the gas chambers question

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blackelvis
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the gas chambers question

Postby blackelvis » 9 years 8 months ago (Sat Feb 06, 2010 9:23 pm)

so fred leuchter found no gas residue on the walls at auchwitz,but after watching david cole at auchwitz its admitted the gas chamber shown to tourists is a reconstruction,so my question is how are u going to get gas residue from a reconstructed gas chamber?

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Re: the gas chambers question

Postby Mojo » 9 years 8 months ago (Sat Feb 06, 2010 9:50 pm)

I think you meant to post this question in this thread --> viewtopic.php?f=2&t=4111

blackelvis
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Re: the gas chambers question

Postby blackelvis » 9 years 8 months ago (Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:08 pm)

i think the moderator would of removed the thread if it wasnt allowed here,aside from the fact my question on the other thread could get lost in the shuffle

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Re: the gas chambers question

Postby SevenUp » 9 years 8 months ago (Sun Feb 07, 2010 10:52 am)

The short answer is that they didn't 'reconstruct' the walls.

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ginger
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Re: the gas chambers question

Postby ginger » 9 years 8 months ago (Sun Feb 07, 2010 1:24 pm)

The gas chamber story is full of flaws. It is a negative, foul and obscene. Religious leaders and educators should have torn it down years ago because it is a negative.

But a story with such mind numbing effect on people, especially young people, has become an effective tool for raising money. In Western culture one would be a fool to debunk such a lucrative myth.

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Re: the gas chambers question

Postby Wahrheit » 9 years 8 months ago (Sun Feb 07, 2010 4:39 pm)

blackelvis wrote:so fred leuchter found no gas residue on the walls at auchwitz,but after watching david cole at auchwitz its admitted the gas chamber shown to tourists is a reconstruction,so my question is how are u going to get gas residue from a reconstructed gas chamber?


Cyanide has indeed been found in the walls of Crematorium I (Rudolf found races in six of his seven samples from there), in addition to the Birkenau crematories. The question is: how did it get there?

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Re: the gas chambers question

Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 9 years 8 months ago (Sun Feb 07, 2010 5:08 pm)

Alleged gas chamber in the Cole video isn't the one they tested. The one they tested is seen in the movie Mr. Death. It has a collapsed roof and you have to crawl in. Is this right anyone?

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Re: the gas chambers question

Postby Wahrheit » 9 years 8 months ago (Sun Feb 07, 2010 5:26 pm)

Carto's Cutlass Supreme wrote:Alleged gas chamber in the Cole video isn't the one they tested. The one they tested is seen in the movie Mr. Death. It has a collapsed roof and you have to crawl in. Is this right anyone?


CCS, they tested all Krema gas chambers. Cole focused on the reconstruction of Krema I, which was subject to several tests.

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Re: the gas chambers question

Postby Thesaint » 9 years 8 months ago (Sun Feb 07, 2010 6:38 pm)

Wahrheit wrote:The question is: how did it get there?


Err,no Wahrheit,the question is:

Given the minutest of trace amounts found in the samples(which were also found in other "non-lethal" camp buildings-consistent with infrequent "non lethal" pesticide applications),how can the holohoax narrative of there being constant gassings for extended periods in these "gas chambers" utilising Zyklon-B with it`s known chemical properties and behaviour,possibly be true?
"We didn't call survivors," says Lipstadt, "because first of all we didn't want to subject them to cross-examination by this guy. He (Irving) would have destroyed them."
- Jerusalem Post 6/16/00

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Re: the gas chambers question

Postby Wahrheit » 9 years 8 months ago (Mon Feb 08, 2010 9:07 am)

Thesaint wrote:
Wahrheit wrote:The question is: how did it get there?


Err,no Wahrheit,the question is:

Given the minutest of trace amounts found in the samples(which were also found in other "non-lethal" camp buildings-consistent with infrequent "non lethal" pesticide applications),how can the holohoax narrative of there being constant gassings for extended periods in these "gas chambers" utilising Zyklon-B with it`s known chemical properties and behaviour,possibly be true?


Not really, for we have a workable scenario to explain those traces, supported by the available evidence (homicidal gassings). This narrative is not contradicted by the alleged "minutest" amounts of cyanide because, as Germar Rudolf agrees/states, if no iron-cyanide compounds formed, very little cyanide would remain on the walls post-1945. As no iron-cyanide compounds formed...

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Re: the gas chambers question

Postby Moderator3 » 9 years 8 months ago (Mon Feb 08, 2010 1:54 pm)

Wahrheit, stop going around in circles and avoiding the rebuttals to your position. This topic is discussed fully at: 'Cyanide Chemistry at Auschwitz' viewtopic.php?f=2&t=4111 and other threads which you ignore.

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Re: the gas chambers question

Postby Wahrheit » 9 years 8 months ago (Mon Feb 08, 2010 2:17 pm)

Moderator3 wrote:Wahrheit, stop going around in circles and avoiding the rebuttals to your position. This topic is discussed fully at: 'Cyanide Chemistry at Auschwitz' http://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=4111 and other threads which you ignore.


Nothing has been ignored; all relevant threads have been read in full, and several times. An explanation of the actual cyanide traces has not been of any interest to the "revisionist" posters in the given thread(s); instead, the focus is on how small the cyanide traces are, and how they supposedly could not possibly support homicidal gassings.

Such is why I asked Astro3 himself how we would account for the cyanide found. The rebuttals refocus the debate on the small cyanide levels (i.e., no discussion of the origins of the cyanide). And that is "going around in circles."

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Re: the gas chambers question

Postby JustTheTruth » 9 years 8 months ago (Mon Feb 08, 2010 2:28 pm)

Surely, if thousands of recently-arrived Jews were entering an underground facility and undressing during a typhus epidemic, there would be an need to delouse these facilities with Zyklon-B from time to time?

This may not have been standard procedure for crematorium morgues, but standard morgues were not dealing with thousands of typhoid victims each week.

Would this explain the miniscule residual level on the walls of the "gas" chambers or morgue?

Were there any samples taken from the other rooms in the underground chambers for comparison such as the mortuary room, undressing room ect?

Simply comparing the "gassing" rooms with the delousing facilities will inevitably provide inconclusive results would it not?

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Re: the gas chambers question

Postby ginger » 9 years 8 months ago (Mon Feb 08, 2010 2:38 pm)

Wahrheit

you write "Not really, for we have a workable scenario to explain those traces, supported by the available evidence (homicidal gassings)..."

Why is this a workable scenario to your mind? In my opinion you grasp at straws.

The story is that almost 3 million people died in gas chambers, or is it 2 million, or is it 1 million...(how many died in gas chambers? )

Yet there is not one corpse and no forensics to support the story, although a workable scenario exists in your mind. The camps were not designed as factories of death (David Cole in "46 Questions about Gas Chambers"), and Carlos Mattagno, in his book on Treblinka, shows that the Soviets, in summer of 1944, could find no direct evidence of gas chambers there.

Strangely enough, there can be no open debate in schools and colleges, and in science and engineering classes, in the West, challenging the gas chamber scenario. Why, as a culture, does the West forbid such challenges? Maybe because the gas chamber story has become a religious belief and it is not nice to trash peoples' religion. But I would answer that the gas chamber cult is a negative influence in world culture, like devil worship, and it should be challenged vigorously.

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Re: the gas chambers question

Postby Wahrheit » 9 years 8 months ago (Mon Feb 08, 2010 2:53 pm)

JustTheTruth wrote:Surely, if thousands of recently-arrived Jews were entering an underground facility and undressing during a typhus epidemic, there would be an need to delouse these facilities with Zyklon-B from time to time?

This may not have been standard procedure for crematorium morgues, but standard morgues were not dealing with thousands of typhoid victims each week.

Would this explain the miniscule residual level on the walls of the "gas" chambers or morgue?


JustTheTruth,

While the scenario makes more sense than others proposed, it still would not explain the small cyanide traces. If the rooms were deloused, then much larger concentrations of cyanide gas would have come into contact with the underground morgues' walls and for a longer period of time (pellets would fully outgas) than with homicidal gassings.

Of course, the higher concentration of cyanide leads to a greater likelihood of Prussian Blue formation.

It also is a seemingly contradictory scenario, as the camp's morgues would be too busy with cleaning the arriving inmates to deal with all of the corpses (though the largest typhus outbreak was over before the Birkenau Kremas came online).

Were there any samples taken from the other rooms in the underground chambers for comparison such as the mortuary room, undressing room ect?

Simply comparing the "gassing" rooms with the delousing facilities will inevitably provide inconclusive results would it not?


Inmate barracks have been tested, which may have been deloused on an occasion. Cyanide levels in the alleged gas-chambers still typically run higher than amount found in such a control (see both Rudolf and the Krakow Institute's studies).


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