Eyewitnesses of "gas chambers" at non-extermination camps

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Eyewitnesses of "gas chambers" at non-extermination camps

Postby spaceboy » 7 years 9 months ago (Sat Apr 28, 2012 12:21 pm)

Hi everyone,

I'm fairly new to Holocaust Revisionism, admittedly. After a few months of watching David Cole's documentary and some of Denierbud's stuff, along with revisionist articles and the forum on here, I have grown extremely skeptical of the "official holocaust narrative". It's amazing how ignorant the average American is about things such as the typhus epidemic, delousing chambers, and that zyklon b was--according to even mainstream holocaust historians--mainly used as a disinfectant, although I suppose this can be blamed on the education system. The only thing I remember being taught in high school, which was only a couple of years ago, regarding "the holocaust" was my history teacher basically claiming the Nazis made Jews into soap, and then we watched Schindler's List. So yeah, improper lackluster education. :roll:

But anyway, my question is: I know there are Jews who claim to have seen "homicidal gas chambers" at Auschwitz, I'm just wondering if there were ever any "eyewitnesses" who claimed to see "homicidal gas chambers" in camps that are no longer even considered "extermination camps" by mainstream holocaust historians. Because from what I've read, the number of alleged extermination camps diminished from 20(?) to 6 over time.

Maybe this question has already been covered on here and I overlooked it. I apologize if this has already been asked/discussed.

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Re: Eyewitnesses of "gas chambers" at non-extermination camp

Postby Hannover » 7 years 9 months ago (Sat Apr 28, 2012 10:52 pm)

At the Nuremberg Show Trials it was claimed that gassings occurred at Dachau, Germany, now the storyline goes that gassings were done at sites outside of Germany.

At Nuremberg, perjurer Blaha said about Dachau in a sworn statement:
"There were numerous executions by gas, executions by firearms, and by injections, in the camp. The gas chamber was finished in 1944, and I called Dr. Rascher to examine the first victim. Of the eight or nine persons in the chamber, three were still alive; the others seemed to be dead. Their eyes were red and their faces bloated. Numerous detainees were subsquently killed in the same manner." IMT, vol. V, p. 198 (PS-3249).

However:
Dr. Martin Broszat of the Munich-based Institute for Contemporary History, which is funded by the German government, stated categorically in a 1960 letter to the German weekly Die Zeit: "Neither in Dachau nor in Bergen-Belsen nor in Buchenwald were Jews or other prisoners gassed." Professional "Nazi hunter" Simon Wiesenthal stated in 1975 and again in 1993 that "there were no extermination camps on German soil."

for much more see:
claimed Dachau gas chamber / liars can't keep story straight
viewtopic.php?t=2313
and:
Dachau
viewtopic.php?t=963

A nice read here:
http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v15/v15n4p18_Okeefe.html

The Liberation of the Camps: Facts vs. Lies

by Theodore J. O'Keefe

Nothing has been more effective in establishing the authenticity of the Holocaust story in the minds of Americans than the terrible scenes US troops discovered when they entered German concentration camps at the close of World War II.

At Dachau, Buchenwald, Dora, Mauthausen, and other work and detention camps, horrified US infantrymen encountered heaps of dead and dying inmates, emaciated and diseased. Survivors told them hair-raising stories of torture and slaughter, and backed up their claims by showing the GIs crematory ovens, alleged execution gas chambers, supposed implements of torture, and even shrunken heads and lampshades, gloves, and handbags purportedly made from skin flayed from dead inmates.

US government authorities, mindful that many Americans who remembered the atrocity stories fed them during World War I still doubted the Allied propaganda directed against the Hitler regime, resolved to "document" what the GIs had found in the
camps. Prominent newsmen and politicians were flown in to see the harrowing evidence, while the US Army Signal Corps filmed and photographed the scenes for posterity. Famous journalist Edward R. Murrow reported, in tones of horror, but no longer of disbelief, what he had been told and shown, and Dachau and Buchenwald were branded on the hearts and minds of the American populace as names of infamy unmatched in the sad and bloody history of this planet.

For Americans, what was "discovered" at the camps -- the dead and the diseased, the terrible stories of the inmates, all the props of torture and terror -- became the basis not simply of a transitory propaganda campaign but of the conviction that, yes, it was true: the Germans did exterminate six million Jews, most of them in lethal gas chambers.

What the GIs found was used, by way of films that were mandatory viewing for the vanquished populace of Germany, to "re-educate" the German people by destroying their national pride and their will to a united, independent national state, imposing in their place overwhelming feelings of collective guilt and political impotence. And when the testimony, and the verdict, of the Nuremberg Tribunal incorporated most, if not all, of the horror stories Americans were told about Dachau, Buchenwald, and other places captured by the US Army, the Holocaust could pass for one of the most documented, one of the most authenticated, one of the most proven historical episodes in the human record.

A Different Reality

But it is known today that, very soon after the liberation of the camps, American authorities were aware that the real story of the camps was quite different from the one in which they were coaching military public information officers, government spokesmen, politicians, journalists, and other mouthpieces.

When American and British forces overran western and central Germany in the spring of 1945, they were followed by troops charged with discovering and securing any evidence of German war crimes.

Among them was Dr. Charles Larson, one of America's leading forensic pathologists, who was assigned to the US Army's Judge Advocate General's Department. As part of a US War Crimes Investigation Team, Dr. Larson performed autopsies at Dachau and some twenty other German camps, examining on some days more than 100 corpses. After his grim work at Dachau, he was questioned for three days by US Army prosecutors.

Dr. Larson's findings? In an 1980 newspaper interview he said: "What we've heard is that six million Jews were exterminated.Part of that is a hoax." And what part was the hoax? Dr. Larson, who told his biographer that to his knowledge he "was the only forensic pathologist on duty in the entire European Theater" of Allied military operations, confirmed that "never was a case of poison gas uncovered."

Typhus, Not Poison Gas

If not by gassing, how did the unfortunate victims at Dachau, Buchenwald and Bergen-Belsen perish? Were they tortured to death or deliberately starved? The answers to these questions are known as well.

As Dr. Larson and other Allied medical men discovered, the chief cause of death at Dachau, Belsen and the other camps was disease, above all typhus, an old and terrible scourge of mankind that until recently flourished in places where populations were crowded together in circumstances where public health measures were unknown or had broken down. Such was the case in the overcrowded internment camps in Germany at war's end, where, despite such measures as systematic delousing, quarantine of the sick and cremation of the dead, the virtual collapse of Germany's food, transport, and public health systems led to catastrophe.

Perhaps the most authoritative statement of the facts as to typhus and mortality in the camps has been made by Dr. John E. Gordon, M.D., Ph.D., a professor of preventive medicine and epidemiology at the Harvard University School of Public Health, who was with US forces in Germany in 1945. Dr. Gordon reported in 1948 that "The outbreaks in concentration camps and prisons made up the great bulk of typhus infection encountered in Germany." Dr. Gordon summarized the causes for the outbreaks as follows:

Germany in the spring months of April and May [1945] was an astounding sight, a mixture of humanity travelling this way and that, homeless, often hungry and carrying typhus with them ...Germany was in chaos. The destruction of whole cities and the path left by advancing armies produced a disruption of living conditions contributing to the spread of the disease. Sanitation was low grade, public utilities were seriously disrupted, food supply and food distribution was poor, housing was inadequate and order and discipline were everywhere lacking. Still more important, a shifting of populations was occurring such as few countries and few times have experienced.

Dr. Gordon's findings are corroborated by Dr. Russell Barton, today a psychiatrist of international repute, who entered Bergen-Belsen with British forces as a young medical student in 1945. Barton, who volunteered to care for the diseased survivors, testified under sworn oath in a Toronto courtroom in 1985 that "Thousands of prisoners who died at the Bergen-Belsen concentration camp during World War II weren't deliberately starved to death but died from a rash of diseases."

Dr. Barton further testified that on entering the camp he had credited stories of deliberate starvation but decided such stories were untrue after inspecting the well equipped kitchens and the meticulously maintained ledgers, dating back to 1942, of food cooked and dispensed each day.

Despite noisily publicized claims and widespread popular notions to the contrary, no researcher has been able to document a German policy of extermination through starvation in the German camps.

No 'Human Skin' Lampshades

What of the ghoulish stories of concentration camp inmates skinned for their tattoos, flayed to make lampshades and handbags, or other artifacts? What of the innumerable "torture racks," "meathooks," whipping posts, gallows, and other tools of torment and death that are reported to have abounded at every German camp? These allegations, and even more grotesque ones proffered by Soviet prosecutors, found their way into the record at Nuremberg.

The lampshade and tattooed-skin charges were made against Ilse Koch, dubbed by journalists the "Bitch of Buchenwald," who was reported to have furnished her house with objects manufactured from the tanned hides of luckless inmates.

But General Lucius Clay, military governor of the US zone of occupied Germany, who reviewed her case in 1948, told his superiors in Washington: "There is no convincing evidence that she [Ilse Koch] selected inmates for extermination in order to secure tattooed skins or that she possessed any articles made of human skin." In an interview General Clay gave years later, he stated about the material for the infamous lampshades: "Well, it turned out actually that it was goat flesh. But at the trial it was still human flesh. It was almost impossible for her to have gotten a fair trial." Ilse Koch hanged herself in a German jail in 1967.

It would be tedious to itemize and refute the thousands of bizarre claims as to Nazi atrocities. That there were instances of German cruelty, however, is clear from the testimony of Dr. Konrad Morgen, a legal investigator attached to the Reich Criminal Police, whose statements on the witness stand at Nuremberg have never been challenged by proponents of the Jewish Holocaust story. Dr. Morgen informed the court that he had been given full authority by Heinrich Himmler, commander of Hitler's SS and the dread Gestapo, to enter any German concentration camp and investigate instances of cruelty and
corruption on the part of camp personnel.
As he explained in sworn testimony at Nuremberg, Dr. Morgen investigated 800 such cases, resulting in more than 200 convictions. Punishments included the death penalty for the worst offenders, including Hermann Florstedt, commandant of Lublin (Majdanek), and Karl Koch (Ilse's husband), commandant of Buchenwald.

While German camp commandants in certain cases did inflict physical punishment, such acts had to be approved by authorities in Berlin, and it was required that a camp physician first certify the good health of the prisoner to be disciplined, and then be on hand at the actual beating. After all, throughout most of the war the camps were important centers of industrial activity. The good health and morale of the prisoners was critical to the German war effort, as is evidenced in a January 1943 order issued
by SS General Richard Glücks, chief of the office that supervised the concentration camps. It held the camp commanders "personally responsible for exhausting every possibility to preserve the physical strength of the detainees."

Camp Survivors: Merely Victims?

US Army investigators, working at Buchenwald and other camps, quickly ascertained what was common knowledge among veteran inmates: that the worst offenders, the cruelest denizens of the camps, were not the guards but the prisoners themselves. Common criminals of the same stripe as those who populate US prisons today committed many villainies, particularly when they held positions of authority, and fanatical Communists, highly organized to combat their many political enemies among the
inmates, eliminated their foes with Stalinist ruthlessness.

Two US Army investigators at Buchenwald, Egon W. Fleck and Edward A. Tenenbaum, carefully investigated circumstances in the camp before its liberation. In a detailed report submitted to their superiors, they revealed, in the words of Alfred Toombs, their commander, who wrote a preface to the report, "how the prisoners themselves organized a deadly terror within the Nazi terror."

Fleck and Tenenbaum described the power exercised by criminals and Communists as follows:

The trusties, who in time became almost exclusively Communist Germans, had the power of life and death over all other inmates. They could sentence a man or a group to almost certain death ... The Communist trusties were directly responsible for a large part of the brutalities at Buchenwald.

Colonel Donald B. Robinson, chief historian of the American military government in Germany, summarized the Fleck-Tenenbaum report in an article published in an American magazine shortly after the war. Colonel Robinson wrote succinctly of the American investigators' findings: "It appeared that the prisoners who agreed with the Communists ate; those who didn't starved to death."

Additional corroboration of inmate brutality has been provided by Ellis E. Spackman, who, as Chief of Counter-Intelligence Arrests and Detentions for the US Seventh Army, was involved in the liberation of Dachau. Spackman, later a professor of history at San Bernardino Valley College in California, wrote in 1966 that at Dachau "the prisoners were the actual instruments that inflicted the barbarities on their fellow prisoners."

'Gas Chambers'

In December 1944 US Army officers Colonel Paul Kirk and Lt. Colonel Edward J. Gully inspected the German concentration camp at Struthof-Natzweiler in Alsace. They submitted their findings to their superiors at the headquarters of the US 6th Army Group, which subsequently forwarded their report to the US War Crimes Division. While, significantly, the full text of their report has never been published, it has been revealed, by a historian supportive of Holocaust claims, that the two investigators were careful to characterize equipment exhibited to them by French informants as a "so-called lethal gas chamber," and to claim it was "allegedly used as a lethal gas chamber." (Emphasis added)

Both the careful phraseology of the Natzweiler report, and its effective suppression, stand in stark contrast to the credulity, the confusion, and the blaring publicity that accompanied official reports of alleged gas chambers at Dachau. At first, a US Army photo depicting a GI gazing at a steel door marked with a skull and crossbones and the German words for: "Caution! Gas! Mortal danger! Don't open!," was identified as showing the murder weapon.

Later, however, it was evidently decided that the apparatus in question was merely a standard delousing chamber for clothing, and another alleged gas chamber, this one cunningly disguised as a shower room, was exhibited to American congressmen and journalists as the site where thousands breathed their last. While there exist numerous reports in the press as to the operation of this second "gas chamber," no official report by trained Army investigators has yet surfaced to reconcile such problems as the
function of the shower heads: Were they "dummies," or did lethal cyanide gas stream through them? (Each theory has appreciable support in journalistic and historiographical literature.)

As with Dachau, so with Buchenwald, Bergen-Belsen, and the other camps liberated by the Allies in western Germany. There was no end of propaganda about "gas chambers," "gas ovens," and the like, but so far not a single detailed description of the murder weapon and its function, not a single report of the kind that is mandatory for the successful prosecution of any assault or murder case in America at that time and today, has come to light.

Furthermore, a number of Holocaust authorities have now publicly decreed that there were no gassings, no extermination camps in Germany after all. (We are now told that "gassing" and "extermination" camps were located exclusively in what is now Poland, in areas captured by the Soviet Red Army and made off-limits to western investigators.)

Dr. Martin Broszat of the Munich-based Institute for Contemporary History, which is funded by the German government, stated categorically in a 1960 letter to the German weekly Die Zeit: "Neither in Dachau nor in Bergen-Belsen nor in Buchenwald were Jews or other prisoners gassed." Professional "Nazi hunter" Simon Wiesenthal stated in 1975 and again in 1993 that "there were no extermination camps on German soil."

Dachau "gas chamber" No. 2, which was once presented to a stunned and grieving world as a weapon that claimed hundreds of thousands of lives, is now described in the brochure issued to tourists at the modern Dachau "memorial site" in these words: "This gas chamber, camouflaged as a shower room, was not used."

The Propaganda Intensifies

More than 50 years after American troops entered Dachau, Buchenwald and other German camps, and trained American investigators established the facts as to what had gone on in them, the government in Washington, the entertainment media in Hollywood, and the print media in New York continue to churn out millions of words and images annually on the horrors of the camps and the infamy of the Holocaust. Despite the fact that, with the exception of the defeated Confederacy, no enemy of America has ever so suffered so complete and devastating defeat as did Germany in 1945, the mass media and the politicians
and bureaucrats behave as if Hitler, his troops, and his concentration camps continue to exist in an eternal present, and our opinion makers continue to distort, through ignorance or malice, the facts about the camps.

Time for the Truth

It is time that the government and the professional historians reveal the facts about Dachau, Buchenwald and the other camps. It is time they let the American public know how the inmates died, and how they didn't die. It is time that the claims of mass murder by gassing are clarified and investigated in the same manner as any other claims of murder. It is time that the free ride certain groups have enjoyed as the result of unchallenged Holocaust claims be terminated, just as it is time to end the scapegoating of other groups, including Germans, eastern Europeans, the Roman Catholic hierarchy, and the wartime
leadership of America and Britain, either for their alleged role in the Holocaust or their supposed failure to stop it.

Above all, it is time that the citizens of this great Republic have the facts about the camps, facts they have a right to know, a right that is fundamental to the exercise of their authority and their will in the governance of their country. As citizens and as taxpayers, Americans of all ethnic backgrounds, of all faiths, have a basic right and an overriding interest in determining the facts of incidents that are deemed by those in positions of power to be significant in determining America's foreign and educational policy, as well as its selection of past events to be memorialized in our civic life.

Today the alleged facts of the Holocaust are at issue all over the civilized world. The truth will be decided only by recourse to the facts, in the public forum: not by concealing the facts, denying the truth, stonewalling reality. The truth will out, and it is time the government of this country, and governments and international bodies throughout the world, make public the evidence of what actually transpired in the German concentration camps in the years 1933-1945, so that we may put paid to the lies,
without fear or favor, and carry out the work of reconciliation and renewal that is and must be the granite foundation of mutual tolerance between peoples and of a peace based on justice.

Summary
The conclusions of the early US Army investigations as to the truth about the wartime German concentration camps have since been corroborated by all subsequent investigators and can be summarized:

1.The harrowing scenes of dead and dying inmates were not the result of a German policy of "extermination," but rather the result of epidemics of typhus and other disease brought about largely by the effects of Allied aerial attacks.
2.Stories of Nazi supercriminals and sadists who turned Jews and others into handbags and lampshades for their private profit or amusement were sick lies or diseased fantasies; indeed, the German authorities punished corruption and cruelty on the part of camp commanders and guards.
3.On the other hand, portrayals of the newly liberated inmates as saints and martyrs of Hitlerism were quite often very far from the truth; indeed, most of the brutalities inflicted on camp detainees were the work of their fellow prisoners, in contravention of German policy and German orders.
4.The alleged homicidal showers and gas chambers were used either for bathing camp inmates or delousing their clothes; the claim that they were used to murder Jews or other human beings is a contemptible fabrication. Orthodox historians and professional "Nazi-hunters" have quietly dropped claims that inmates were gassed at Dachau, Buchenwald and other camps in Germany. They continue, however, to keep silent regarding the lies about Dachau and Buchenwald, as well as to evade an open discussion of the evidence for homicidal gassing at Auschwitz and the other camps captured by the Soviets.

About the Author

Theodore J. O'Keefe, educated at Harvard University, is the author of numerous published articles, essays and reviews on historical and political subjects. For some years he served as editor of The Journal of Historical Review, which is published by the Institute for Historical Review.
A lengthier version of this essay, with complete reference notes and source citations, was published in The Journal of Historical Review, July-August 1995 (Vol. 15, no. 4), pp. 18-23.

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Re: Eyewitnesses of "gas chambers" at non-extermination camp

Postby Toshiro » 7 years 9 months ago (Sun Apr 29, 2012 4:17 am)

There are many. Dachau, obviously. Then there is Buchenwald (Nuremberg Trial Document: RF-301):
Everything had been provided for down to the smallest detail. In 1944, at Buchenwald,
they had even lengthened a railway line so that the deportees might be led directly
to the gas chamber. Certain [of the gas chambers] had a floor that tipped and
immediately directed the bodies into the room with the crematory oven.


Mauthausen (2176-PS, doesn't explicitly say "gas chambers"):
Between 1,500,000 and 2,000,000 political prisoners are known to have been incarcerated and labeled for extermination at the MAUTHAUSEN system of concentration camps from available records.


Hartheim castle (same document):
The total count of victims is impossible to estimate, but with HARTHEIM Castle (a building used for mysterious disposal of people), (See Exhibit 213,) almost 2,000,000 are counted from the German Records themselves.


Bergen-Belsen:
Image
Image
The New Encyclopædia Britannica (2002), Volume 6. Page 981 wrote:Although Bergen-Belsen had no gas chambers, thousands were gassed in improvised shower rooms.

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Re: Eyewitnesses of "gas chambers" at non-extermination camp

Postby truth » 7 years 9 months ago (Sun Apr 29, 2012 12:13 pm)

But it is not easily possible to be gassed in shower rooms - that is knows? Why do they still even talk about this insanity.

You know after a war, people's brain is like on drugs due to trauma. They suffer from PDS, depression and other side symptoms and are filled with feelings of hatred and revenge. In such a climate how can we be scientific? It's a play of irrational emotions which society uses to create irrationality (calling that humanitarian - we now create humanitarian wars, remember?) - based on negativity. History is filled with negativity, one reason so few really study it. One only gets sick from it. It is also a reason why we can indoctrinate people over and over and why history repeats itself (lies are repeated as well). One must expect victims of wars perception altered but what is more interesting the unaltered documents in safe keeping. Here we can find truth unless they have been tampered with (which can be found out).

In a climate of positivity all humans could see themselves as family in which we share all resources for the good and benefit of all beings - nobody will be excluded as we all want to live.

It's important to study the forbidden books so that one does not fall pray to the construction of stories which never existed the way they are taught. There always was a reason why books got burned and even entire libraries during wars.

History is not a God - do not believe in it at all. History is used to indoctrinate people to exploit their emotions, their life force and even their spirituality for profit. The game is not new. It all comes down to the profit margin: What sells best: false history, cheap labor, and how do we make people function to assist the rich getting richer even if that means we destroy the entire planet earth? Our lies will cost us not only the suffering of wars but the entire planet at the end as well. Hope there will be peace then.

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Re: Eyewitnesses of "gas chambers" at non-extermination camp

Postby truth » 7 years 9 months ago (Sun Apr 29, 2012 12:54 pm)

So, why is it then that the Holocaust becomes bigger with each generation? What is the purpose of this sick development? Will we really reach a more humanitarian world this way? Will we create more justice this way? I myself can't see how a future which is based on half truth and sometimes even lies can be a good seed to create a healthy plant (planet).
Last edited by truth on Sun Apr 29, 2012 9:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Eyewitnesses of "gas chambers" at non-extermination camp

Postby spaceboy » 7 years 9 months ago (Sun Apr 29, 2012 2:13 pm)

Thanks for the replies! Interesting reads.

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Re: Eyewitnesses of "gas chambers" at non-extermination camp

Postby Zulu » 7 years 9 months ago (Mon Apr 30, 2012 1:23 pm)

truth wrote:So, why is it then that the Holocaust becomes bigger with each generation? What is the purpose of this sick development? Will we really reach a more humanitarian world this way? Will we create more justice this way? I myself can't see how a future which is based on half truth and sometimes even lies can be a good seed to create a healthy plant (planet).

From Debunking the Holocaust by Paul Rassinier.
http://archive.org/download/DebunkingTh ... sinier.pdf
II. Abbé Jean-Paul Renard

Deported with registration number 39,727, Abbé Jean-Paul Renard preceded Frère Birin and myself by several weeks to Buchenwald; it was Dora where we met him again. He published a collection of poems inspired by a sometimes moving mysticism with the title Chaines et Lumières. These poems consist of a series of spiritual reactions rather than any attempt at objective testimony. One of them, nevertheless, enumerates some facts: J'ai vu, j'ai vu, et j'ai vécu... Frère Birin published it in an appendix to his own work, which has been discussed in the first section of this chapter. One of the poems reads:

"I saw going into the showers thousands and thousands of persons over whom poured out, instead of liquid, asphyxiating gases. I saw those who were unfit for work injected in the heart."

Actually, Abbé Jean-Paul Renard saw nothing of the kind because gas chambers did not exist either at Buchenwald or at Dora. As for the injections, it was not done at Buchenwald at the time he went through there. When I pointed that fact out to him at the beginning of 1947, he answered, "Right, but that's only a figure of speech... and since those things existed somewhere, it is of no importance."

p 96, Debunking the Holocaust


To get pardoned for all that, Pastor Niemöller, President of the Council of the German Protestant Church, in a speech which he gave on July 3, 1946, and which was published under the title Der Weg ins Freie (F.M. Hellbach, Stuttgart, 1946), testified that 238,756 persons had been exterminated at Dachau, although we know today that in reality there were only about 30,000 deaths there; he confirmed the existence of a gas chamber, and we know today there was not one there; and since 1945, every time he has opened his mouth to speak, he has preached the unilateral responsibility of Germany, and the collective responsibility of the German people, in the war of 1939-1945.

p 168 Debunking the Holocaust


Another ridiculous false testimony is coming from Moshe Peer, a French Jew who survived as a 11 year boy not less than 6 gassing operations at Bergen Belsen.

Moshe Peer's astounding Holy Shoah tale - Gassed six times by the Nazis and survived!! - Claims people were murdered in gas chambers at Bergen-Belsen.

Against the charges retained against Kaltenbrunner is the observation of a gas chamber in operation at Mauthausen accordingly with an affidavit of Alois Hoellriegl, member of the Totenkopf S. S and former guard of that camp.

C. KALTENBRUNNER HAD DIRECT KNOWLEDGE OF AND RESPONSIBILITY FOR THE COMMISSION OF MANY SPECIFIC CRIMES.

(1) Kaltenbrunner was fully cognizant of conditions in concentration camps and of the fact that concentration camps were used for slave labor and mass murder. Mauthausen concentration camp was established in Austria while Kaltenbrunner was the Higher SS and Police Leader for Austria, and was frequently visited by Kaltenbrunner before he was appointed Chief of the Security Police and SD (L-51). On the occasion of one such visit in 1942, Kaltenbrunner personally observed the gas chamber in operation (2753-PS).

.../

D. CONCLUSION.

Kaltenbrunner was a life-long fanatical Nazi. He was the leader of the SS in Austria prior to the Anschluss and played a leading role in the betrayal of his native country to the Nazi conspirators. As higher SS and Police Leader in Austria after the Anschluss he supervised and had knowledge of the activities of the Gestapo and the SD in Austria. He had much to do with developing Mauthausen concentration camp and visited it frequently. On at least one occasion he observed the gas chamber in action. With this knowledge and background he accepted in January 1943 appointment as chief of the very agencies which sent such victims to their deaths. He held that office to the end, rising to high prominence in the conspiracy, receiving honors from Hitler and gaining Hitler's personal confidence.
Forced Confessions: Why Innocent Defendants Admit their Guilt
________________________________________________________________________________________
2753-PS Affidavit of Alois Hoellriegl, 7 November 1945. (USA 515)

http://avalon.law.yale.edu/imt/chap16_part06.asp

2753-PS Affidavit of Alois Hoellriegl, 7 November 1945. (USA 515)
I now offer Document 2753- PS as Exhibit next in order, Exhibit USA515. This is the affidavit of Alois Hoellriegl, former guard at Mauthausen concentration camp. The affidavit states, and I quote

"I, Alois Hoellriegl, being first duly sworn, declare I was a member of the Totenkopf S. S. and stationed at the Mauthausen concentration camp from January, 1940, until the end of the war. On one occasion, I believe it was in the fall of 1942, Ernst Kaltenbrunner visited Mauthausen. I was on guard duty at the time and saw him twice. He went down into the gas chamber with Ziereis, commandant of the camp, at a time when prisoners were being gassed. The sound accompanying the gassing operation was well known to me. I heard the gassing taking place while Kaltenbrunner was present.
I saw Kaltenbrunner come up from the gas cellar after the gassing operation had been completed.


(Signed) Hoellriegl"
http://www.nizkor.org/hweb/imt/tgmwc/tg ... 5-08.shtml


More from a COPY OF DOCUMENT 2176-PS
CONFIDENTIAL REPORT OF INVESTIGATING OFFICER HEADQUARTERS THIRD UNITED STATES ARMY
Office of the Judge Advocate
APO 403
AG 092 (3 JA-132) GNMCJ 17 June 1945

II. MATTERS INVESTIGATED

2. Murder by shooting, beating, use of poison gas, drowning, starving, injections, stoning, exposure, burning, and choking of nationals of twenty-three (23) nations, including members of the United States armed forces, of the German Civilian population working under the German armed forces and of other nationals under the orders of said German armed forces, in violation of Article 2 of the Geneva Prisoner of War Convention (Par 73, rules of Land Warfare, Article 2 of same, Par 25, 26, 30, and 31, rules of Land Warfare).

[...]

IV. SUMMARY OF FACTS

4. A Certificate by the Investigator-Examiner is attached hereto in separate form, summarizing the camp and methods of working them in the present investigation.

a. Between 1,500,000 and 2,000,000 political prisoners are known to have been incarcerated and labeled for extermination at the mauthausen system of concentration camps from available records. The Chain consisted of between 23 and 30 individual camps between the years 1941 and 1945, the number varying as the smaller of these were occasionally evacuated when certain jobs had been finished (see Exhibits 4, 81, and 213).

b. Of the camps affiliated with Mauthausen, the present investigation covered 13 of them of which the largest were mauthausen, gusen, Number 1 and Number 2, Ebensee, Steyr, and gunskirchen. Others in the list situated in Third Army Territory were linz, Numbers 1, 2, and 3, Wells, Lenzing, Schlier, and Enns. The victims of this Chain of camps were murdered by the SS guards working in these camps under the command of Franz Ziereis, Commandant and George Bachmayer, Assistant Commandant, both now deceased, whose headquarters were at the fortress in Muathausen (see Exhibits 209, 210, and 212).

c. Evidence reveals that the orders for the systemic decimation of these prisoners originated in Berlin under the direct orders of SS Fuehrer Heinrich Himmler (see Exhibit 4).

http://avalon.law.yale.edu/imt/2176-ps.asp
Attachments
Moshe-Peer-gassed-six-times Bergen Belsen.jpg
Moshe Peer survivor

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Hektor
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Re: Eyewitnesses of "gas chambers" at non-extermination camp

Postby Hektor » 6 years 1 month ago (Mon Jan 06, 2014 4:43 pm)

Zulu wrote:...

From Debunking the Holocaust by Paul Rassinier.
http://archive.org/download/DebunkingTh ... sinier.pdf
To get pardoned for all that, Pastor Niemöller, President of the Council of the German Protestant Church, in a speech which he gave on July 3, 1946, and which was published under the title Der Weg ins Freie (F.M. Hellbach, Stuttgart, 1946), testified that 238,756 persons had been exterminated at Dachau, although we know today that in reality there were only about 30,000 deaths there; he confirmed the existence of a gas chamber, and we know today there was not one there; and since 1945, every time he has opened his mouth to speak, he has preached the unilateral responsibility of Germany, and the collective responsibility of the German people, in the war of 1939-1945.

p 168 Debunking the Holocaust
...

I am not sure about the 3rd July 1946 speech, but what he wrote in "Der Weg ins Freie" I would interpret differently:
[p. 19] Da geschah etwas. Als wir wieder herauskamen, führte uns der begleitende amerikanische Offizier eine Mauerwand entlang. An der war ich auch oft entlang gegangen. Drin war ein grosses Tor. Das hatte ich nie offen stehen sehen. Diesmal stand es offen. Ich wusste, was dahinter war, und trotzdem trat ich ein. Ich stand mit meiner Frau vor dem Krematorium in Dachau, und an einem Baum vor diesem Gebäude hing ein weissgestrichenes Kistenbrett mit einer schwarzen Inschrift. Diese Inschrift war ein letzter Gruss der Dachauer Häftlinge, die in Dachau zurückgeblieben sind und am Ende dort von den Amerikanern angetroffen und später befreit wurden. [...] und dort stand zu lesen: "Hier wurden in den Jahren 1933-1945 238 756 Menschen verbrannt." Als ich es gelesen hatte, nicht laut, merkte ich, dass meine Frau ohnmächtig wurde und an meinem Arm zitternd hinsank. Ich musste sie stützen und ich merkte zugleich, wie mir ein kalter Schauer über den Rücken lief. Ich glaube, meine Frau wurde ohnmächtig, als sie diese Viertelmillionenzahl las. Die hatte mich nicht bewegt. Denn sie sagte mir nichts Neues. Was mich in diesem Augenblick in einen kalten Fieberschauer jagte, das war etwas anderes. Das waren die anderen zwei Zahlen: "1933-1945," die da standen. Und ich fasste nach meinem Alibi und wusste, die zwei Zahlen, das ist der Steckbrief des lebendigen Gottes gegen Pastor Niemöller. Mein Alibi reichte vom 1. Juli 1937 bis Mitte 1945. [p. 19] Da stand: "1933-1945."
http://www.history.ucsb.edu/faculty/mar ... eie026.htm
I'd just read this as him confirming knowledge of the figure and not that he claims this figure to be true. I also don't read anything of gas chambers there.

It is of course possible that he makes a truth claim (or talks about gas chambesr) on another place in "der Weg ins Freie".

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Re: Eyewitnesses of "gas chambers" at non-extermination camp

Postby hermod » 6 years 1 month ago (Tue Jan 07, 2014 9:28 pm)

spaceboy wrote:But anyway, my question is: I know there are Jews who claim to have seen "homicidal gas chambers" at Auschwitz, I'm just wondering if there were ever any "eyewitnesses" who claimed to see "homicidal gas chambers" in camps that are no longer even considered "extermination camps" by mainstream holocaust historians.


The Allies even managed to extract 'confessions' from Nazis about gas chambers now regarded as nonexistent by mainstream 'holocaust' historians. An illustrative example of this was the 'confessions' extracted from camp guard Richard THIES and SS Oberschar Fuhrer Herman FRICH about the Buchenwald nonexistent homicidal gas chamber(s) (http://rodoh.info/forum/viewtopic.php?f ... 99d298456e), gas chamber(s) which allegedly "never ceased working in four years" and killed "at least 100,000 women" according to Allied wartime atrocity propaganda (http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article ... buchenwald - http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article ... buchenwald) but regarded as nonexistent by today's mainstream historians.

Another illustrative example is the 'confession' of camp commandant Joseph Kramer about the Belsen nonexistent homicidal gas chambers. According to the newspaper Mason City Globe Gazette in October 1945, Kramer 'confessed' "he had forced helpless prisoners into the gas chambers at Belsen and personally turned on the gas jets" (http://winstonsmithministryoftruth.blog ... d6f061dbec). About the Belsen gas chambers, the ridicilous 'testimony' of Moshe Peer is great. He claimed he survived 6 gassings in those nonexistent gas chambers.

Interesting because most people regard Nazi 'confessions' as the final proof there were homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz and other places, failing to understand "false confessions" are in fact pretty usual.
"But, however the world pretends to divide itself, there are ony two divisions in the world to-day - human beings and Germans. – Rudyard Kipling, The Morning Post (London), June 22, 1915

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Re: Eyewitnesses of "gas chambers" at non-extermination camp

Postby Landulf » 6 years 1 month ago (Wed Jan 08, 2014 4:40 pm)

Great thread….. Nailed it...

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Re: Eyewitnesses of "gas chambers" at non-extermination camps

Postby Lamprecht » 5 months 1 week ago (Wed Sep 11, 2019 5:29 pm)

Important thread. Both Revisionists and Holocaust believers agree that various jews lied about "homicidal gas chambers" in nazi camps. However, the believers claim only some of these "gas chamber" testimonies are lies. Revisionists argue that all of eyewitness testimony that claims to have witnessed homicidal gas chambers is mistaken or outright lies. This isn't too absurd because fewer than 5% of testimones at Auschwitz even mention homicidal gas chambers.

I show this in the following post, and in the next post quote a Jewish historian & Auschwitz survivor who claims most eyewitness testimony is "unreliable": viewtopic.php?p=90722#p90722

hermod wrote:Another illustrative example is the 'confession' of camp commandant Joseph Kramer about the Belsen nonexistent homicidal gas chambers. According to the newspaper Mason City Globe Gazette in October 1945, Kramer 'confessed' "he had forced helpless prisoners into the gas chambers at Belsen and personally turned on the gas jets" (http://winstonsmithministryoftruth.blog ... d6f061dbec). About the Belsen gas chambers, the ridicilous 'testimony' of Moshe Peer is great. He claimed he survived 6 gassings in those nonexistent gas chambers.


First link is dead but here is a backup of the article:
Image

Moshe Peer:
Image



And some more, largely from this thread: viewtopic.php?t=7033

Buchenwald gas chambers
Image

Buchenwald gas chamber?
https://archive.is/ZGCiw

Art Zander claiming that "the gas chambers operated constantly at Buchenwald"
viewtopic.php?p=92154#p92154

Eva Olsson claims to have witnessed "Gas chambers" and "Five children at a time burned alive in crematoriums" at Bergen-Belsen: https://archive.is/XWaa5

Sidney Glucksman claims to have seen nazis put jewish babies into bags, and would swing them against the wall to kill them. Also seems to suggest homicidal gas chambers at Dachau: http://web.archive.org/web/201909112155 ... 622451.php

Bergen Belsen gas chamber and artificial insemination experiments:
Image

Bergen Belsen gas chambers and acid pits:
Image

1.5 million gassed at Dachau:
Image
"There is a principal which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments, and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance -- that principal is contempt prior to investigation."
-- Herbert Spencer


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