Walter Rauff, March 26, 1942 letter

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Toshiro
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Walter Rauff, March 26, 1942 letter

Postby Toshiro » 8 years 4 months ago (Sun Feb 05, 2012 8:05 am)

Ingrid Weckert mentioned this letter in "The Gas Vans: A Critical Assessment of the Evidence", but only mentioned:
1. Letter from the RSHA to the Forensic Institute, Berlin, dated March 26, 1942, (R 58/871 fol. 7);

[...]

The letter mentioned in point 1. stands on its own and does not require consideration in our current context.

That is all.

Here is the letter:
Image

The signature looks similar to his original:
ImageImage

German:
II D Rf/Hb 26. März 2.

Geheim

1.) Schreiben

An das
krim. tech. Institut
beim Reichskriminalpolizeiamt

Berlin.

In der Anlage reiche ich den Vorgang des Standortarztes K.L. Mauthausen zurück.

Die von uns gefertigten Sonderwagen sind z.Zt. alle gemäss Befehl des Chefs der Sicherheitspolizei und des SD im Einsatz. Es sind weitere Wagen in Beschaffung, deren Lieferung aber abhängig ist von der Zurverfügungstellung der Fahrgestellte durch den Generalbevollmächigten für das Kraftfahrwesen. Zu welchem Zeitpunkt die Bereitstellung durch den GEK erfolgt, lässt sich noch nicht sagen und es ist ferner damit zu rechnen, dass nach Bereitstellung noch eine Umbauzeit von ca. 8 - 14 Tagen für die einzelnen Wagen benötigt wird. Nach diesem Zeitpunkt wäre ich bereit, dem K.L. Mauthausen für eine bestimmte Zeit einen derartigen Sonderwagen zur Verfügung zu stellen. Zur gegebenen Zeit werde ich Sie unterrichten, sobald der Wagen einsatzfähig ist.

Da ich annehme, dass das K.L. Mauthausen nicht unbestimmte Zeit bir [sic] zur Verfügungstellung warten kann, bitte ich die Beschaffung von Stahlflaschen mit Kohlenoxyd bzw. andere Hilfsmitteln zur Durchführung von dort aus in die Wege zu leiten.

2.) II D 3 a - Major Pradel - zur Kenntnis und Wvl. bei Fertigstellung neuer Sonderwagen.


I.A.

Rauff


English translation:

II D Rf/Hb March 26 2.

Secret

1.) Note

to the
Criminal Technical Institute
at the Reich Criminal Police Office

Berlin.

In the attachment, I refer back to the procedure of the garrison doctor at concentration camp Mauthausen.

The special vans manufactured by us are at this time in operation pursuant to the order of the Chief of the Security Police and the SD. There are more vans under construction, whose delivery is however dependent upon the appropriate shipping orders being issued by the General Plenipotentiary for Vehicles [GEK]. At what point in time the GEK will confirm the state of preparedness is not known, and, after that happens, one must further factor in a rebuilding period of around 8 - 14 days that will be necessary. At that point in time, I would be prepared to put a special van of that kind at the disposal of the Mauthausen concentration camp for a specified time. At the given time, I will let you know as soon as the van can be deployed.

Since I assume that the Mauthausen concentration camp cannot wait indefinitely for the delivery, I request that you use steel bottles with carbon monoxide or respectively other remedies to get things started.

2.) II D 3 a - Major Pradel - for information and Wvl. for the completion of new special vans.


by order of

Rauff


What do CODOH members make of this? What is the use of steel bottles with carbon monoxide for? That is to say, if the letter is not a fake.

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Re: Walter Rauff, March 26, 1942 letter

Postby Mkk » 8 years 4 months ago (Sun Feb 05, 2012 8:51 am)

Santiago Alvarez comments on page 297 of his book:

REMARKS: Formally seen, almost everything about this letter is wrong:
a) The name of the sending authority (RSHA) is not given.
b) The name of the sending office is incomplete: Instead of “II D 3,” it
only states “II D.”
c) Giving initials of the author (Rf) and of the secretary (Hb) was not
practiced on any of the other RSHA letters in this file.
d) The letter’s serial no. “167/42g” is handwritten, not typed.
e) No location (Berlin) is given
f) The year is only types as “2” instead of “1942”
g) The paragraph starting with “2.)” was typed (squeezed in over the
“I.A.” line) after the paper had been removed from the machine, resulting in it being shifted and slightly rotated.
h) Since it does not belong to the other documents of this file R 58/871
f°1, somebody must have put it there on purpose.
i) Friedrich Pradel was not a major but rather an SS-Hauptsturmführer
(equivalent to a captain).
I leave it up to the reader to decide whether that has any relevance.
The request allegedly came from the Mauthausen garrison physician.
Considering that the Saurer special vehicles with their Diesel engines
and low cargo boxes could not have served as mobile homicidal gas
chambers, it would be interesting to know what the original request was
for – if it ever existed.
Using “steel bottles with carbon [mon]oxide or other means” instead
of these non-homicidal special vehicles is a strong indicator that the author forced a link between two items which cannot, in reality, have existed.
Assuming for the sake of the argument that the Mauthausen camp
authorities really wanted to urgently murder people with carbon monoxide, any wood gas generator in their motor pool would have done the
trick. Why request some rare, secret device from an Institute in Berlin?
How could they have known about this secret device in the first place?
And why did Rauff not complain that his State Secret was being bandied about by just about anyone?
I posit that this document was created for the Nuremberg trial in order to get some documentary “corroboration” for the – obviously false –
gas van claims made by Hans Maržálek (see chapter 3.5.7.).


My comment: There is no such element as "Carbon Oxide". There is no specific reference to killing.
"Truth is hate for those who hate the truth"- Auchwitz lies, p.13

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Re: Walter Rauff, March 26, 1942 letter

Postby Toshiro » 8 years 4 months ago (Sun Feb 05, 2012 9:18 am)

Thanks for the quote, Mkk! Just another in the long series of fabrications, then. No surprise here.

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Re: Walter Rauff, March 26, 1942 letter

Postby Kingfisher » 8 years 4 months ago (Sun Feb 05, 2012 9:52 am)

Mkk wrote:My comment: There is no such element as "Carbon Oxide". There is no specific reference to killing.

No, but there is Kohlenoxid in German. My own German is fairly rudimentary but I googled and, among other hits, there is an entry in German Wikipedia. Both Babylon and Google Translate recognise it and translate it as "carbon monoxide".

In English, traditional less accurate chemical names have been displaced by more accurate ones. So in German the form Kohlenoxid instead of Kohlenmonoxid may well have been more common 70 years ago than it is today, especially if used by a non-chemist.

Of course, this is a detail and has no impact on the other arguments.

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Re: Walter Rauff, March 26, 1942 letter

Postby Toshiro » 8 years 4 months ago (Sun Feb 05, 2012 10:19 am)

Kingfisher is correct. Kohlenoxyd is a valid term in German. At least it was.

I agree that this has no impact on the other arguments.

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Re: Walter Rauff, March 26, 1942 letter

Postby SKcz » 8 years 4 months ago (Sun Feb 05, 2012 10:26 am)

This topic should contain also this letter from Dr. Becker to Walter Rauff which is quoted quite often as proof.

5011.JPG

5012.JPG


Black copy

501ps3.JPG

501ps4.JPG

501ps5.JPG


Nurember IMT, 501-PS; Exhibit USA-288, vol. III, pp. 560-561
http://avalon.law.yale.edu/imt/12-14-45.asp

Document is provided by
http://www.cwporter.com/501ps.htm

You can read translation in nuremberg files provided above, here is translation from deathcamps.org

TOP SECRET

To: SS-Obersturmbannfuehrer Rauff
Berlin, Prinz-Albrecht-Str. 8

Walther Rauff

The overhauling of vans by groups D and C is finished. While the vans of the first series can also be put into action if the weather is not too bad, the vans of the second series (Saurer) stop completely in rainy weather. If it has rained for instance for only one half hour, the van cannot be used because it simply skids away. It can only be used in absolutely dry weather. It is only a question now whether the van can only be used standing at the place of execution. First the van has to be brought to that place, which is possible only in good weather. The place of execution is usually l0-15 km away from the highways and is difficult to access because of its location; in damp or wet weather it is not accessible at all. If the persons to be executed are driven or led to that place, then they realize immediately what is going on and get restless, which is to be avoided as far as possible. There is only one way left; to load them at the collecting point and to drive them to the spot.

I ordered the vans of group D to be camouflaged as house-trailers by putting one set of window shutters on each side of the small van and two on each side of the larger vans, such as one often sees on farm-houses in the country. The vans became so well-known, that not only the authorities, but also the civilian population called the van "death van", as soon as one of these vehicles appeared. It is my opinion, the van cannot be kept secret for any length of time, not even camouflaged.

The Saurer-van, which I transported from Simferopol to Taganrog, suffered damage to the brakes on the way. The Security Command [SK] in Mariupol found the cuff of the combined oil-air brake broken at several points. By persuading and bribing the H.K.P. (?) we managed to have a form machined, on which the cuffs were cast. When I came to Stalino and Gorlowka a few days later, the drivers of the vans complained about the same faults. After having talked to the commandants of those commands I went once more to Mariupol to have some more cuffs made for those cars too. As agreed two cuffs will be made for each car, six cuffs will stay in Mariupol as replacements for group D and six cuffs will be sent to SS-Untersturmfuehrer Ernst in Kiev for the cars of group C. The cuffs for the groups B and A could be made available from Berlin, because transport from Mariupol to the north would be too complicated and would take too long. Smaller damages on the cars will be repaired by experts of the commands, that is of the groups in their own shops.

Because of the rough terrain and the indescribable road and highway conditions the caulkings and rivets loosen in the course of time. I was asked if in such cases the vans should be brought to Berlin for repair. Transportation to Berlin would be much too expensive and would demand too much fuel.

In order to save those expenses I ordered them to have smaller leaks soldered and if that should no longer be possible, to notify Berlin immediately by radio, that Pol. Nr... is out of order. Besides that I ordered that during application of gas all the men were to be kept as far away from the vans as possible, so they should not suffer damage to their health by the gas which eventually would escape. I should like to take this opportunity to bring the following to your attention: several commands have had the unloading after the application of gas done by their own men. I brought to the attention of the commanders of those S. K. concerned the immense psychological injuries and damages to their health which that work can have for those men, even if not immediately, at least later on. The men complained to me about headaches which appeared after each unloading. Nevertheless they don't want to change the orders, because they are afraid prisoners called for that work, could use an opportune moment to flee. To protect the men from these damages, I request orders be issued accordingly.

The application of gas usually is not undertaken correctly. In order to come to an end as fast as possible, the driver presses the accelerator to the fullest extent. By doing that the persons to be executed suffer death from suffocation and not death by dozing off as was planned. My directions now have proved that by correct adjustment of the levers death comes faster and the prisoners fall asleep peacefully. Distorted faces and excretions, such as could be seen before, are no longer noticed.

Today I shall coritinue my journey to group B, where I can be reached with further news.


Signed: Dr. Becker
SS-Untersturmfuehrer

http://www.deathcamps.org/gas_chambers/rauff.html


Carlos Porter about this forgery slip

"At the Nuremberg Trial, all documents were retyped on a mimeograph for reproduction in court. The retyped mimeographs were referred to as "copies", while "photocopies" prepared with a camera were referred to as "originals". The National Archives claim that the white document is a "copy" of the black document, the "original". OK. If the white document is a "copy" prepared by the Americans for use at trial, why does it bear the German-language handwritten markings on the first page? And if the white document is a "copy" prepared by the Germans, why does it bear the English-language abbreviation "(sgd)" on the last page? They can't have it both ways.

Note that the German handwritten markings on the first page of the white document are obvious forgeries of the handwritten markings on the black document (they are similar enough to be imitations, but different enough to be forgeries; look at the capital "R" and "P"). Personally, I believe that the white document is a first draft for the black one, i.e., some officer said, "OK, this is what I want, go out and forge me a good-looking document that looks like this, but put a signature at the end". Too many cooks spoil the broth; I think they made a mistake and introduced the first draft of the forgery as a "copy" of the "original"."

http://www.cwporter.com/501ps.htm


Jurgen Graf

"The letter is not signed. Instead of a signature, the name Becker is written by typewriter. To the left of the typewritten signature stands the abbreviation (Sgd), which means "signed" in English! Did SS men use English abbreviations when writing letters to each other?

The various hand-written umlauts over the letters (ä) and (ö) leave no doubt about it: the letter is a primitive forgery, probably from an American lie factories."

Holocaust or Hoax?, Jürgen Graf, CHAPTER XIII
http://www.vho.org/GB/Books/hoh/chap13.html


I agree, forgery.

Maybe this document deserve own thread?

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Re: Walter Rauff, March 26, 1942 letter

Postby Hannover » 8 years 4 months ago (Sun Feb 05, 2012 11:13 pm)

More on the 'gas vans' lies:
'phoney gas vans / J. McCarthy & 'holocaust' Hist. Proj.'
viewtopic.php?t=73

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If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Re: Walter Rauff, March 26, 1942 letter

Postby neugierig » 8 years 4 months ago (Mon Feb 06, 2012 9:52 pm)

My one cent worth re. the letter of “26. März 2“. Aside from what has already been mentioned, the letter is written in impossible German.

The first sentence makes no sense. If referral is meant then it should read “nehme ich Bezug auf...”. Then we have “Die von uns gefertigten...”, nonsense, it would read “hergestellten” and the sentence constructed differently. Then “weitere Wagen in Beschaffung” and although Beschaffung is a German word, it should read “weitere Wagen werden Bereitgestellt” or something like it. It goes on and on, this was not written by a German, period.

All of this will be dismissed by True Believers as “Well, the writer was an idiot”. Right, but here is the giveaway. The letter contains Umlaute alright, like “ä, ö, ü“, but no „ß“, for instance „lässt“ was written „läßt“ at that time, and still is but today's German has changed.

Many of the documents peddled are suspect, but for some reason Revisionists are horrified when the “f” word, i.e., forgery, is mentioned. In a newspaper article I read that Israeli scientists have developed a program able to differentiate between authors, they used it on the OT. I sure hope we can get a hold of it, but doubt that it will be made available to revisionists.

Regards
Wilf

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Re: Walter Rauff, March 26, 1942 letter

Postby Hektor » 8 years 4 months ago (Tue Feb 07, 2012 2:38 pm)

Kingfisher wrote:
Mkk wrote:My comment: There is no such element as "Carbon Oxide". There is no specific reference to killing.

No, but there is Kohlenoxid in German. My own German is fairly rudimentary but I googled and, among other hits, there is an entry in German Wikipedia. Both Babylon and Google Translate recognise it and translate it as "carbon monoxide"..

Kohlenoxid simply means an oxide of Carbon. So it could either be Kohlenmonoxid or Kohlendioxid. It's unusual, but not impossible.
You may have noticed that there isn't really much German literature displayed on google using the word "Kohlenoxid", but English translation pages, and the one ones using it do so for something different from Carbon monoxide/dioxide, but other chemicals.

Concerning Rauff and Gas Vans here is my personal favorite:
Schreiben Dr. Becker an Rauff
Feldpostnummer 32 704 Kiew, den 16. Mai 1942
B. Nr. 40/42 -

Geheime Reichssache

An
SS-Obersturmbannführer Rauff
in Berlin
Prinz-Albrecht-Str. 8

Die Überholung der Wagen bei der Gruppe D und C ist beendet.
Während die Wagen der ersten Serie auch bei nicht allzu
schlechter Wetterlage eingesetzt werden können, liegen die Wagen
der zweiten Serie (Saurer) bei Regenwetter vollkommen fest. Wenn
es z. B. nur eine halbe Stunde geregnet hat, kann der Wagen nicht
eingesetzt werden, weil er glatt wegrutscht. Benutzbar ist er nur
bei ganz trockenem Wetter. Es tritt nun die Frage auf, ob man den
Wagen nur am Orte der Exekution im Stand benutzen kann. Erstens
muß der Wagen an diesen Ort gebracht werden, was nur bei guter
Wetterlage möglich ist. Der Ort der Exekution befindet sich aber
meistens 10-15 km abseits der Verkehrswege und ist durch seine
Lage schon schwer zugänglich, bei feuchtem oder nassen Wetter
überhaupt nicht. Fährt oder führt man die zu Exekutierenden an
diesen Ort, so merken sie sofort, was los ist und werden unruhig,
was nach Möglichkeit vermieden werden soll. Es bleibt nur der
eine Weg übrig, sie am Sammelorte einzuladen und dann
hinauszufahren.

Die Wagen der Gruppe D habe ich als Wohnwagen tarnen lassen,
indem ich an den kleinen Wagen auf jeder Seite einen, an den
großen auf jeder Seite zwei Fensterläden anbringen ließ, wie man
sie oft an den Bauernhäusern auf dem Lande sieht. Die Wagen waren
so bekannt geworden, daß nicht nur die Behörden, sondern auch die
Zivilbevölkerung den Wagen als "Todeswagen" bezeichneten, sobald
eines dieser Fahrzeuge auftauchte. Nach meiner Meinung kann er
auch getarnt nicht auf die Dauer verheimlicht werden.


Der Saurerwagen, den ich von Simferopol nach Taganrog
überführte, hatte unterwegs Bremsschaden. Beim S. K. in Mariupol
wurde festgestellt, daß die Manchete der kombinierten ÖI-
Luftdruckbremse an mehreren Stellen gebrochen war. Durch
Überredung und Bestechung beim H. K. P. gelang es, eine Form
drehen zu lassen, nach der zwei Mancheten gegossen wurden. Als
ich einige Tage später nach Stalino und Gorlowka kam, beklagten
sich die Fahrer der Wagen über denselben Schaden. Nach
Rücksprache mit den Kommandeuren dieser Kommandos begab ich mich
nochmals nach Mariupol, um weitere Mancheten für diese Wagen
anfertigen zu lassen. Auf Vereinbarung werden für jeden dieser
Wagen zwei Mancheten gegossen, sechs Mancheten bleiben als
Reserve in Mariupol für die Gruppe, und 6 Mancheten werden an SS-
Untersturmführer Ernst für die Wagen der Gruppe C nach Kiew
gesandt. Für die Gruppen B und A könnten die Mancheten von Berlin
aus beschafft werden, weil der Transport von Mariupol nach dem
Norden zu umständlich ist und zu lange dauern würde. Kleinere
Schäden an den Wagen werden von Fachleuten der Kommandos bzw. der
Gruppen in einer Werkstatt ausgeführt.

Durch das unebene Gelände und die kaum zu beschreibenden Wege-
und Straßenverhältnisse lockern sich im Laufe der Zeit die
Abdichtungen und Nietstellen. Ich wurde gefragt, ob in solchen
Fällen der Wagen zur Reparatur nach Berlin überführt werden soll.
Eine Überführung nach Berlin käme viel zu teuer und würde zu viel
Betriebsstoff erfordern. Um diese Ausgabe zu sparen gab ich die
Anordnung, kleinere undichte Stellen selbst zu löten und wenn das
nicht mehr zu machen wäre, sofort Berlin durch Funk zu
benachrichtigen, daß der Wagen Pol. Nr. . . . ausgefallen sei.
Außerdem ordnete ich an, bei den Vergasungen, alle Männer vom
Wagen möglichst fernzuhalten, damit sie durch evtl. ausströmende
Gase gesundheitlich nicht geschädigt werden. Bei dieser
Gelegenheit möchte ich auf folgendes aufmerksam machen:
Verschiedene Kommandos lassen nach der Vergasung durch die
eigenen Männer ausladen. Die Kommandeure der betreffenden S. K.
habe ich darauf aufmerksam gemacht, welch ungeheure seelische und
gesundheitliche Schädigungen diese Arbeit auf die Männer, wenn
auch nicht sofort, so doch später haben kann. Die Männer
beklagten sich bei mir über Kopfschmerzen, die nach jeder
Ausladung auftreten. Trotzdem will man von dieser Anordnung nicht
abgeben, weil man befürchtet, daß die für die Arbeit
herangezogenen Häftlinge einen günstigen Augenblick zur Flucht
benutzen könnten. Um die Männer vor diesen Schäden zu bewahren,
bitte ich, dementsprechende Anordnungen herauszugeben.

Die Vergasung wird durchweg nicht richtig vorgenommen. Um die
Aktion möglichst schnell zu beenden, geben die Fahrer durchweg
Vollgas. Durch diese Maßnahme erleiden die zu Exekutierenden den
Erstickungstod und nicht wie vorgesehen, den Einschläferungstod.
Meine Anleitungen haben nun ergeben, daß bei richtiger
Einstellung der Hebel der Tod schneller eintritt und die
Häftlinge friedlich einschlafen. Verzerrte Gesichter und
Ausscheidungen wie sie seither gesehen wurden, konnten nicht
mehr bemerkt werden.

Im Laufe des heutigen Tages erfolgt meine Weiterreise nach der
Gruppe B, wo mich weitere Nachrichten erreichen können.

Dr. Becker
SS-Untersturmführer
http://www.ns-archiv.de/einsatzgruppen/ ... -rauff.php

"....Die Wagen der Gruppe D habe ich als Wohnwagen tarnen lassen,
indem ich an den kleinen Wagen auf jeder Seite einen, an den
großen auf jeder Seite zwei Fensterläden anbringen ließ, wie man
sie oft an den Bauernhäusern auf dem Lande sieht. Die Wagen waren
so bekannt geworden, daß nicht nur die Behörden, sondern auch die
Zivilbevölkerung den Wagen als "Todeswagen" bezeichneten, sobald
eines dieser Fahrzeuge auftauchte. Nach meiner Meinung kann er
auch getarnt nicht auf die Dauer verheimlicht werden..."

This translates as gas vans having been camouflaged as caravans using farm house windows... Yeah sure, really creative.

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Re: Walter Rauff, March 26, 1942 letter

Postby fountainhead » 8 years 4 months ago (Tue Feb 07, 2012 7:27 pm)

neugierig wrote:Many of the documents peddled are suspect, but for some reason Revisionists are horrified when the “f” word, i.e., forgery, is mentioned.

It's true that documentation is difficult for revisionists to completely debunk. Probably has something to do with the fact that we keep stomping our feet asking for documentation and when it's finally shown to us, we nitpick it and call it a forgery. We end up looking paranoid. I mean, isn't it entirely possible that the typists occasionally made some grammatical and spelling errors?
Who controls the past controls the future.
Who controls the present controls the past.

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Re: Walter Rauff, March 26, 1942 letter

Postby neugierig » 8 years 4 months ago (Tue Feb 07, 2012 9:49 pm)

This has nothing to do with “some spelling errors” fountainhead, the wording of the whole letter is bogus, no secretary would write this.

Also, I am not one of those stumping my feet demanding to see documents, quite the contrary. The documents sorted out from hundreds – maybe thousands – of tons captured are not of interest to me. They would be however if presented in context and if all the archives opened. But then, I am not a Revisionist.

Regards
Wilf

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Re: Walter Rauff, March 26, 1942 letter

Postby Hannover » 8 years 4 months ago (Wed Feb 08, 2012 2:01 pm)

fountainhead wrote:It's true that documentation is difficult for revisionists to completely debunk. Probably has something to do with the fact that we keep stomping our feet asking for documentation and when it's finally shown to us, we nitpick it and call it a forgery. We end up looking paranoid. I mean, isn't it entirely possible that the typists occasionally made some grammatical and spelling errors?

Paranoid? Oh please.There are in fact many proven forgeries & alterations. I hope Fountainhead realizes that.

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.


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