Question about Hoess Memoir

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The Warden
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Re: Question about Hoess Memoir

Postby The Warden » 8 years 10 months ago (Thu Jan 06, 2011 9:54 am)

Has anyone seen the actual memoir? Is is sitting in an archive somewhere?
I'd like to see some handwriting experts take a look at it and compare it to anything from documents pre-war or during the war from Hoess.

The claim he wrote it should be easily enough to verify using the memoir and other documents. I'd also like to see the handwriting experts compare the memoir to some of the guards, interrogators, and others involved with Hoess during his prison sentence. Now of course, if it is his handwriting, that only means he wrote the words on the paper, it doesn't necessarily mean he wasn't handed something to copy or tortured during the process. It would be interesting to see if the writing was done under stress or showed signs of inconsistency. The process should start somewhere instead of the usual "I said so" evidence that seems to be prevalent throughout this story.
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Re: Question about Hoess Memoir

Postby trevor » 8 years 10 months ago (Thu Jan 06, 2011 10:16 am)

Hoess repeatedly claimed the figures totally in accord with the communist lies:

Hoess unsigned affidavit in English:
I commanded Auschwitz until 1 December 1943, and estimate that at least 2,500,000 victims were executed and exterminated there by gassing and burning, and at least another half million succumbed to starvation and disease, making a total dead of about 3,000,000. This figure represents about 70% or 80% of all persons sent to Auschwitz as prisoners, the remainder having been selected and used for slave labor in the concentration camp industries. Included among the executed and burnt were approximately 20,000 Russian prisoners of war (previously screened out of Prisoner of War cages by the Gestapo) who were delivered at Auschwitz in Wehrmacht transports operated by regular Wehrmacht officers and men. The remainder of the total number of victims included about 100,000 German Jews, and great numbers of citizens (mostly Jewish) from Holland, France, Belgium, Poland, Hungary, Czechoslovakia, Greece, or other countries. We executed about 400,000 Hungarian Jews alone at Auschwitz in the summer of 1944.[16]”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rudolf_H%C3%B6ss

Signed:
"I personally arranged on orders received from Himmler in May 1941 the gassing of two million persons between June/July 1941 and the end of 1943 during which time I was commandant of Auschwitz."
http://www.zundelsite.org/english/debat ... 1-full.jpg

Signed:
"I declare herewith under oath that in the years 1941 to 1943 during my tenure in office as commandant of Auschwitz concentration camp 2 million Jews were put to death by gassing and about 1/2 million by other means."
http://de.academic.ru/pictures/dewiki/104/hoess5.gif
http://www.scrapbookpages.com/Auschwitz ... idavit.jpg

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Re: Question about Hoess Memoir

Postby trevor » 8 years 10 months ago (Thu Jan 06, 2011 11:51 am)

The Warden wrote:I'd like to see some handwriting experts take a look at it and compare it to anything from documents pre-war or during the war from Hoess.



He most likely did write them and most of it is true. But they forced him to add extermination by gassing and all that jazz. His wife and five kids were not handed over to Russians so it was obviously a good deal.

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Re: Question about Hoess Memoir

Postby Ilikerealhistory » 8 years 10 months ago (Thu Jan 06, 2011 3:56 pm)

Visfor wrote:He was tortured by the Brits. I don't know if anybody yet claims that he was tortured by the communists or if they do what sources do they have? I know that the safety of his family is a serious issue. I know that their is no original copy of his memoir available. I have heard that the communists commanded him to write the memoir which if true would seriously undermine the credibility of the memoir.


If the communists had him, they tortured him.

if you need proof that the communists tortured people read this pdf:
http://www.jrbooksonline.com/PDF_Books/AntiHumans.pdf

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Re: Question about Hoess Memoir

Postby Christof » 8 years 10 months ago (Thu Jan 06, 2011 4:46 pm)

I read Commandant of Auschwitz a couple of years ago, unfortunately I lost my notes on it but of the many passages that struck me as odd, one in particular stands out:

In these pages, and also in my sketches of the leading personalities concerned, I have sufficiently explained how the horrors of the concentration camps could come about.
I for my part never sanctioned them.I myself never maltreated a prisoner, far less killed one.Nor have I ever tolerated maltreatment by my subordinates.

pg.198

This is well after he describes witnessing the first gassings at Auschwitz.
"All the concentration camps were, after all, vast transit camps.The inmates were constantly changing, passing from one camp to another, coming and going." Balachowsky:IMT vol.VI pg.317

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Re: Question about Hoess Memoir

Postby The Warden » 8 years 10 months ago (Thu Jan 06, 2011 5:45 pm)

trevor wrote:
The Warden wrote:I'd like to see some handwriting experts take a look at it and compare it to anything from documents pre-war or during the war from Hoess.



He most likely did write them and most of it is true. But they forced him to add extermination by gassing and all that jazz. His wife and five kids were not handed over to Russians so it was obviously a good deal.


Most likely, I'd like a handwriting expert to tell me so.
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Re: Question about Hoess Memoir

Postby SevenUp » 8 years 10 months ago (Fri Jan 07, 2011 9:16 am)

To understand how easy it is to obtain false confessions, see the Frontline show 'The Confessions' (google it) which covers in pretty extensive detail a case where four US Navy sailors, stationed in Va., made false confessions to raping and killing a woman that they had no connection with whatever. They provided graphic narratives of the rape and killing, they changed their testimony as the court demanded, they testified against each other, and so on. It's an unbelievable case, a must see.

That said, Hoess testimony has to be evaluated on its own. Is it possible, plausible, corroborated, does it correspond to the physical evidence? I gave it a close reading a few years ago and kept notes .... the first few comments are listed below .... someone more knowledgeable than me could do a better job, and someone should ! ... from my comments you can see that the 'confession' is tailored to explain all the obvious inconsistencies ... how did a low ranking officer like Hoess become the head of the program, etc., .... in short, the 'confession' is absurd ... I'd like to improve on the notes below but I checked the book out of the library and don't have a copy for review now ...

1 - Hitler, Himmler, Hoess, Initiating the Final Solution -

Stating with the first paragraph - "In the summer of 1941" Himmler tells Hoess "The Fuhrer has ordered the Final Solution of the Jewish question. We in the SS have to carry out this order. The existing extermination sites in the East are not in a position to carry out these extended operations on a large scale".....

Here is the problem, the "extermination sites in the East" refers to Treblinka, Belzec, and Sobibor. You can check the USHMM to find out that extermination operations in these camps began in the summer of 1942. Here is a sample quote from the USHMM "In July 1942, the Operation Reinhard authorities completed the construction of a killing center, known as Treblinka II"

The editor of Death Dealer has some comments on the 1941 date to confirm its accuracy. However, it is obviously bogus, and it is repeated and fits with the chronology of the confession, and can't be dismissed as an error. There is no way out, the confession starts with a whopping lie.

There is also the following inconsistency - if Hitler has just ordered the implementation of the Final Solution, why are there already extermination sites in the east?

Himmler continues " I have chosen Auscwhitz for this purpose. First of all because of the advantageous transportation facilities, and secondly, because it allows this area to be easily isolated and disguised." Auschwitz was the largest camp and in an industrial area that included a Farber rubber factory, a Krupp fuse plant, and an Siemens electrical factory. All the plants rented prison labor so there was a constant traffic of prisoners to and from the plants. Auschwitz was the least isolated of the camps, so the second reason above is absurd.

Himmler continues "I first thought of choosing a higher ranking SS officer for this job so as to avoid any difficulties with someone who doesn't have the competence to deal with such a difficult assignment (note: this sentence doesn't quite make sense in context). You now have to carry out this assignement. It will remain between the two of us" ...and... "You are sworn to the strictest silence regarding this order. Not even your superiors are allowed to know about this." So, Himmler wants Hoess to organize and carry out the greatest mass murder in history right under their feet, and to keep it a secret, not only from the outside world but from the Nazi staff and hierarchy itself. The preposterous nature of the 'confession' has been announced.

Still in the first paragraph, Himmler continues "After your meeting with Eichmann I want you to immediately send me the plans for the intended installations". Installations? What can this possibly mean? The method for carrying out the exterminations has yet to be addressed, as we will see, so what kind of 'installations' are being envisioned? It makes no sense.

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Re: Question about Hoess Memoir

Postby Zulu » 8 years 10 months ago (Fri Jan 07, 2011 10:25 am)

About the Höss confession
How the British Obtained the Confessions of Rudolf Höss
by Robert Faurisson
http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v07/v07p389_Faurisson.html

Confessions of SS Men who were at Auschwitz
by Robert Faurisson
http://www.whale.to/b/faurisson67.html

The Höss confessions is full of absurdities but it is not the only one.
There are other confessions produced by German prisoners which are conveniently "forgotten" nowadays.

I suppose that this list is not exhaustive:

Arno Diere, a soldier of the Wehrmacht, confessed the responsibility of Germans for the Katyn massacre.

Paul Waldmann, a SS member, confessed that 840,000 Russian prisoners of war were exterminated in "movable gas chambers" at one time at Oranienburg-Sachsenhausen.

Anton Kaindl, commandant of the camp confessed that "gas chambers" were used to "exterminate" people at Sachsenhausen-Oranienburg.

Kaltenbrunner, Higher SS and Police Leader for Austria and Franz
Ziereis, commandant of the camp confessed that "gas chambers" were used to "exterminate" people at Mauthausen.

Obersturmbannfuhrer S.S Fritz Suhren, camp commandant, his adjutant
Hauptsturmfuhrer S.S. Dr. Johann Schwarzhuber and the camp's physician, Dr Percy (Percival) Treite, confessed that "gas chambers" were used to "exterminate" people at Ravensbrück.

Josef Kramer, Commandant of the camp in April 1941, confessed that "gas chambers" were used to "exterminate people at Struthof-Natzweiler (France) by means of mysterious "salts" (about which we have no further details and which, when mixed with a little water, killed within one minute!)

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Re: Question about Hoess Memoir

Postby Zulu » 8 years 10 months ago (Fri Jan 07, 2011 10:48 am)

SevenUp wrote:To understand how easy it is to obtain false confessions, see the Frontline show 'The Confessions' (google it) which covers in pretty extensive detail a case where four US Navy sailors, stationed in Va., made false confessions to raping and killing a woman that they had no connection with whatever. They provided graphic narratives of the rape and killing, they changed their testimony as the court demanded, they testified against each other, and so on. It's an unbelievable case, a must see.

That said, Hoess testimony has to be evaluated on its own. Is it possible, plausible, corroborated, does it correspond to the physical evidence? I gave it a close reading a few years ago and kept notes .... the first few comments are listed below .... someone more knowledgeable than me could do a better job, and someone should ! ... from my comments you can see that the 'confession' is tailored to explain all the obvious inconsistencies ... how did a low ranking officer like Hoess become the head of the program, etc., .... in short, the 'confession' is absurd ... I'd like to improve on the notes below but I checked the book out of the library and don't have a copy for review now ...

1 - Hitler, Himmler, Hoess, Initiating the Final Solution -

Stating with the first paragraph - "In the summer of 1941" Himmler tells Hoess "The Fuhrer has ordered the Final Solution of the Jewish question. We in the SS have to carry out this order. The existing extermination sites in the East are not in a position to carry out these extended operations on a large scale".....

Here is the problem, the "extermination sites in the East" refers to Treblinka, Belzec, and Sobibor. You can check the USHMM to find out that extermination operations in these camps began in the summer of 1942. Here is a sample quote from the USHMM "In July 1942, the Operation Reinhard authorities completed the construction of a killing center, known as Treblinka II"

The editor of Death Dealer has some comments on the 1941 date to confirm its accuracy. However, it is obviously bogus, and it is repeated and fits with the chronology of the confession, and can't be dismissed as an error. There is no way out, the confession starts with a whopping lie.

There is also the following inconsistency - if Hitler has just ordered the implementation of the Final Solution, why are there already extermination sites in the east?

Himmler continues " I have chosen Auscwhitz for this purpose. First of all because of the advantageous transportation facilities, and secondly, because it allows this area to be easily isolated and disguised." Auschwitz was the largest camp and in an industrial area that included a Farber rubber factory, a Krupp fuse plant, and an Siemens electrical factory. All the plants rented prison labor so there was a constant traffic of prisoners to and from the plants. Auschwitz was the least isolated of the camps, so the second reason above is absurd.

Himmler continues "I first thought of choosing a higher ranking SS officer for this job so as to avoid any difficulties with someone who doesn't have the competence to deal with such a difficult assignment (note: this sentence doesn't quite make sense in context). You now have to carry out this assignement. It will remain between the two of us" ...and... "You are sworn to the strictest silence regarding this order. Not even your superiors are allowed to know about this." So, Himmler wants Hoess to organize and carry out the greatest mass murder in history right under their feet, and to keep it a secret, not only from the outside world but from the Nazi staff and hierarchy itself. The preposterous nature of the 'confession' has been announced.

Still in the first paragraph, Himmler continues "After your meeting with Eichmann I want you to immediately send me the plans for the intended installations". Installations? What can this possibly mean? The method for carrying out the exterminations has yet to be addressed, as we will see, so what kind of 'installations' are being envisioned? It makes no sense.


There is something more which is often dismissed by revisionists. We know that Pressac admitted on his book "AUSCHWITZ: Technique and Operation of the Gas Chambers" that the plans of the 4 crematories (Krematorium) of Birkenau showed "nothing criminal". After that first affirmation, he tried to invent supposed futher "criminal modifications" by mean of his flawed methodology of cherry picking documents out of their context.

However, admitting that, at least at the beginning, such plans were actually those of no criminal installations, we can also observe that their definition and conception were started in mid 1942.
How could such fact be compatible with the dates of the decision to start an alleged extermination plan "In the summer of 1941" according with Höess confession or even in January 1942 (Wannsee Protocols).
Was there some issue of communication between SS chiefs and the Zentral Bauleitung which was responsible of the construction of all installations at that camp?


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