Transits through Chelmno

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chim-pa
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Re: Transits through Chelmno

Postby chim-pa » 6 years 11 months ago (Mon Dec 17, 2012 2:17 am)

For friedrichjansson:

There are at least couple of train records showing around 10 000 Jews sent from Litzmannstadt (Lodz) to Warthbrücken (Kolo) in May 1942. Warthbrücken is about 60 km west of Lodz, and is nearest railway station to Kulmhof (Chelmno). Kulmhof itself did not have a railway station or railway connection in May 1942. For documents, see Faschismus, Getto, Massenmord, ed. by Berenstein et al, pages 280-281, quoted also by Mattogno in his book Chelmno, page 116. Mattogno mentions also some earlier records.

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Re: Transits through Chelmno

Postby AWoLsco » 6 years 11 months ago (Wed Dec 19, 2012 12:42 pm)

Hannover says,
"So then chim-pa, you buy the extermination at Chelmno story. And if you are trying to make the case that 150,000 Jews were not resettled, the question remains, where are the 150,000 alleged corpses at Chelmno?
It always comes down to basics."

Quite so. I must say I am with 'armor' and 'rankwell' on this one. I have always had doubts about Chelmno. It has that smell of a death camp in the woods. The end of the line.
I have a theory, and it is a theory only , that some Germans did at least tinker and experiment with the idea of mass extermination and one of the places was Chelmno. What I think was that the Germans in the main trea6ed their prisoners well, considering the circumstances. But with such a mixed bag it was bound to be the case that some couldn't be managed easily. The temptation was there to liquidate them as speedily and anonymously as possible and stories of mass exterminations by the bolsheviks were well-known. The average German wouldn't want to get involved but all nations have a criminal psychopathic element and the German lot, by accident or design ended up at Chelmno.
So we've got records of people going in but not out. Few survivors, only three (unlike the other camps).
We've got a church screened off by a high fence.
The vans/lorries outside revving their engines for 30mins or so.
They drive a few miles to a clearing, fenced, off the road in the Rzuchow forest. Few buildings. No sign of any work being done. Isolated
A couple of eye -witnesses shot by the Germans for bringing this operation to public attention.
Were there more eye-witnesses? There must have been.
This man, Alan Heath thinks so,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rSidYSXU7dc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y90aePwn-ZI

.........any Poles on the forum?....a translation is urgently required.
You want bones? Alan Heath thinks there are bones and says he has evidence of hire or purchase of a bone-crushing machine.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pRsSejBRpis

The mystery is...why if there is so much evidence(all to be checked of course) hasn't the holocaust lobby jumped on this?
The thinking might go like this. OK Chelmno(Kulmhof) was a death camp... and it has forensic evidence, circumstantial and eye-witness evidence to back it up. OK....
....then why are those things lacking at the other camps? The conclusion would be that the H wasn't as bad as made out.....especially when slowly, very slowly(and this forum is no help) the atrocities of the bolsheviks/communists/Cheka.....and the consequent hatred and antisemitism of Balts, Poles, Byelorussians, Ukrainians and Russians are gradually leaking out into western consciousness.
Last edited by AWoLsco on Wed Dec 19, 2012 12:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Transits through Chelmno

Postby Hannover » 6 years 11 months ago (Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:56 pm)

Awolsco:
You must do better than this if you think mass murder was accomplished. You are trapped by the very fact that the storyline claims that the Jews 'ended up' in mass graves at Chelmno.
Show us an excavation of the claimed mass graves Not claimed excavations, but actual excavations.
Show us the Jewish corpses, and yes they are claimed to have 'ended up' at Chelmno.
Show us a gas van.
Tell us how diesel engines can kill masses of Jews.

So we've got records of people going in but not out. Few survivors, only three (unlike the other camps).

Of course not, have you actually read what I posted previously? Doesn't look like it.
The outbound records, which were necessarily kept, are missing. Now who would do such a thing? Whose interest is it in to dump the outbound records?
'Survivors' of a transit camp, of course not. 'Survived' what?
Show us the 'screened off church' that you claim.
They drive a few miles to a clearing, fenced, off the road in the Rzuchow forest. Few buildings. No sign of any work being done. Isolated

No kidding, it was a transit camp. What work?
A couple of eye -witnesses shot by the Germans for bringing this operation to public attention.

Got proof of this? Let's see it.
Alan Heath thinks there are bones and says he has evidence of hire or purchase of a bone-crushing machine.

He THINKS there are bones. This is laughable. Please show us a "bone crushing machine". Show us the bones.
The YouTube video debunks itself, no corpses, nothing more than a panning video camera, but shyster Heath claims 'mass graves'. So very typical of them.

An earlier video you posted in another thread ( viewtopic.php?f=2&t=6420&p=46078#p46078 ) is equally embarrassing. This Heath character holds up what look like a couple of tiny pieces of gravel, says they are bones (If bones, bones of what? Chickens? Vermin? What?) Again, no science confirming anything is involved here. Yet Jews claim that 150,000 Jews were exterminated and a couple of pieces of gravel, chicken bones, or whatever, is their proof. Like I said, laughable. No wonder Revisionists are gaining acceptance by more & more clear headed people every day.

It's one thing to claim a YouTube video is proof of something, it's another to actually look at the video and laugh in amazement of just how absurd the video claims are. One must want to believe in order to believe in the absurd 'holocaust' storyline.

I suggest you read Mattogno's work of Chelmno, and come back if you have something serious.
'Chelmno—A German Camp in History and Propaganda'
http://holocausthandbooks.com/index.php?page_id=23

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Re: Transits through Chelmno

Postby AWoLsco » 6 years 11 months ago (Wed Dec 19, 2012 4:54 pm)

I replied to this earlier but there seems to be something wrong with the software on this site. The whole lot vanished when I hit the 'preview' button. So I will reply bit by bit at my leisure.

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Re: Transits through Chelmno

Postby Hannover » 6 years 11 months ago (Wed Dec 19, 2012 5:17 pm)

I see nothing wrong with the software'. 'Preview' works fine. Must be user error.

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Re: Transits through Chelmno

Postby AWoLsco » 6 years 11 months ago (Wed Dec 19, 2012 6:37 pm)

Well after about the twentieth time of being required to log in and then the third effort to make a reply , all due to thicko operator error I am sure, here goes.

"You must do better than this if you think mass murder was accomplished"
Except that I only suspect that mass murder took place there. I have yet to think that that was so.

"Show us an excavation of the claimed mass graves Not claimed excavations, but actual excavations"

....and you show me that there are definitely no mass graves there. You can't. So the question remains up in the air

"Show us the Jewish corpses, and yes they are claimed to have 'ended up' at Chelmno"

You show me that they DIDN'T 'end up' at Chelmno.

"Show us a gas van"...........http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=h ... g&dur=2643

"Tell us how diesel engines can kill masses of Jews."

With difficulty....but is it beyond the wit of man to add something to the fuel that would do so? Maybe so, maybe no. That is the purpose of the forum. To pose questions, the answers to which one does not know.....but someone else might.
Last edited by AWoLsco on Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Transits through Chelmno

Postby AWoLsco » 6 years 11 months ago (Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:01 pm)

"Of course not, have you actually read what I posted previously? Doesn't look like it."

I did do so but found much of what I read repetitious, and unconvincing and so gave up.

"The outbound records, which were necessarily kept, are missing. Now who would do such a thing? "

How are we sure that there were outbound records? You seem to be, but I am not. Who would destroy them(if they existed)? The jews of course. On the other hand there is that phenomenon of war....the fortunes of war. They may have ended up as kindling or toilet paper in some illterate Polish peasant's dunny.

"Survivors' of a transit camp, of course not. 'Survived' what?"

No need to be sarcastic. Survivors of a transit camp?......... or perhaps no survivors of a death camp.Why so certain that they did survive when there(so far )isn't a shred of evidence for holding such a belief? Point out to me 10 -20- 50 people that say....I survived Chelmno(Kulmhof).

"Show us the 'screened off church' that you claim.".............http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgOeMMbys50

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Re: Transits through Chelmno

Postby Hannover » 6 years 11 months ago (Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:08 pm)

No need to be sarcastic. Survivors of a transit camp?......... or perhaps no survivors of a death camp.Why so certain that they did survive when there(so far )isn't a shred of evidence for holding such a belief? Point out to me 10 -20 50 people that say....I survived Chelmno(Kulmhof).

Since when is challenging unfounded beliefs "sarcastic"? Yes, "survivors of a transit camp?" It makes no sense considering it was a transit camp.

Why so certain? Because the claimed 150,000 Jewish corpses are not there, that's why. If you could show me the alleged 150,000 Jewish corpses that you allege 'ended up there', then you would have something. You accuse, you must submit proof.

"Screened off church"? By what? Obviously what's there now are young trees which were either scrawny, stick-like saplings at the time, or not even planted yet.

I note the lack of response for my other questions.

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Re: Transits through Chelmno

Postby AWoLsco » 6 years 11 months ago (Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:33 pm)

"No kidding, it was a transit camp. What work?"

Funny place for a transit camp. Where are the buildings for housing? Local people would see people leaving, as well as arriving. No reports of that that I know of. Do you know of some?
Then we have this from Alan Heath
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rSidYSXU7dc and this,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y90aePwn-ZI

I wish some Pole or somebody conversant in that language would translate this for us. Sounds like the old lady has something to say and even though it is in a foreign language it sounds strangely honest.....or is Heath a charlatan going around the Polish countryside paying old folks to tell him, and us, tales he wants to hear and wants us to hear for some reason?

"Got proof of this( unsavoury goings on at Chelmno)? Let's see it."

Not the greatest of proof but something to go on, or at least to be disproved. Wikipedia......."In late January, 1942, the secretary of the local council, Stanisław Kaszyński, and his wife were arrested and executed three days later for trying to bring public attention to what was being perpetrated at the camp.[citation needed]"

"I note the lack of response for my other questions."

I haven't finished yet.

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Re: Transits through Chelmno

Postby Rankweil » 6 years 11 months ago (Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:39 pm)

Another problem with the transit camp theory is that there isn't a railroad line going into where the camp was. Or out. Problem, I'd say.

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Re: Transits through Chelmno

Postby Hannover » 6 years 11 months ago (Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:56 pm)

Awolsco, please read what I post.

It was a transit camp, there were no major facilities, no housing. Why should there be be? That's the point.

Your videos are embarrassing, they only prove the Revisionist position, which I stated before, but you ignored. Why? If you disagree, then tell me precisely why.

There are lots of old ladies saying that witches are real and that Elvis is still alive. That is not proof. I hope you realize there are reasons why people lie. Senility and wishful thinking doesn't help.

Yes, Heath is a charlatan and I have shown you why, but you ignore it. Why?

Here are my unanswered challenges to you:

Show us an excavation of the claimed mass graves Not claimed excavations, but actual excavations.
Show us the Jewish corpses, and yes they are claimed to have 'ended up' at Chelmno.
Show us the alleged bones equivalent to 150,000 Jews.
Show us a gas van.
Tell us how diesel engines can kill masses of Jews.
The outbound records, which were necessarily kept, why are they missing? Whose interests are served by dumping them?

I suggested:
I suggest you read Mattogno's work of Chelmno, and come back if you have something serious.
'Chelmno—A German Camp in History and Propaganda'
http://holocausthandbooks.com/index.php?page_id=23

You have not, or are unable to refute is work. Which?

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Re: Transits through Chelmno

Postby Hannover » 6 years 11 months ago (Wed Dec 19, 2012 8:02 pm)

Rankweil wrote:Another problem with the transit camp theory is that there isn't a railroad line going into where the camp was. Or out. Problem, I'd say.

So how did these mystical 150,000 get there and supposedly end up there? In 'gas vans'? :lol:

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.


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