » 1 decade 6 years ago (Sat Sep 20, 2003 1:50 pm)

Sergey,

Debate specifics or leave, simple. The thread is clear about issues you try to deflect and obfuscate.
You are ignoring the guidelines by dodging, time after time.

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Only lies need to be shielded from debate, truth welcomes it.


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