'Why would anyone want to burn Jews?'

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Jazz
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'Why would anyone want to burn Jews?'

Postby Jazz » 7 years 9 months ago (Tue Dec 13, 2011 7:16 pm)

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Martin Hecht

"The Germans were very organized," he says. "I was documented in every camp I was sent to during the Holocaust. The Holocaust Museum collected all that information and handed it to me."


Moreover, Hecht adds, thanks to her he mustered the courage to visit Germany in 2005. Since then, he goes there every year to address students. Since then, he's willing to talk about what happened there – and about what was lost.


Hecht was born in the village of Ruskova in Transylvania into a well-established family which owned land in a village where most of the population was comprised of traditional Jews.

"The Jews were financially established compared to the non-Jews who worked our land," he says. "There was a main street with Jews' houses on both sides, and synagogues at the start and end of the street.

"We had good neighborly relations with the Christians, even though we sometimes encountered anti-Semitism," he recalls. "'Jew, go to Palestine,' the locals would sometimes shout at us – most of them of Ukrainian descent."

In 1935, the Hecht family considered immigrating to Palestine. The father of the family and four of his children, two sisters and two brothers, were granted a visa and looked into the possibility of settling in the city of Rehovot.

"My brother Moshe was the idealist. He encouraged the family to immigrate to Palestine," Hecht says. "Father decided to look into it and traveled to Israel for a visit. Two of my sisters and one brother stayed there, while my father and the youngest brother returned to the village in Romania and decided to further the visa process and immigrate with all of us."

But the war in Europe changed those plans.

While war raged in Europe and the mass murder of Jews was underway, life in the Romanian village continued, as if it were a different planet. Because of the geographical distance between the village and the city, and the fact that the village was technologically disconnected from the world, the village's Jews knew nothing of what was going on.

"There was no radio and no newspapers, and even no electricity in the village," he recalls. "The adults may have known something about the Jews' fate, but the children knew nothing. I didn't know a thing about the Germans. I had never seen Germans before."

Wasn't the extermination plan a big secret until after the war?

"Three weeks later, the SS soldiers ordered us to form lines again and led us to the railway station." The Hecht family boarded the second transport out of four. That was the moment when 12-year-old Martin realized that something bad was about to happen.

"We were put on cattle cars and they began pushing people inside until there was no room to breathe. People were pushed against each other until some of them were crushed to death. It was shocking. You have to understand, it was the first time I ever traveled on a train.

"Several hours later, the train stopped and the doors opened. We stopped at the city of Sighet, where Elie Wiesel lived. There was hardly any room on the train, but the Germans kept pushing in more and more people.

"Today I understand that it was that stage in the war when they wanted to speed up the annihilation of Hungary's Jews, because they realized they were losing the war."


"Suddenly, one of the soldiers pulled my father to the other line. The four brothers were left alone. We were led to the showers, our hair was trimmed and we underwent disinfection and were taken to the huts. It was the last time I ever saw my parents and sisters."

Hecht received a striped uniform and a number on his shirt, but unlike other Auschwitz survivors, the number was not tattooed on his hand. "The situation was so chaotic that they didn't give us tattoos. The transports from Hungary were so full and quick that they couldn't keep up," he says.

Hecht and his three brothers were taken to a hut, where they were greeted by the camp's veteran prisoners. "One of them, who saw the shock on my face, asked me: 'Do you know where you are?' I said no. 'You're in Auschwitz, there's no way back from here. Everyone dies here in the end.'

"I couldn't understand what he was talking about. 'Your family was already burned a long time ago,' he said. 'Look outside, do you see the chimney? This is where Jews are burned.' And I, a 12-year-old boy, didn't understand anything. Who's burning? Who's being burned? Why would they want to kill us?"


The four brothers worked at the Dörnhau camp for about half a year. One morning, SS soldiers ordered the prisoners to form lines and begin marching. The Russians were already beating the Nazis, who began transferring the remaining Jews to other forced labor camps.

"It was a very difficult winter. We were wet and dirty, we marched for a month, and each time someone fell down he was shot to death. When we arrived at the forest the Nazis began a selection process. My two eldest brothers were separated from us and taken into the woods with another group. Jack and I were left all alone.

"Suddenly we heard gunshots. They were executed."

Martin later tried to locate the place where his two brothers were shot to death, but was unsuccessful. "There was a lot of chaos and this murder wasn't registered in the archives," he says.


Martin and Jack were put on another train with the prisoners, when planes suddenly appeared in the sky. They were American jets, bombing the railroad.

"A friend of mine from the village was hit by shrapnel in the jaw. I was filled with blood but wasn't hurt. The SS removed us from the wagon and ordered us to march. One of them tried to separate Jack and me. We were so weak that we couldn't resist, but thanks to the havoc I managed to slip away from my group, grasp Jack's hand again and bring him to mine. The rest were executed."

They marched for days until they reached the Flossenbürg concentration camp in the Bavaria area, where political and Jewish prisoners were held.

"They sent us into showers with a strong flow of water, which was partly boiling and partly frozen. The flow and the temperature were so strong that some of the people died on the spot."

Martin and his brother were sent into a hut near the crematorium. "We were the closest hut to the electric barbed-wire fences and the execution area and road leading to the furnaces were in front of our window. We would see people being executed by gunshots or hanging and people being led to the crematorium.

"Nonetheless, I knew that I must stay alive. I was small but determined not to let them kill me," he says.


Full article: http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340 ... 99,00.html

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Re: 'Why would anyone want to burn Jews?'

Postby Zulu » 7 years 9 months ago (Wed Dec 14, 2011 4:02 am)

Jazz wrote:
Martin Hecht
"They sent us into showers with a strong flow of water, which was partly boiling and partly frozen. The flow and the temperature were so strong that some of the people died on the spot."


When HCN didn't come through the shower heads, it was the water flow which was lethal. And there are people believing such insanities...

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Re: 'Why would anyone want to burn Jews?'

Postby Mkk » 7 years 9 months ago (Wed Dec 14, 2011 11:10 am)

I can only echo the comment of Zulu above. If you can't have gas chambers you can always have, er, shower chambers! It's a very unlikely story, even if you can't disprove it. I mean, your average person would just jump out of the way!

"We were put on cattle cars and they began pushing people inside until there was no room to breathe. People were pushed against each other until some of them were crushed to death. It was shocking. You have to understand, it was the first time I ever traveled on a train.

Again, it's hard to disprove, but I thought the transports were generally in passenger trains? I suppose we're now having trains of death instead of gas chambers.

"Today I understand that it was that stage in the war when they wanted to speed up the annihilation of Hungary's Jews, because they realized they were losing the war."

The latter part is true, but the destruction of Hungarian Jewry has been disproved a thousand times.

"Suddenly, one of the soldiers pulled my father to the other line. The four brothers were left alone. We were led to the showers, our hair was trimmed and we underwent disinfection and were taken to the huts. It was the last time I ever saw my parents and sisters."

Doesn't mean the parents and sisters were killed. Hecht was only 12, so presumably his parents were young enough to work. They may have been transited away to anothjer camp or even registered, remember the camps were big places with th sexes split up. Also, how old were his brothers? Younger or older? Also, the storyline says most people under 14 or so were killed, but this guy is alive!

Hecht received a striped uniform and a number on his shirt, but unlike other Auschwitz survivors, the number was not tattooed on his hand. "The situation was so chaotic that they didn't give us tattoos. The transports from Hungary were so full and quick that they couldn't keep up," he says.

I thought tattoes are on the arm?

Hecht and his three brothers were taken to a hut, where they were greeted by the camp's veteran prisoners. "One of them, who saw the shock on my face, asked me: 'Do you know where you are?' I said no. 'You're in Auschwitz, there's no way back from here. Everyone dies here in the end.'

Er, aside from the ATLEAST 400,000 registered or transited visitors who survived?

"I couldn't understand what he was talking about. 'Your family was already burned a long time ago,' he said. 'Look outside, do you see the chimney? This is where Jews are burned.' And I, a 12-year-old boy, didn't understand anything. Who's burning? Who's being burned? Why would they want to kill us?"

Let's presume the retelling of this story is true, just for a moment. We know rumors were spreading around the camp like wildfire. This proves nothing.

Martin tells us a bit about that famous death march from Auchwitz. BTW, where are the bodies for all the people murdered? Oh, let me guess, they burned all on their own!

Martin later tried to locate the place where his two brothers were shot to death, but was unsuccessful. "There was a lot of chaos and this murder wasn't registered in the archives," he says.

Convenient.

We were the closest hut to the electric barbed-wire fences and the execution area and road leading to the furnaces were in front of our window. We would see people being executed by gunshots or hanging and people being led to the crematorium.

I suppose there's gas chambers at this camp now! As for executions etc. I can't comment. I don't know much about this camp. Then our Martin repeats that horror story about showers.

"Nonetheless, I knew that I must stay alive. I was small but determined not to let them kill me," he says.

They did a pretty good job keeping you alive, with all the showers and such.

This is just a typical survivor story, peppered with stuff that is believable and other stuff that just isn't. Notice, our Martin never saw a gas chamber nor does he really know what happened to his family, aside from an alleged statement from a inmate, who as I said may have been repeating rumors. There is no proof his family was killed, nor does he really know if his other brothers were killed. He didn't find the bodies, nor did he see it. He just heard a gunshot, allegedly.

This man is a typical Shoah peddler, it's just horror story after horror story. Like the Titanic, the Holocaust ship is sinking, and this man and those like him are the crew desperately trying to throw the water overboard.
"Truth is hate for those who hate the truth"- Auchwitz lies, p.13

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Re: 'Why would anyone want to burn Jews?'

Postby Kingfisher » 7 years 9 months ago (Wed Dec 14, 2011 1:36 pm)

Zulu wrote:
Jazz wrote:
Martin Hecht
"They sent us into showers with a strong flow of water, which was partly boiling and partly frozen. The flow and the temperature were so strong that some of the people died on the spot."


When HCN didn't come through the shower heads, it was the water flow which was lethal. And there are people believing such insanities...

Actually, that is one of the more plausible parts of the narrative. I've come across it before, from what I think was probably a more reliable source than standard 'survivor' stories, but I can't vouch for it as I can't recall what it was. However, it is quite possible that people already weakened by disease, exhaustion or whatever could collapse under the shock of very cold or very hot water. It could be fatal or the collapse might just be a temporary faint, but either way it is a possible source for 'lethal shower' stories.

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Re: 'Why would anyone want to burn Jews?'

Postby Hannover » 7 years 9 months ago (Wed Dec 14, 2011 1:47 pm)

They marched for days until they reached the Flossenbürg concentration camp in the Bavaria area, where political and Jewish prisoners were held.

"They sent us into showers with a strong flow of water, which was partly boiling and partly frozen. The flow and the temperature were so strong that some of the people died on the spot."

Martin and his brother were sent into a hut near the crematorium. "We were the closest hut to the electric barbed-wire fences and the execution area and road leading to the furnaces were in front of our window. We would see people being executed by gunshots or hanging and people being led to the crematorium.

"Nonetheless, I knew that I must stay alive. I was small but determined not to let them kill me," he says.


But Flossenburg is alleged to have had gas chambers, so why would the evil German kill Jews with 'boiling & frozen water' and 'shootings'? And how do showers simultaneously give out boiling and frozen water in the first place? Amazing what those magical Nazis could do.

The narrative states that the gas chambers were created to relive the strain on the troops that supposedly engaged in mass shootings, 'too stressful' is the laughable excuse given for building the mythical 'gas chambers'. Contradiction after contradiction is the rule with these 'survivor' tales

Sorry, but allowing Jews to stand around and witness alleged mass murder and then being released goes completely against the absurd narrative. But that is what we see constantly from these senile 'survivors'. Their tall tales contradict other tall tales, their claims defy science and logic, and as usual, there are no graves as alleged.

And note the pride in which this ridiculous 'survivor' exhibits his misleading pictures. All framed up for display and attention getting moments. He loves the fantasy that 6M Jews were murdered, loves it. Besides the enormous cash cow and political power that the lies support, what should be studied is why do Jews enjoy the idea that 6m of their brethren were allegedly murdered?

Here is what passes for 'proof of gas chambers' at Flossenburg. Remember, in many countries you will be imprisoned for questioning this ridiculous lie. Here we have the 'truth' as given by 'survivor' Arnold Friedman:

"survivor" was Saved by a Keyhole
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=108&p=590
(at the Flossenburg camp)

"I stayed in the hospital for three days and had good food and a rest. The S.S. would come in twice a day and take away some men. A few times they would come past my bed, but they would take the man next to me. Then one evening, a lot of S.S. walked into the room and they ordered us to follow them. They ordered us into a room and locked the door. I heard a noise like a snake hissing, and then I heard the slave laborers shouting, "They are gassing us!" I smelled an awful odor. Some of the men dropped dead. The rest of us ran around the room cursing the Nazis.
I couldn't take it much longer and ran to the door and took hold of the knob and tried to open it. The door was locked. The smell of the gas got stronger. I coughed, and choked, and put my face to the keyhole and kept inhaling a little air from the outside.
Image
We had been in the room for about five minutes when I heard them outside the door talking in German. "Let's see if some of them are still alive." I went away from the keyhole and the door opened. For some reason which I could never figure out, God had saved me from the gas chamber. The S.S. shouted for us to go out. There were only five of us still alive; sixty lay behind, dead.

As soon as we came outside and breathed the fresh air, the S.S. started to beat us. They chased us to a railroad station into boxcars and closed the doors on us. In the boxcar I lay down on the floor. I was bewildered. I couldn't figure it out. Why hadn't the S.S. murderers finished the job in the gas room? No, I couldn't figure these things out".

from: 'Death Was Our Destiny',p.49-50, by Arnold Friedman,
Vantage Press, 1972.


Revisionists are just the messengers, the absurdity of the 'holocaust' storyline is the message.

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Re: 'Why would anyone want to burn Jews?'

Postby Hannover » 7 years 9 months ago (Wed Dec 14, 2011 1:57 pm)

Kingfisher stated:
However, it is quite possible that people already weakened by disease, exhaustion or whatever could collapse under the shock of very cold or very hot water.

I don't buy it for a second. Boiling & frozen water simultaneously? Right. And as I stated, Flossenburg is claimed to have had 'gas chambers' so why the whole boling/frozen water and shootings claim? Well, that's easy to answer. These 'survivors' lie through their teeth. Perhaps it's old age, but there are obvious incentives to lie when it comes to matters 'holocaust'. It seems that a mental illness has taken hold.

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If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Re: 'Why would anyone want to burn Jews?'

Postby EtienneSC » 7 years 9 months ago (Wed Dec 14, 2011 6:00 pm)

Presumably he means hot and cold water. "Frozen water" is ice which obviously would not flow or co-exist with boiling water. This gives a clue as regards the narrator's propensity to exaggerate.

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Re: 'Why would anyone want to burn Jews?'

Postby Mkk » 7 years 8 months ago (Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:22 am)

On the shower story: Although it's impossible to disprove, it just seems so unlikely. I mean, firstly, maybe thing's were different, but generally when I get a shower I will turn it on, and wait for a while until it warms up. I can't speak for everyone, but I'd feel quite uncomfortable just turning it straight on while standing underneath. Secondly, although you might be scolded by hot water, I can't imagine it kills very well. Even worse for cold water, anyone who has ever been doused ij cold water know it's not pleasant, but certainly won't kill you.
"Truth is hate for those who hate the truth"- Auchwitz lies, p.13

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Re: 'Why would anyone want to burn Jews?'

Postby Zulu » 7 years 8 months ago (Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:55 am)

Hannover wrote:Kingfisher stated:
However, it is quite possible that people already weakened by disease, exhaustion or whatever could collapse under the shock of very cold or very hot water.

I don't buy it for a second. Boiling & frozen water simultaneously? Right. And as I stated, Flossenburg is claimed to have had 'gas chambers' so why the whole boling/frozen water and shootings claim? Well, that's easy to answer. These 'survivors' lie through their teeth. Perhaps it's old age, but there are obvious incentives to lie when it comes to matters 'holocaust'. It seems that a mental illness has taken hold.

- Hannover


That story of "lethal hot showers" is a good opportunity to add one "criminal trace" more to the Pressac's list.
In fact, probably after observing the low productivity of their gas chambers at Krema II and III, the evil SS wanted to install 100 hot showers at KIII in order to boost the efficiency of their criminal operations. That is proved by a document dated on May 15th, 1943, so, few months after the start of the homicidal gassings at that place. We can notice that, for making clear the context, the letter mentions the coded words "special measures", a well know euphemism that invariably meant "extermination" for the Nazis. Beneath to the Hecht's testimony, that undeniable new "criminal trace" can be added to the list established by Jean-Claude.

Translation:

Auschwitz, 15/5/1943
Correspondence register no. register no. 28819/43/Jä/Lm

URGENT
TELEGRAM!

Address : Topfwerke Erfurt
Text: Bring Monday [17th May] rough plan for production of hot water for about 100 showers. Fitting of heating coils or boiler in the waste incinerator at present under construction Krema III or system for using the high temperatures of the flue gases. It would be possible to raise the brickwork of the furnace to take a large tank. Herr Prüfer is requested to bring the relevant drawings on Monday 17/5.

Sig. Bischoff

Transmitted 14/5
Time 1730 hours
Sig. Civilian Employee Schwender

Distribution
1 SPECIAL MEASURES file, POW camp, [manuscript] Krema III, BW 30a
1 Project leader [Kirschneck's initials]
1 SS Second Lieutenant Kirschneck
Attachments
241-01.jpg
PMO file BW 30/34, page 40.

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Re: 'Why would anyone want to burn Jews?'

Postby The Warden » 7 years 8 months ago (Thu Dec 15, 2011 12:31 pm)

With the amounts of 'victims" claimed going through them, the showers would be running quite often. There wouldn't be any inconsistent water temperatures.
Besides, weren't the Germans supposedly hosing down the walls to remove the HCN rsidue in between? lol.
And why would Germans be showering people they allegedly killed on arrival anyway?

If it doesn't make sense, it isn't true.
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Re: 'Why would anyone want to burn Jews?'

Postby Kingfisher » 7 years 8 months ago (Thu Dec 15, 2011 4:33 pm)

Hannover wrote:Kingfisher stated:
However, it is quite possible that people already weakened by disease, exhaustion or whatever could collapse under the shock of very cold or very hot water.

I don't buy it for a second. Boiling & frozen water simultaneously? Right. And as I stated, Flossenburg is claimed to have had 'gas chambers' so why the whole boling/frozen water and shootings claim? Well, that's easy to answer. These 'survivors' lie through their teeth. Perhaps it's old age, but there are obvious incentives to lie when it comes to matters 'holocaust'. It seems that a mental illness has taken hold.

- Hannover

You appear to have misread what I wrote. I didn't suggest they were deliberately killed this way. That would be ludicrous. I said that some people, already weakened from disease, exposure, fatigue, etc., maybe already close to death, could have fainted from the shock, even had a heart attack -- I have read of this in what seemed at the time a reliable source. Sorry I don't recall who it was -- and that this might have been the origin of rumours of "lethal showers" at the time: nothing to do with the stories recounted by these people today. Note I said very hot or very cold, but, while hot and cold simultaneously is not possible from the same shower heads, rapidly alternating hot and cold often occurs if there is no proper mixer valve and/or the hot and cold water pressures are unequal or other taps in the circuit are turned on or off. The French call this very common phenomenon "la douche écossaise". The prisoners would not have had control of the flow; this would have been in the hands of guards, or more likely KaPos or other trusties. (Read Rassinier's description of his imprisonment in Buchenwald to see how they treated prisoners.)

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Re: 'Why would anyone want to burn Jews?'

Postby Kingfisher » 7 years 8 months ago (Thu Dec 15, 2011 4:40 pm)

EtienneSC wrote:Presumably he means hot and cold water. "Frozen water" is ice which obviously would not flow or co-exist with boiling water. This gives a clue as regards the narrator's propensity to exaggerate.

While I don't dispute for a moment the general tendency of "survivors" to exaggerate, I wouldn't read too much into this particular incidence. He's not a native speaker, and we often say "freezing" in everyday speech to mean very cold, but not literally freezing.


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