Charles Stein Another "Holocaust Survivor"/ 'Gas Vans'

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Charles Stein Another "Holocaust Survivor"/ 'Gas Vans'

Postby Haldan » 7 years 2 months ago (Mon Dec 10, 2012 5:50 am)

I just stumbled upon a text bearing the title "Holocaust Survivor Recalls Dark Time in History" via United States Department of Defense (defense.gov) about a so-called "Holocaust Survivor".
The fate of this "survivor" [Charles Stein] is very typical because he appears -- despite the terrible title of the text -- to have survived the entire ordeal without blemish. He says his parents died but gives no further details, he doesn't even say they were murdered. He apparently got to America in 1939 via a sponsor, but he still calls himself a "Holocaust Survivor" and regularly regurgitates the story how he survived Hitler's reign.

In reality it's just another person who survived the war without blemish and now makes profit on a non-story. So typical, isn't it?

We see stories like that of Charles Stein all the time. Many of them are documented here on the forum as well.

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Re: Charles Stein Another "Holocaust Survivor"

Postby chim-pa » 7 years 2 months ago (Mon Dec 10, 2012 8:07 am)

Haldan wrote:He says his parents died but gives no further details, he doesn't even say they were murdered.


I see this as quite clear reference to murder, unless by gassing he means deloused or something...:

"In early 1946, Stein learned that his parents had been deported to the Lodz Ghetto in Poland in 1941, and in 1995, after extensive research, finally found out their fate. They had been gassed in 1942 at the Chelmno death camp."

Of course, not knowing the names of his parents, further research is quite difficult.

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Re: Charles Stein Another "Holocaust Survivor"

Postby Armor105 » 7 years 2 months ago (Mon Dec 10, 2012 12:27 pm)

chim-pa wrote:I see this as quite clear reference to murder, unless by gassing he means deloused or something...:

"In early 1946, Stein learned that his parents had been deported to the Lodz Ghetto in Poland in 1941, and in 1995, after extensive research, finally found out their fate. They had been gassed in 1942 at the Chelmno death camp."

Of course, not knowing the names of his parents, further research is quite difficult.


If anyone has any ideas on what "extensive research" Stein did that led him to the conclusion his parents were gassed then can you let me know please as I'm currently investigating the fate of my mums relatives who were also in Lodz around that time of which she knows nothing about other than that they were not there when my mum returned to Lodz in 1945/6.

She says they were gassed and hasn't done any "extensive research" as yet.

Questions For My Mother
Rom 13:12 The night is far spent, the day is at hand: let us therefore cast off the works of darkness, and let us put on the armour of light.


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Re: Charles Stein Another "Holocaust Survivor"

Postby Haldan » 7 years 2 months ago (Mon Dec 10, 2012 12:33 pm)

chim-pa wrote:
Haldan wrote:He says his parents died but gives no further details, he doesn't even say they were murdered.


I see this as quite clear reference to murder, unless by gassing he means deloused or something...:

"In early 1946, Stein learned that his parents had been deported to the Lodz Ghetto in Poland in 1941, and in 1995, after extensive research, finally found out their fate. They had been gassed in 1942 at the Chelmno death camp."

Of course, not knowing the names of his parents, further research is quite difficult.


Oops, my bad. However, in the interest for historical truth somebody should ask Stein to release this "extensive research" so as to put an end to the baaad "deniers" :twisted:

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Re: Charles Stein Another "Holocaust Survivor"

Postby chim-pa » 7 years 2 months ago (Mon Dec 10, 2012 1:20 pm)

Armor105 wrote:If anyone has any ideas on what "extensive research" Stein did that led him to the conclusion his parents were gassed then can you let me know please as I'm currently investigating the fate of my mums relatives who were also in Lodz around that time of which she knows nothing about other than that they were not there when my mum returned to Lodz in 1945/6.


Here is his interview, mentions some more details starting around 49.00:

http://www.ushmm.org/remembrance/surviv ... tent=stein

Apparently his parents were sent from Lodz ghetto 28.2.1942 in transport number 7, information comes most likely from the registry books held by Judenrat in Litzmannstadt. Says his father was book printer.

Some details from registry books. This is, I think, his father:

"STEIN, Eizig
14/10/1880
M Origin: Wien
Richter Strasse 9 Flat 13
/ AUSG
TR 7

Buchdrucker"

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Re: Charles Stein Another "Holocaust Survivor"

Postby Hannover » 7 years 2 months ago (Mon Dec 10, 2012 1:40 pm)

So wow, big deal. His parents were transported to somewhere, and then the irrational kicks in. Those with a vested interest in maintaining the absurd fraud claim that his parents were gassed. Where is the proof? There is none.
And according to the storyline, this Chas. Stein should not be alive ... if the storyline was true. So many, many survivors refutes the notion of 'extermination'.

In 1995, he finally learned that they were gassed at Chelmno on February 28, 1942.

Who told him that? And what proof was presented? None.

Some folks have no honor.

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Re: Charles Stein Another "Holocaust Survivor"

Postby Armor105 » 7 years 2 months ago (Mon Dec 10, 2012 2:55 pm)

To paraphrase the interview...at about 49:00....

STEIN: "..in the book was written T7 which means transport seven, this indicates that they were gassed...in the gas vans...in 1942"

INTERVIEWER: "..and this is all recorded in the books correct?"

STEIN: "yes....all recorded...in nice German handwriting" [emotional pause]
Rom 13:12 The night is far spent, the day is at hand: let us therefore cast off the works of darkness, and let us put on the armour of light.


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Re: Charles Stein Another "Holocaust Survivor"

Postby PotPie » 7 years 2 months ago (Mon Dec 10, 2012 2:56 pm)

It would be interesting if someone did a study to see if there is a correlation with new holocaust survivors/gassing witnesses coming out when Israel gets into conflicts with the Arabs.

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Re: Charles Stein Another "Holocaust Survivor"

Postby Armor105 » 7 years 2 months ago (Mon Dec 10, 2012 3:00 pm)

chim-pa wrote:Here is his interview, mentions some more details starting around 49.00:

http://www.ushmm.org/remembrance/surviv ... tent=stein

Apparently his parents were sent from Lodz ghetto 28.2.1942 in transport number 7, information comes most likely from the registry books held by Judenrat in Litzmannstadt. Says his father was book printer.


From the website:

"In 1995, he finally learned that they were gassed at Chelmno on February 28, 1942."

How did he learn this?

Please....this is very important..I don't want to lead my mum on, giving her false hope when there is solid proof of Lodz Jews being gassed to death in 1942.

Please help me chim-pa.
Rom 13:12 The night is far spent, the day is at hand: let us therefore cast off the works of darkness, and let us put on the armour of light.


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Re: Charles Stein Another "Holocaust Survivor"

Postby chim-pa » 7 years 2 months ago (Mon Dec 10, 2012 3:15 pm)

Armor105 wrote:
chim-pa wrote:Here is his interview, mentions some more details starting around 49.00:

http://www.ushmm.org/remembrance/surviv ... tent=stein

Apparently his parents were sent from Lodz ghetto 28.2.1942 in transport number 7, information comes most likely from the registry books held by Judenrat in Litzmannstadt. Says his father was book printer.


From the website:

"In 1995, he finally learned that they were gassed at Chelmno on February 28, 1942."

How did he learn this?

Please....this is very important..I don't want to lead my mum on, giving her false hope when there is solid proof of Lodz Jews being gassed to death in 1942.

Please help me chim-pa.


I would like to help you, but I do not think this is proper forum for that. Maybe others can help you better.

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Re: Charles Stein Another "Holocaust Survivor"

Postby Armor105 » 7 years 2 months ago (Mon Dec 10, 2012 3:21 pm)

chim-pa wrote:I would like to help you, but I do not think this is proper forum for that.


Any objections to chim-pa helping out on this one guys?
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Re: Charles Stein Another "Holocaust Survivor"

Postby Hektor » 7 years 2 months ago (Mon Dec 10, 2012 4:18 pm)

chim-pa wrote:...
I would like to help you, but I do not think this is proper forum for that. Maybe others can help you better.


No, this is exactly the right forum for this!
Please provide the evidence for gassing!

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Re: Charles Stein Another "Holocaust Survivor"

Postby PotPie » 7 years 2 months ago (Mon Dec 10, 2012 5:37 pm)

Armor105 wrote:Please....this is very important..I don't want to lead my mum on, giving her false hope when there is solid proof of Lodz Jews being gassed to death in 1942.

Please help me chim-pa.


I've not studied Lodz in particular, my work has been by and large Auschwitz-Birkenau since it was considered the epicenter of the mass gassing program. I don't believe there was a gassing program, let alone that any were carried out there. Now as far as killing people for say epidemics and so forth, that's another matter. I think it important to not conflate that with a planned mass-extermination program. I recall reading in the Einsatzgruppen Papers that there were a number of ghettoes in the East that were liquidated due to the uncontrolled diseases there. I've also wondered if some were on a whim liquidated as well due to lack of supplies and not wanting them running about freely.

The best thing generally speaking is to look at your sources, don't blindly believe everything you see. Consider how much is an actual source and how much is being pasted together with conjecture and assumptions. WWII-era history is most difficult with respect to the amount of political propaganda thrown about as factual historical information. I have noticed oddities in the Einsatzgruppen Papers that to me show evidence of tampering. Read closely Report No. 111 for an example. Examine it and you'll see a couple oddities jump out at you.

I have read that the first "gassing" of folks from Lodz was in 1942, which is coincidentally around the time a huge epidemic swept into Auschwitz from the outside (brought into the camp by Polish civilian workers iirc).

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Re: Charles Stein Another "Holocaust Survivor"

Postby PotPie » 7 years 2 months ago (Mon Dec 10, 2012 5:44 pm)

chim-pa wrote:I would like to help you, but I do not think this is proper forum for that. Maybe others can help you better.


I think we'd all like to hear everything available.

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Re: Charles Stein Another "Holocaust Survivor"

Postby chim-pa » 7 years 2 months ago (Mon Dec 10, 2012 6:06 pm)

Well, okay, let’s start with couple of eyewitnesses, and then see where this will be going. I refer here only to sources easily available online. Here is report by one prisoner who managed to escape from Chelmno in 1942. His report is in the Oyneg Shabes archives, as he managed to get to Warsaw and presented his information to local Jews chronicling the events of the ghetto.
Below partial translation of his story. For full version, see for example Chelmno Witnesses Speak:

http://www.deathcamps.org/occupation/bajler.html

That description is quite detailed, and fits to other evidence about the deportations and so on.

Even if not so detailed, here is another important witness, Heinrich May, a German who worked as a forest superintendent for the Kolo district, and who gave his statement to Americans in 1945:

http://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot. ... t-lie.html

May describes the end of the process, arrival of the gas van and putting victims to the mass graves.

One more eyewitness from early period of the camp, Michal Podchlebnik, who escaped, survived, and was later a witness in Eichmann trial. He also gave evidence to Polish investigation committee, those statements can be found from Chelmno Witnesses Speak. This is from Lanzmann’s film, so relatively late when compared to two aforementioned statements:

http://resources.ushmm.org/intermedia/f ... 9BD7D0.pdf

Among other members of the Chelmno Sonderkommando, Walter Burmeister* has also testified about the first phase of the camp in some detail:

http://www.holocaustresearchproject.org ... ister.html

There are also several witnesses from Chelmno village, but they are not direct eyeball witnesses, so perhaps we leave them for now.

Of German witnesses, worth to mention is perhaps also testimony given by Ottomar Roese, a colonel of Schutzpolizei, who visited Chelmno in spring 1942 and saw the whole process. His statement can be found here (in German):

http://library.fes.de/pdf-files/netzque ... -teil4.pdf

* edit. I mean, of course, Bruno Israel. Statement by Burmeister is also in the last link.
Last edited by chim-pa on Tue Dec 11, 2012 1:35 am, edited 1 time in total.


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