high school student needs help

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RevisionistHM
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high school student needs help

Postby RevisionistHM » 9 years 11 months ago (Wed Dec 23, 2009 9:40 pm)

Hi all. I am a high school student and I am new here I emailed Mr Smith and was talking to him about a situation I have been facing in school. I take a Holocaust/Genocide elective class where the teacher only teaches her side of the story and refuses to hear anything involved with revisionism as she feels that is denial and it should be stopped. Mr. Smith said to keep things brief,so I just wanted to ask what I can do in terms of slowly disproving what she is saying either through asking the 2 questions that Mr. Smith said to ask or presenting facts to her. I just want to show her the "other"side of things and though she may not believe them it may open her eyes a bit more.

I just don't like that we only hear about gas chambers and other "horrors" of the holuhoax, and that when I try asking questions I get referred to USHMM or pictures of the camps etc. It would be very appreciated if you guys had some advice as to what to do. Thank you everyone.

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Re: high school student needs help

Postby Mojo » 9 years 11 months ago (Thu Dec 24, 2009 7:39 am)

Welcome to the forum. I'd like to say, it's good to see younger people waking up to the holocaust. I was over 40 before I found out there were people that challenged the popular story. What started me down the hole was the fact that it is illegal in 12 countries to "deny" or question the official version of the holocaust, in some of them you will be jailed, in others, they will try to have you extradited to one of the countries that will jail you. There's something very wrong with that, as I believe truth does not fear investigation. You can write books or publicly say whatever you want about any other "genocide" in history without facing the reprecussions you do challenging the holocaust. Questioning something doesn't equal hate.

If you haven't already, I recommend watching the videos at holocaustdenialvideos.com. There's some good information there.

Greg Gerdes always asks this very good & pertinent question... Where are the remains of the bodies of millions of jews? There has yet to be a mass grave of human ash uncovered in any camp & he's willing to pay money to anyone that can produce 1/10th of 1% of teeth or bones from a single camp.

David Cole had a list of I believe 46 questions that is very good. It's sometimes hard to use Cole as a reference as he had a hit put out on him by the JDL after his documentary on Auschwitz started gaining attention. He understandably recanted his revisionist ways and vanished from the public eye. There have been several revisionsts that were attacked by thugs or had their homes or businesses firebombed over the years.

I hope some of the regulars here reply to your thread, like Smith, they have been researching this topic for decades and have much more to offer than I do. Good luck with your studies, and don't let the bastards beat you down.

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Re: high school student needs help

Postby SevenUp » 9 years 11 months ago (Thu Dec 24, 2009 9:26 am)

A fascinating topic. I've given it a lot of thought. First, everyone in the US has been conditioned for 50 years to believe the holohoax. So, you can't 'disprove' it with a few questions or facts. You probably won't be able to 'convince' anyone of anything, and you'll be amazed at the counterarguments that you'll get at every turn. So, don't go in with high expectations.

You don't need to ask any questions. You need to state facts that are irrefutable. So, you'll need documentation. Even with documentation, no fact will be believed, and every fact will be challenged. That's OK, your job is not to 'convince' anyone, it's impossible to overcome years of brainwashing with facts or arguments, instead, your goal is to challenge them and to pique their curiosity and and create an active interest. If you can do that, you've succeeded.

Also, there are two related but separate issues, one, what happened during the war, and two, the holohoax, which is the lies told about what happened during the war. Here is why this is important, many of the holohoax lies are obvious, you don't need to know the history of the war to know that they are lies.

Here is one good example, the USHMM website says that millions of Jews were shipped to extermination centers where they were killed in 'specially developed gassing facilities'. Two hoax gas chambers, one at Auschwitz, and one at Majdanek, are in existence and shown to visitors every day. How do we know that they are fakes without knowing anything at all about WW II? Because both have unbarred plate glass windows that a prisoner about to be gassed could break and escape through. Unbelievable? Apparently not, as visitors see these 'gas chambers' every day and don't laugh at the obvious absurdity of a gas chamber with a window. This shows the incredible power of years of brainwashing. How to document the windows? Show pictures. Will the pictures be challenged? Of course.

Now, showing that these gas chambers are obvious hoaxes has implications. What does is say about the Auschwitz and Majdanek museum directors and staff, about the USHMM, about the whole holohoax establishment. The point is the lies are blatant, obvious. This means that the persons telling them are fools or liars. They are not fools. The phony gas chambers are at the very heart of the holohoax, and they indict the whole holohoax establishment.

Now, there is a web page at http://www.holohoax101.com that lists and documents many proofs that the holocaust is a hoax. And, there is a flyer that you can print and distribute. If you'll PM me I'll print up the flyers for you to distribute in class and mail them to you. You'll rock their socks, I guarantee.

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Re: high school student needs help

Postby Ilikerealhistory » 9 years 11 months ago (Fri Dec 25, 2009 4:41 pm)

RevisionistHM wrote:I take a Holocaust/Genocide elective class ...


How long is this elective class, the whole year? Is one of your assignments to create a fake holocaust memoir?

The biggest problem is that too many people (think they) benefit from the holocaust lie.

Look at what the holocaust supporters admit did NOT happen, and if you teacher brings up any of these fallacies, use the supporters evidence against her.

some fallacies:
Soap, lampshade, and shrunken heads from jews
Ann Frank was gassed (she died of typhoid)
Hitler's "big lie" (he warned people to watch out for it)

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Re: high school student needs help

Postby Pappy Yokum » 9 years 11 months ago (Fri Dec 25, 2009 6:05 pm)

That is rough. Since you are enrolled in an elective class dedicated to this topic, it is going to be impossible to change the teacher's mind. She is committed.
The situation is not conducive to spreading to the truth because, as a student, the idea is to pass the class. If you don't care about your grade, then it is fine to ask impertinent questions or point out contradictory facts. If you are going to ask about contradictory facts you are going to have to point to sources the teacher can't summarily dismiss. For instance, since the IMT trials is a major source of Holocaust dogma, you can point out that Goering, Streicher, Lammers, and Rosenberg all said on the witness stand that there was no extermination policy. Hans Frank said he didn't know about it until Hoess testified. If one is to believe the testimony of low level people like Hoess, why not believe high ranking people like these men? Is it just a matter of believing what you want? Why didn't the RAF know about Auschwitz? Why didn't the Vatican? Why didn't the Red Cross? Why didn't the U.S. or Britain bring the issue up with the Swiss and ask that the German government to investigate the war crimes of Germans killing civilians? There was a whole system set up to investigate war crimes during the war. The Switzerland was the neutral third party that was to convey complaints from the Allies to the German government. The Germans had a war crimes bureau. It was never asked to investigate the allegation that the Nazis were killing the Jews.

You can ask for evidence other than testimony. Ask what specific "documents" used as evidence actually say. They will tell you the Nazis used code words. Ask how they know that without using testimony.

Remember, a classroom isn't a free market for ideas and information. The teacher is going to have the advantage. The more you know about the Holocaust and revisionist research, the better position you will be in to challenge what is being presented in class. We can help with specific questions and direct you to information, but as the student, you are not going to be allowed to make the teacher look bad. I don't think I would take a class like that unless I didn't need the credit just wanted to have some fun making the instructor upset.

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Re: high school student needs help

Postby Friedrich Paul Berg » 9 years 11 months ago (Fri Dec 25, 2009 11:02 pm)

Just ask your teacher lots of really simple questions--the simpler the better--like: Are there any photos of corpses of people who were killed in gas chambers? If so, where? If she claims there are such photos, let her try to prove the corpses were of people who were gassed. Where is the forensic evidence such as autopsy reports? If not, why not?

The simple truth is that there are absolutely no photos or autopsy reports anywhere of people who were gassed--and for those holocaust believers who know anything at all about the subject, that is well known. More than likely, your teacher does not even know that. So challenge her to provide autopsy reports as evidence.

Can your teacher identify even one person with any proof that on a particular date and place they were gassed? Of course, not!

All their evidence is anecdotal blah-blah-blah, at best with a few words here and there from German sources taken completely out of context. The so-called "eyewitnesses," have absolutely no forensic proof to support their stories.

Friedrich Paul Berg
Learn everything at http://www.nazigassings.com
Nazi Gassings Never Happened! Niemand wurde vergast!
The Holocaust story is a hoax because 1) no one was killed by the Nazis in gas chambers, 2) the total number of Jews who died in Nazi captivity is miniscule compared to what is alleged.

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Re: high school student needs help

Postby GurtKerstein » 9 years 11 months ago (Sat Dec 26, 2009 12:44 am)

Personally, I wouldn't even try to argue your case in a class dedicated to teaching that myth. It's like arguing with a creationists who believes that earth was created in 7 days. There will be some people in your class who will be open minded and with the vast amount of info on the internet, you can point them to the gaping holes in the traditional Holocaust narrative. The teacher is just teaching you what she was taught or read in a book, don't expect her to concede or give you any straight answers.

But if you insist, use Faurisson's challenge: show me or draw me a nazi homicidal gas chamber.
The Emperor cannot see the cloth, but pretends that he can for fear of appearing stupid; his ministers do the same. A child in the crowd calls out that the Emperor is wearing nothing. The Emperor holds himself up proudly and continues the procession.

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Re: high school student needs help

Postby Gébé Tremblay » 9 years 11 months ago (Sat Dec 26, 2009 2:21 pm)

Personnally, the question of if there really was a genocide of the european jewish population is irrelevant .

The question that is important to me is if the german people committed such a crime. That is the important question to me because it is a matter of conscience. It is this terrible accusation that we are told to support without any strong evidence or proof. This is totally unnacceptable.

To support such an accusation against a whole nation I need very strong evidence. That evidence has not yet been presented to me.

My liberty of conscience and the lack of proof gives me every right to refuse to support such a claim.

So for me the only question for those accusators is "how can you accuse someone of such a crime without any proof ?".

In some countries in Europe they jail people for not supporting this unproven accusation. That is dictatorship.

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Re: high school student needs help

Postby SevenUp » 9 years 11 months ago (Sat Dec 26, 2009 4:33 pm)

GurtKerstein wrote:But if you insist, use Faurisson's challenge: show me or draw me a nazi homicidal gas chamber.


There is something very badly wrong with Faurisson's challenge. The holohoax establishment will not only show him a nazi homicidal gas chamber, they will give him a guided tour. There are 'actual' gas chambers at Auschwitz and Majdanek with daily visitors tours.

Faurisson's question implies that he is not familiar with these 'actual' gas chambers. So, the holohoax establishment tells an easily demonstrable whopper, that the 'gas chambers' at Auschwitz and Majdanek are 'real', and they are given a free pass.

The holohoax establishment must be held accountable for it's obvious blatant lies. These lies indict the whole hoax establishment, from top to bottom. Faurisson appears to me to be giving the hoaxers a free pass to tell any absurdity, and then waiting patiently to hear the next one.

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Re: high school student needs help

Postby GurtKerstein » 9 years 11 months ago (Sat Dec 26, 2009 5:32 pm)

The holohoax establishment will not only show him a nazi homicidal gas chamber, they will give him a guided tour.


I wouldn't discount Faurisson so easily. His challenge points to the heart of the Holocaust controversy and is very valid. Once they show you the 'gas chamber' at Auschwitz or the ones at Majdanek, the next question should be: does this look like a place where homicidal gassings could take place? Do you think people could be gassed in rooms with no doors, or rooms with glass windows? etc.

Of course most believers will not snap back to reality facing this obvious contradiction much like a Christian will not turn atheist in one minute if you point out inconsistencies with the Christian narrative. But some people who consider the Holocaust an established historical fact will at least start thinking. If they are interested in learning the truth (most people aren't) they will find out by themselves on the internet or may pose further questions which can be easily answered.
Last edited by GurtKerstein on Sun Jan 03, 2010 10:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The Emperor cannot see the cloth, but pretends that he can for fear of appearing stupid; his ministers do the same. A child in the crowd calls out that the Emperor is wearing nothing. The Emperor holds himself up proudly and continues the procession.

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Re: high school student needs help

Postby jheitwler » 9 years 11 months ago (Tue Dec 29, 2009 6:07 pm)

Don't refer to it as the "holohoax." Be respectful toward the event and the teacher. You will get much further if you present the image of a student who unquestionably accepts the holocaust story but is having a little trouble understanding some of the specifics. If you're identified as a revisionist everything you say will be dismissed as the ranting of a neo-Nazi.

When you quote from sources, never quote from revisionist literature. Fortunately, you don't need to because revisionist literature is frequently very well footnoted and references the standard works of the holocaust. Instead of saying "Arthur Butz says that...." follow the footnotes in Butz's book and see where HE got the information. If you can say "Hilberg says this this and this but here he says that that and that..." you cannot be immediately dismissed. I realize it's plagurism to take somebody elses ideas and pass them off as your own but you'll never get anywhere if you're known to have been reading Rudolf, Zundel, Leuchter, etc.

Do the math and ask the teacher about it. Point out that Arad says X number of people were murdered in a gas chamber. That gas chamber was Y square feet. That means that Z people were able to fit into one square foot. That seems like a lot of people! Is that right?

Ask if there are any documents that mention the extermination of the Jews without euphemisms or coded language. Ask about the evolution of this coded language. The Germans have a reputation for being detail oriented and precise. When orders were given euphemistically, how did the recipient know exactly what was being ordered? How did the euphemistic language work across various language, e.g., when Germans gave orders to Ukranians or Poles? Is there some sort of rosetta stone or translation dictionary that allowed the imprecise coded language to be deciphered? If the Germans meant 'extermination' when they said 'evacuation to the East', what did they say when they meant 'evacuation to the East?'

Ask why the Soviets didn't take pictures of the mass graves they surely discovered at Treblinka, Sobibor, or Bezec. There's one or two photos of a mass grave at Treblinka but it's clearly not a mass grave. It's certainly nothing like the mass graves at Belsen which isn't even claimed to be a death camp.

Ask the teacher what we know about the Action Reinhard death camps that does not come from eyewitness testimony in conncection with war crimes trials.

NEVER ever suggest that the holocaust was fabricated by the Jews so they could get the state of Israel or that Jewish control of the media is the reason everybody believes the holocaust. Leave the Jews out it!

Don't expect to change the teacher's mind. Don't expect to change any of the other student's minds. The best you can hope for is to plant the seeds of doubt in a few other people's minds without failing and/or getting beat up after class.
"First of all there is the fact that if we assume the Holocaust to have happened more or less as told, all the evidence becomes intelligible, while if we assume it was a hoax, most of the evidence does not make any sense." - Robert Jan Van Pelt

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Re: high school student needs help

Postby Malle » 9 years 11 months ago (Tue Dec 29, 2009 6:20 pm)

jheitwler, good post! :wink:
I must be a mushroom - because everyone keeps me in the dark and feeds me with lots of bullshit.

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Re: high school student needs help

Postby RevisionistHM » 9 years 11 months ago (Thu Dec 31, 2009 12:33 am)

Sorry I have been without a computer for awhike, but I really appreciate everyone's replies.

jheitwler, I would never use "holuhoax" or anything like that. I will just be one who accepts the story and does research outside of the class, and I will ask questions like the ones you put in your post.

If you or anyone have more specific questions to ask it would be very appreciated as I don't have access to 3tad, hilberg, etc unless those are online somewhere. Sorry if this is a stupid statement/question but I am new to this. Thank you everyone.

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Re: high school student needs help

Postby Rollo the Ganger » 9 years 9 months ago (Wed Feb 10, 2010 4:03 pm)

To RevisionistHM; welcome to the REAL world. Isn't that an oxymoron? Here's a question that may serve to highlight the situation: How do we know you really are a high-school student? The fact is we don't and we can only take your word for it unless you have definitive proof and that goes for everything in life. My only suggestion is to take the class simply as one side of the story. It's useless to argue about it with the teacher and it could affect your grade and the teacher's job would be on the line if she taught it otherwise. That's not your battle. Your education on the matter is YOUR responsibility, not the school's. Keep studying all your life. When I was in high-school it wasn't even called "The Holocaust". That is something that came along later with a big PR push to make it an industry. The "definite" total of deaths then was 5 Million, now it's 6 Million. And the truth is many people revelled in the thought that it happened and believed the Nazi's only did what everyone else wanted to do. Now it's just the opposite and few rational people believe it at all as this website shows. Young people are special targets for public propaganda. I remember in elementary school, which was during the height of the cold war, being shown movies of people being shot by a firing squad to show how nasty the Communist Cuban Revolutionaries were. Maybe they were nasty fellows but unbeknownst to the teachers showing the movie I had inside info on the matter and I knew these were films of Nicaraguan Rebels, supported by the United States, shooting only God knows Who. I deemed it best to keep my mouth shut. It was the same with Religion. It was asked in school; "What religion are you?" "None" was not an option. Oppression of the Mind was worse then. Thankfully today we have greater access to information thanks to the Internet. Imagine a world where the only information available was either from a public or school library, magazines, newspapers and TV. Back then you were lucky to have three channels to watch. Real dissent did not begin to appear until the Vietnam War. My advice; be objective and skeptical, study and read all you can. Apply the "acid test" to ALL information, pro or con, and don't allow a bias affect your outlook. Ask yourself if the evidence would stand up in court. The "BIG LIE" doesn't just pertain to this thing now called "The Holocaust". It is involved with many other things. Take Dr. Martin Luther King for example. Not a bad fellow really, but certainly not the person they make him out to be today. He is the only American person who has a holiday named after him by name. What happened to George Washington's birthday? When he was assassinated my first thought was; "How long before they make a saint out of this guy?" The truth was he was on his way to being long forgotten. He had his fifteen minutes of fame and the radical blacks were getting all the press at the time. His assassination deified him. He is now part of the "BIG LIE". The holocaust is a fairy-tale, like other pseudo-religious stories. Believers will not listen to you so don't try. As that great American war criminal, Robert McNamara once said: "Logic will not save you." Put that in your pipe and smoke it, kid.

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Re: high school student needs help

Postby Bankdraft » 9 years 9 months ago (Sun Feb 14, 2010 10:46 pm)

Typically these "High-school project" bits are a set-up but I'll nibble...

Ask the teacher why the Jewish holocaust gets so much more attention when there have been worse atrocities? Tell her you saw a Glenn Beck segment and he (Beck) said that communist had murdered/killed an estimated 100 million people which is why you ask.

Ask her who actually did the liberating of the death camps? And who provided some of the most damning evidence at Nuremberg? Establish that it was the Soviets and then ask if the Soviets had any animosity toward the Germans? (I.e. reasons to embellish or out and out lie)

Ask her why it was called the Trial of the Major War Criminals and not the Trial of the Major War Defendants? They had not yet been convicted so they were defendants as opposed to criminals.

Ask her what the Ukrainian Holodomor was?
Some stories are true that never happened. ~ Elie Wiesel ~


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