Cattle cars and cows producing methane gas

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Carto's Cutlass Supreme
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Cattle cars and cows producing methane gas

Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 9 years 7 months ago (Wed Aug 24, 2011 1:40 am)

There is the allegation that Jews suffocated in the cattle cars when sent to camps. To refute this one gets into the issue of what kind of cattle cars did the Germans use at the time. Specifically were they airy. But one hears about cows as producers of methane gas, related to their triple stomachs. Would cattle cars always have lots of air vents due to this?

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Re: Cattle cars and cows producing methane gas

Postby Kingfisher » 9 years 7 months ago (Wed Aug 24, 2011 11:21 am)

They'd have been box cars not cattle cars, but cattle trucks sounds more emotive.

Box cars were routinely used to transport troops and prisoners. There was an incident after the war when German prisoners died of suffocation (I think) in American captivity while being transported in box cars.

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Re: Cattle cars and cows producing methane gas

Postby blake121666 » 9 years 7 months ago (Thu Aug 25, 2011 8:53 pm)

No, the Holocaust promoters literally mean cattle cars. When I visited the USHMM a couple of years ago they had actual cattle cars of the period in an exhibit. I don't recall any mention of suffocation in these cattle cars there given that you could look at them and have to really stretch your imagination on how someone could suffocate in such an open-air container (wooden slats on poles for sides). Maybe there's a confusion with allegations of suffocation in box cars and transportation in cattle cars; but then again, you never know with Holocaust tales.

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Re: Cattle cars and cows producing methane gas

Postby Ibegtodiffer » 9 years 7 months ago (Wed Aug 31, 2011 10:13 am)

Having visited Poland on a specific holocaust orientated visit, we were told by 2 sources (+1 who was a witness to a particular loading of the jews in a transit camp) that the Jews did not suffocate in the cattle cars (Yes, cattle cars - i've seen pictures taken by a witness) but were merely encaged with a mass of people with minimal air. Death caused by spread of disease, starvation, dehydration and some just "lost the will to live". Box cars however did provide a slightly increased chance of suffocation however, as before, the lack of ventilation kept diseases and illness very closely contained in the environment - thus killing many.

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Re: Cattle cars and cows producing methane gas

Postby Hannover » 9 years 7 months ago (Thu Sep 01, 2011 1:40 am)

Ibegtodiffer said:
Having visited Poland on a specific holocaust orientated visit, we were told by 2 sources (+1 who was a witness to a particular loading of the jews in a transit camp) that the Jews did not suffocate in the cattle cars (Yes, cattle cars - i've seen pictures taken by a witness)

Which transit camp was that?
What 'witness' was that?
Where was the site of the claimed pictures?
How did the 'eyewitness' manage to get photos of an alleged secret operation?
Where are the pictures?

Thanks, Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Re: Cattle cars and cows producing methane gas

Postby Ibegtodiffer » 9 years 7 months ago (Thu Sep 01, 2011 2:47 am)

- Izbica transit ghetto, no more than 50m from the Izbica railway line
- At the time, a young (now, obviously old) woman with her new camera...she personally showed us the pictures whilst a translator translated from polish -> english
- The site of the pictures is on the rail lines itself and a single cart off the line. (The single cart was allegedly used to cram prisoners in and use CaO [calcium oxide] on the floor to react to the moisture on their bodies - a very exothermic reaction.
- She lives on a hill overlooking the transit camp from her house - a good vantage point
- She has them

Regards, Ibegtodiffer

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Re: Cattle cars and cows producing methane gas

Postby Hannover » 9 years 7 months ago (Thu Sep 01, 2011 10:49 pm)

Ibegtodiffer wrote:- Izbica transit ghetto, no more than 50m from the Izbica railway line
- At the time, a young (now, obviously old) woman with her new camera...she personally showed us the pictures whilst a translator translated from polish -> english
- The site of the pictures is on the rail lines itself and a single cart off the line. (The single cart was allegedly used to cram prisoners in and use CaO [calcium oxide] on the floor to react to the moisture on their bodies - a very exothermic reaction.
- She lives on a hill overlooking the transit camp from her house - a good vantage point
- She has them

Regards, Ibegtodiffer


So, it's a 'ghetto' now, not a 'camp'.
So, you have no name to support your claim.
So, you do not know the actual alleged site of the claimed photos.
Your answer to my question:
How did the 'eyewitness' manage to get photos of an alleged secret operation?
assumes that the secrecy that the storyline claims is false, because the Germans had nothing to hide. Or, they were so naive as to ignore a lady with a camera on a hill overlooking what you again call a 'camp'.
As to where the pictures are, your only answers is 'she has them'. A 'she' that you cannot even name.

I'm sorry, but your story is not convincing.

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Re: Cattle cars and cows producing methane gas

Postby Ibegtodiffer » 9 years 7 months ago (Fri Sep 02, 2011 2:07 am)

- Camp/Ghetto confusion - I incorrectly labeled it a camp when i meant a ghetto, that's just being me using terms too loosely.
- I cannot remember her name as this trip was ~a year ago and i did not take it down. However, i met the person face to face - as good a proof as any...and even if i could produce a name...she wouldn't materialise on google for you because she is a simple town woman with no spectacular history
- We stood in the site of the real photos. No more than 30m of the Izbica railway tracks (for the off-track cart) and obviously the railway tracks on the railway, the photos looked nearly exactly to where we standing in (minus the odd cut down tree, the ghetto obviously being dissolved and no mounted up bodies leaning on us)
- Once again, i apologise for the term "Camp", which i had loosely named it. Do you seriously think that she stood on top of the hill in a back garden gleefully cheering: "Smile everyone! I've got a new camera!" One photo is taken from the hill and one taken from slightly lower down and towards the direction of the camp, obviously the Nazis did NOT see the picture being taken, with a clearer view of the stand-alone cart and a mass of people being bundled into it

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Re: Cattle cars and cows producing methane gas

Postby Hannover » 9 years 7 months ago (Sun Sep 04, 2011 1:00 am)

Do you seriously think that she stood on top of the hill in a back garden gleefully cheering: "Smile everyone! I've got a new camera!" One photo is taken from the hill and one taken from slightly lower down and towards the direction of the camp, obviously the Nazis did NOT see the picture being taken, with a clearer view of the stand-alone cart and a mass of people being bundled into it

So you say.

Frankly, sir; why should anyone believe you? Why discuss alleged photos you cannot produce, nor do you even know the name of the alleged photographer. It's pointless.

This forum is very demanding about claims that are made. The way it should be.

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Re: Cattle cars and cows producing methane gas

Postby Toshiro » 9 years 7 months ago (Sun Sep 04, 2011 6:20 am)

Ibegtodiffer wrote:(The single cart was allegedly used to cram prisoners in and use CaO [calcium oxide] on the floor to react to the moisture on their bodies - a very exothermic reaction.

You forgot the the carts filled with acid, dogs with poisonous teeth, water and sharks, electrocuted carts...

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Re: Cattle cars and cows producing methane gas

Postby castlewarden » 9 years 7 months ago (Mon Sep 12, 2011 1:04 pm)

Do you seriously think that she stood on top of the hill in a back garden gleefully cheering: "Smile everyone! I've got a new camera!" One photo is taken from the hill and one taken from slightly lower down and towards the direction of the camp, obviously the Nazis did NOT see the picture being taken, with a clearer view of the stand-alone cart and a mass of people being bundled into it


So you say.

Frankly, sir; why should anyone believe you? Why discuss alleged photos you cannot produce, nor do you even know the name of the alleged photographer. It's pointless.

This forum is very demanding about claims that are made. The way it should be.


What is the problem with believing that cattle cars were used on that occasion? Does that detail make any difference?
"Each and every component that makes up your life experience is drawn to you by the powerful Law of Attraction’s response to the thoughts you think and the story you tell about your life." Abraham Hicks


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