Caroline Sturdy Colls publishes

Read and post various viewpoints or search our large archives.

Moderator: Moderator

Forum rules
Be sure to read the Rules/guidelines before you post!
EtienneSC
Valued contributor
Valued contributor
Posts: 541
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2011 2:27 pm

Caroline Sturdy Colls publishes

Postby EtienneSC » 7 years 2 weeks ago (Wed Jun 19, 2013 1:24 pm)

Recent PhD Caroline Sturdy Colls has published the first article based on her archaeological research at Treblinka. The article, Holocaust Archaeology: Archaeological Approaches to Landscapes of Nazi Genocide and Persecution, is in the Journal of Conflict Archaeology (Vol 7, No. 2, 2012, 70-104) and is currently available free from the publisher:
http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/maney/jca/2012/00000007/00000002/art00002
You may have to skip back and forth to get to the right download page.

The main conclusions I can draw from it are:
1. No bodies or human remains have been found at Treblinka as a result of her studies and field investigations.
2. The established history is inconsistent with the archaeological evidence.
3. It is possible to comment on the cultural and general significance of the situation without really saying much.
4. The guardians of "memory" and identity politicians (Poles, for example) can restrict research.
5. She wants more money for further research.

This is the key passage about Treblinka:
Treblinka, Poland
The decision taken at the Wannsee Conference to carry out the Final Solution, commonly defined as the plan to annihilate Jews across Europe, facilitated the need for mass extermination centres, which would be under the control of Operation Reinhard staff (Baxter, 2010). Treblinka, located 100 km from Warsaw (Figure 2), would be designated such a site and, comprising of a complex of gas chambers, barracks, mass graves, and, later, cremation pyres, it would become the massacre site of over 800,000 European Jews, Poles, and gypsies during the Holocaust (Wiernik, 1944; Arad, 1987).

However, despite Treblinka’s significance in the implementation of the Final Solution and the history of the Holocaust as a whole, knowledge of the site’s former function has faded from general public consciousness and, excepting a ten-day survey in 1945 (Łukaszkiewicz, 1946) and a GPR survey undertaken by a Holocaust revisionist (Irving, 2000), there have been no attempts consider the potential archaeological remains pertaining to it. Indeed, survivor Richard Glazar (1999: vii) has highlighted a well-known reference work that cited an incorrect location for Treblinka, indicating ‘how much we have forgotten about the history of this camp’, something which is echoed by the number of people who, when questioned, are unsure where the site is situated. Additionally, the lack of mapping and information at the site itself is indicative of how little is understood about its extent and layout, whilst the symbolic memorial addresses only the camp boundary, the railway line, and the purported locations of the mass graves and cremation pits; thus the locations of further graves and any of the camp structures have yet to be identified (Figure 3).

The memorials at the former extermination camp at Treblinka: the memorial in the central area of the former extermination camp (top left), the symbolic cremation pit (top right), the symbolic railway line (bottom left) and the symbolic railway platform (bottom right) (author’s own photographs).

It would appear that this situation has arisen as a result of numerous factors, some of which relate to the condition of the site itself and others which stem from the perceptions of it. Unlike camps such as Auschwitz and Majdanek, the extermination camp at Treblinka was deconstructed by the Nazis and no original standing remains are visible at the site. The site is also located in an extremely remote area and the majority of victims killed there were Jewish, the relatives of whom mostly no longer live in the locality or even in the country (Jacobs, 2004). Political circumstances in Poland have also impacted upon approaches to the site, which was not designated a memorial until the early 1960s (Radecka, 2011). Given the brutality and scale of the killings at Treblinka, few witnesses also survived to provide testimony to the events that occurred there (Chrostowski, 2004; Arad, 1987). As such, accounts have historically relied on the limited amount of documentary evidence available which has resulted in the popular perceptions that Treblinka was entirely destroyed and that all of the victims’ bodies were cremated without trace.

A review of the historical evidence suggested that this was unlikely to be the case; photographs of the site after the war show human remains littering the landscape, whilst aerial images and other documentary sources suggest that the total eradication of the structures was highly unlikely (Sturdy Colls, 2011). Consequently, the aforementioned methodology was implemented at Treblinka with the aim of determining whether any remnants of Treblinka survive below the ground. Specifically, the project focused on determining the extent of the camp, and the nature and location of the structural foundations and burials contained within it.

Corroboration of the survey results with historical information demonstrated that the current memorial incorrectly demarcates the boundary of the camp and that it was much bigger than is shown on the ground. Over one hundred features, including building foundations, pits, and earthworks were identified, clearly demonstrating that the camp was levelled as opposed to completely destroyed, and that, contrary to historical accounts, several archaeological features survive below the ground. These findings clearly demonstrate how even purportedly ‘well-known’ sites remain unrecorded and misunderstood, with the physical evidence of their existence having been allowed to pass into anonymity in favour of a reliance on historical sources. The use of non-invasive methods allowed this site to be examined appropriately for the first time in accordance with Halacha Law and prevented any disturbance to any human remains present. Concerns over the latter, and the potential implications of the research, are reflected in the fact that it took almost two years to obtain permission from the Chief Rabbi of Poland and the museum authorities for this survey. Preexisting perceptions of archaeology as being destructive had to be overcome, concerns of the local community and the diverse range of visitors to the site had to be addressed, and long-standing perceptions of the site as having been destroyed were challenged. The use of the non-invasive methods has paved the way for a long-term collaboration with the Muzeum Walki i Męczeństwa w Treblince and has opened up the opportunity for excavations away from probable burials.

Pretty convincing to cite Wiernik as a source, but it tells us where she's at. Someone yet to see One Third of the Holocaust!

User avatar
TheBlackRabbitofInlé
Valuable asset
Valuable asset
Posts: 834
Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2011 10:38 am

Re: Caroline Sturdy Colls publishes

Postby TheBlackRabbitofInlé » 7 years 2 weeks ago (Wed Jun 19, 2013 5:58 pm)

I do like this call:

However, despite Treblinka’s significance in the implementation of the Final Solution and the history of the Holocaust as a whole, knowledge of the site’s former function has faded from general public consciousness and, excepting a ten-day survey in 1945 (Łukaszkiewicz, 1946) and a GPR survey undertaken by a Holocaust revisionist (Irving, 2000),


So according to Dr. Sturdy Colls, David Irving was behind (or perhaps even participated in) the Krege survey!

It wouldn't be a surprise if Irving sued.

In her bibliography, she cites as her source (the original copy of this article I obtained last year has endnotes, the one linked in EtienneSC's post doesn't):

Irving, D. 2010. [online] [accessed 20 October 2010]. Available at: <http://www.fpp.co.uk/wolfslair>.


That particular page on Irving's website is about the guided tours he offers in Poland. No mention of a GPR survey he supposedly undertook at Treblinka:
Image
http://www.fpp.co.uk/wolfslair/
Nazis tried to create super-soldiers, using steroids ... they sought to reanimate the dead—coffins of famous Germanic warriors were found hidden in a mine, with plans to bring them back to life at the war’s end.
- Prof. Noah Charney

User avatar
borjastick
Valuable asset
Valuable asset
Posts: 2642
Joined: Fri Aug 26, 2011 5:52 am
Location: Europe

Re: Caroline Sturdy Colls publishes

Postby borjastick » 7 years 2 weeks ago (Thu Jun 20, 2013 1:39 am)

So if I have understood the summary correctly, Treblinka isn't where we thought it was. The proof of the mass murder committed there wasn't found, this could be because they were buried elsewhere. The witnesses we have been told to believe ever since the claims arose are to be treated with complete disdain and David Irving could be correct all along.

Is this all unraveling quicker than we could have hoped for, after all this was the on-site research and data grab to end all wasn't it?

Edited only after reading the summary for a third time.

What she appears to be saying is that there is no proof whatsoever to support the claims of the Treblinka camp as we have been told. Get in!
'Of the four million Jews under Nazi control in WW2, six million died and alas only five million survived.'

'We don't need evidence, we have survivors' - israeli politician

User avatar
borjastick
Valuable asset
Valuable asset
Posts: 2642
Joined: Fri Aug 26, 2011 5:52 am
Location: Europe

Re: Caroline Sturdy Colls publishes

Postby borjastick » 7 years 2 weeks ago (Thu Jun 20, 2013 10:08 am)

As such, accounts have historically relied on the limited amount of documentary evidence available which has resulted in the popular perceptions that Treblinka was entirely destroyed and that all of the victims’ bodies were cremated without trace.


Yes a popular perception which was started by the hoaxers to cover the fact that of the 800,000 claimed bodies there, none so far has been found.

...and has opened up the opportunity for excavations away from probable burials.


In actual fact what she is saying is that having carried out her research and found absolutely nothing to prove the myth that is Treblinka, not helped by the fact that she excavated almost nothing, she has concluded that there is a strong possibility that there could be remains of structures and other buildings etc over a larger area than at first was covered by Treblinka, and that she wants to return and continue her work. Further that she can 'prove' the claims by finding these buildings etc which by omission of bodies will add weight to the claims. In other words if there are buildings there that must therefore prove mass murder.

Epic fail.
'Of the four million Jews under Nazi control in WW2, six million died and alas only five million survived.'

'We don't need evidence, we have survivors' - israeli politician

neugierig
Valued contributor
Valued contributor
Posts: 352
Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2002 7:01 pm

Re: Caroline Sturdy Colls publishes

Postby neugierig » 6 years 11 months ago (Fri Aug 02, 2013 12:48 pm)

Sorry for the delay, and thanks EtienneSC for posting the Dr. Sturdy Colls article. I finally had a chance to read it, here are my thoughts.

http://revblog.codoh.com/2013/08/how-to ... #more-1954

Regards
Wilf

User avatar
Moderator
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 1706
Joined: Thu Nov 21, 2002 9:23 am

Re: Caroline Sturdy Colls publishes

Postby Moderator » 6 years 11 months ago (Fri Aug 02, 2013 1:41 pm)

Full text of Wilf's posted link http://revblog.codoh.com/2013/08/how-to ... #more-1954 added for convenience.
M1.

How to ‘investigate’ the Holocaust, or: How not to do a proper investigation.

Posted By Wilfried Heink On August 2, 2013 @ 12:30 pm In Uncategorized | Comments Disabled

Recently I came across an article by Dr. Caroline Sturdy Colls, titled: Holocaust Archaeology: Archaeological Approaches to Landscapes of Nazi Genocide and Persecution (Journal of Conflict Archaeology Vol. 7, No. 2, 2012, 70-104)

http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/m ... 2/art00002 [1]

Dr. Sturdy Colls latest archaeological undertaking was centered on Treblinka, the “Nazi” camp in Poland where some 800,000 Jews had allegedly been murdered by the Germans. As the title suggests, this is not about Treblinka per se, although she refers to the transit camp on the 20th page of her article (it starts on p.70 in the journal, Treblinka is on p.90), but promises that details will follow when she writes:

“It is not the intention to discuss at length the individual features recorded, as these will be presented elsewhere (Sturdy Colls, in prep; 2011), but to provide an overview of the results gained in order to demonstrate their implications for studies of this period.”(Ibid)

So we wait with baited breath for that presentation, in the meantime, a few observation on her article. Dr. Sturdy Colls starts out with:

“Debate concerning the events of the Holocaust is well embedded in the historical discourse and, thus, clearly defined narratives of this period exist. However, in most European countries the Holocaust has only recently begun to be considered in terms of its surviving archaeological remains and landscapes, and the majority of known sites are still ill-defined and only partially understood from both spatial structural points of view.”

Not a good start, for whatever ‘debate’ is taking place is among those who believe in “The Holocaust”, people with differing views are jailed or persecuted. Dr. Sturdy Colls also believes, she makes that clear throughout the article. Concerning Treblinka she tells us:

“Treblinka, located 100 km from Warsaw (Figure 2), would be designated such a site (“mass extermination center”) and, comprising of a complex of gas chambers, barracks, mass graves, and, later, cremation pyres, it would become the massacre site of over 800,000 European Jews, Poles, and gypsies during the Holocaust (Wiernik, 1944; Arad, 1987).” (p.90)

This shows that she approached her investigation convinced that 800,000 plus had been murdered at Treblinka, trying to prove that this was the case – instead of allowing the evidence to speak for itself. Not a scientific method to be sure. Julius Wellhausen, when criticizing the Pharisees, has this to say about that sort of methodology:

“Für die Deutung werden die Thatsachen vorausgesetzt, und aus der Deutung werden sie bewiesen“.(Die Pharisäer und Sadducäer, p.66)

My rough translation: That what is to be examined is interpreted as being fact and supported by using that interpretation.

In the above, Dr. Sturdy Colls refers to books by Wiernick and Arad, further evidence of her being influenced by storytellers, because what these authors write is not based on solid evidence – arrived at by investigations by experts – but on alleged personal experience (Wiernick) and accounts by self styled witnesses and the like. Staying with Treblinka for the moment, she tells us:

“However, despite Treblinka’s significance in the implementation of the Final Solution and the history of the Holocaust as a whole, knowledge of the site’s former function has faded from general public consciousness and, excepting a ten-day survey in 1945 (Łukaszkiewicz, 1946) and a GPR survey undertaken by a Holocaust revisionist (Irving, 2000), there have been no attempts consider the potential archaeological remains pertaining to it.” (Ibid)

Ignoring the Irving slip, the GPR survey was actually undertaken by Richard Krege, here is what Łukaszkiewicz had to say in his final report:

“Decision:

The Examining Judge of Siedlce, on November 13, 1945, rules in consideration of the fact that with great probability no mass graves are any longer to be found on the grounds of the former camp today, as is to be concluded from the witness testimonies examined so far and from the results of the works carried out at the site, and in consideration of the oncoming autumn, the present rainfall and the necessity of a rapid conclusion of the judicial preliminary investigations, in view of all these facts to stop the work on the territory of the former death camp Treblinka.

The Examining Judge

Łukaszkiewicz.” (Mattogno/Graf, Treblinka, Extermination Camp or Transit Camp?, p.86)

How mass graves, i.e. the holes themselves can disappear is not explained. On November 11, during the investigation, Łukaszkiewicz reported:

“The largest of the craters produced by explosions (numerous fragments attest to the fact that these explosions were set off by bombs), which is at maximum 6 meters deep and has a diameter of about 25 meters – its walls give recognizable evidence of the presence of a large quantity of ashes as well as human remains – was further excavated in order to discover the depth of the pit in this part of the camp. Numerous human remains were found by these excavations, partially still in a state of decomposition” (Ibid)

This is interpreted by those who believe in “The Holocaust” as evidence that a grave was found. But Łukaszkiewicz calls it a “crater”, not a grave, he had to admit in his final report that no graves were found. Also, we have no indication where this crater was located, and results of any investigation must be verifiable. The former camp site was a mess of holes and hills. Rachel Auerbach, on her visit to the site in 1946, had this to say:

“But since then, during the past year, the human jackals and hyenas have been coming to the burial ground and here is the picture that we saw:

Here and there, like patches of grass near the seashore, half-covered by the shifting sands, there were still little clumps of withered lupine. Not one level place in the whole area. Everything had been torn up and dug up, little hills and holes… The bombs had revealed the contents of the desecrated soil.” (Ibid, pp.83/84).

It is claimed that treasure hunters are to blame for the sad shape the place was in, hard to believe, because the size of the crater – 6 meters (19 feet) deep and a diameter of 25 meters (80 feet) – as described by Łukaszkiewicz – would suggest that large explosive devises had been used. Łukaszkiewicz was accompanied by a surveyor, K. Trautsolt, who produced an official map of the camp. But, that seems to be forgotten, Dr. Sturdy Colls again:

“Corroboration of the survey results with historical information demonstrated that the current memorial incorrectly demarcates the boundary of the camp and that it was much bigger than is shown on the ground.” (p.92)

“Historical information”? As mentioned, we’ll just have to wait ‘till the final report is released.

Now back to the beginning of the article by Dr. Sturdy Colls, she continues, on p.70:

“Additionally, thousands of sites across Europe remain unmarked, whilst the locations of others have been forgotten altogether. Such a situation has arisen as a result of a number of political, social, ethical, and religious factors which, coupled with the scale of the crimes, has often inhibited systematic search. This paper details the subsequent development and application of a non-invasive archaeological methodology aimed at rectifying this situation and presents a case for the establishment of Holocaust archaeology as a sub-discipline of conflict studies. In particular, the importance of moving away from the notion that the presence of historical sources precludes the need for the collection of physical evidence is stressed, and the humanitarian, scientific, academic, and commemorative value of exploring this period is considered.”

Prof. Maser also bemoans the fact that whole areas of Ukraine remain to be ‘terra incognita’, but he comes to the conclusion that this is because historians are reluctant to investigate out of fear not to find what is allegedly there (Fälschung, Dichtung und Wahrheit über Hitler und Stalin, p.332). Dr. Sturdy Colls has no such reservations, she is convinced that the graves exists, and blames political-, as well as other factors, to have “inhibited systematic research”. Then she gets to the core, suggesting to bypass religious and other concerns by applying a “non-invasive archaeological methodology”, to establish “Holocaust archaeology as a sub-discipline of conflict studies”.

A tailor made approach, and why not. We already have “Guidelines for Teaching about the Holocaust” (http://www.ushmm.org/education/foreducators/guideline/ [2] ), so, why not “Holocaust Archaeology”? She is forgetting however that these are alleged crime scenes, and should be investigated by experts in the field of crime investigations, without any restraints, and the reports made available for verification. But she does make one valid point

“In particular, the importance of moving away from the notion that the presence of historical sources precludes the need for the collection of physical evidence is stressed…”,

thereby admitting that no physical evidence, worthy of the term, has been presented so far. She then talks of the investigations done concerning other genocides, referring to “…the First World War, the Spanish Civil War, and other massacres of the early twentieth century” (p.71), to ask:

“…why have the sites of the Holocaust not been examined to the same extent or using up-to-date methods now commonplace in other areas of the discipline? Why has this period been perceived differently, with almost a ‘do not disturb’ attitude towards some aspects of its archaeological heritage (Moshenska, 2008: 168)? When examinations are undertaken in the future, is a unique approach, therefore, required to its investigation?” (Ibid).

Why indeed? The answer is simple, but Dr. Sturdy Colls is either unwilling or unable to go there. She then continues to talk of: Legal investigations, historical databases, and site recognition:

“Early investigations of Holocaust sites were undertaken immediately after the war by specially assembled war crimes commissions, which usually comprised of medicolegal professionals tasked with the collection of evidence for the conviction of the perpetrators (IMTN, 1947; Central Commission for the Investigation of German War Crimes in Poland, 1982; Profatilov, 1945). Emphasis was placed upon verifying thathe camps and graves existed rather than detailed investigation (Arad et al., 1999; IMTN, 1947).” (p.72)

This is puzzling to say the least. She writes that investigations were undertaken “immediately after the war”, thereby ignoring the ‘investigations’ undertaken by the Soviets, one done in Treblinka. In November 1942, the Soviets created the “Extraordinary State Commission for Ascertaining and Investigating Crimes Perpetrated by the German-Fascist Invaders and their Accomplices”, ESC for short. From: The Role of the Soviet Union in the International Military Tribunal at Nuremberg and Impact on its Legacy, by Michael Bazyler:

“The Soviets “claimed credit for convincing their partners not to build the proceedings around documentary evidence alone”, for the offering of live evidence would produce “a dramatic effect on the atmosphere in the court-room” (George Ginsburgs, Moscow’s Road to Nuremberg, [New York: Kluwer Law International, 1996], p112).

This suggests that at first only documentary evidence, no doubt carefully selected and screened by the victors, was to be used, but the Soviets insisted on introducing what they had amassed. Again from Bazyler;

“Among the detailed and massive work performed by the Commission was inspection of graves and corpses, gathering of witness accounts, forensic examinations, and interrogations of captured Germans.[24] The records contained “the most complete description possible of the crimes committed, the full name and place of residence of the individuals furnishing the evidence”, and “all the relevant documents” such as minutes of the interrogations, medical expert conclusions, German documents, and films.[25] The Commission’s extraordinary efforts resulted in an impressive list of “hundreds of Germans, from generals to humble privates”, and a “specific and detailed enumeration of the crimes of which they stood accused”.[26] These records proved indispensable at the IMT.”

24 Haim Goury, Facing the Glass Booth: The Jerusalem Trial of Adolf Eichmann

(Michael Swirsky, transl.) (Detroit: Wayne State U. Press, 2004), 6-7.19 Ginsburgs, supra, p.36

25 Ibid

26 Ibid, p.40

And Dr. Sturdy Colls ignores this? Hard to believe, but then, there is also no mention of the ESC reports in the latest publishing aimed at discrediting Revisionists, the book titled “Neue Studien zu Nationalsozialistischen Massentötungen durch Giftgas” (New studies on National Socialist mass murder by poisonous gas, 2011, Berlin). No mention because the ESC was just a bunch of political hacks – beholden to Stalin – who endorsed anything put in front of them? No other explanation possible. As to the machinations by the ESC, Prof. Marina A. Sorokina, a Russian historian, published an article in Kritika (Slavica Publishers) in 2005, titled: “People and Procedures: Toward a History of the Investigation of Nazi Crimes in the USSR”. Prof. Sorokina completely demolishes the ESC, I wrote a series of articles on it:

http://revblog.codoh.com/2011/06/a-clos ... %E2%80%9D/ [3]

Someone perused what had been assembled by the ESC and found it wanting, it has therefore been dropped, But, that leaves the promoters of “The Holocaust” with nothing, save for tall tales by ‘witnesses’ and some carefully assembled documents, many of dubious origin. Is this then why this push is made to ‘investigate’ by carefully chosen people? But without experts in crime investigations present, and unhindered access to the sites, these investigations can safely be dismissed as shams.

Dr. Sturdy Colls then talks about the Jewish burial Law, the Halacha:

“As Moshenska (Moshenska, G. 2008. Ethics and Ethical Critique in the Archaeology of Modern Conflict. Norweigan Archaeological Review, 161) has stated, ‘issues such as respect for the dead are arguably of greater ethical significance in the communication of research findings than the research itself’.” (p.87)

Why even bother then? Undertake a proper investigation by experts in the field of crime investigations or just continue on as before, advance baseless claims. A little more Halacha:

“However, Halacha Law also stipulates that the disturbance of human remains (for whatever purpose) is forbidden, thus restricting the actions of archaeologists in terms of the ability to excavate Holocaust sites where inhumations are suspected (Rosensaft, 1979). As Rabbi Moses Feinstein (in Rosensaft, 1979: 164) argued, ‘the dead rest in their place of burial. Not only is it forbidden to exhume the bodies but even to open the graves is strictly prohibited’. The comments of the Chief Rabbi of the Jewsbury excavations in York highlight the position of the Jewry with regards to the scientific investigation of human remains:

‘…whatever the scientific and historical loss, I hope that you and the general public will appreciate our paramount concern for the reverence due to the mortal remains which once bore the incomparable hallmark of the Divine image and which, we believe, have an inalienable right to rest undisturbed. We are convinced that the dignity shown to humans even centuries after their death can contribute more than any scientific enquiry to the advancement of human civilisation and the enhancement of the respect in which humans hold each other’. (Rahtz, 1995: 197)” (p.88)

“Hallmark of the Divine image”? Be that as it may, exceptions to this law have been- and are made. For instance, in 2009 excavations were done at a site in Jamlitz, Germany. From a news release:

“JAMLITZ, Germany — A birch-lined back yard believed to hold the remains of more than 750 former Jewish prisoners slain by the Nazis in the final days of World War II will be excavated by German authorities starting Wednesday…

Excavators are to use heavy equipment to remove the top layers of soil, then proceed with their bare hands, said Joachim Wacker of the state society for the protection and care of memorials. Authorities have initially planned three weeks for the work.

Wacker said that if remains are found and identified as belonging to the victims, a rabbi will be called in and the site treated as a grave. Later, authorities hope to erect a memorial in collaboration with survivor groups, Jewish community leaders and others…”.

http://web.utsandiego.com/news/2009/Apr ... ve-042109/ [4]

Nothing was found, but that is not the issue here, the suspected grave site was dug up. We then have a site dug up by Father Dubois at Busk, alleged to be a mass grave of Jews killed by the Germans. All I have is a link to a video, in Spanish with English commentary:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sV-Xs-SY9co [5]

We can clearly see that some bodies were disturbed, all be it only the first layer, as claimed. To prove of German guilt, German bullets are shown, in other words, no evidence that Germans were the perpetrators because the Soviets used German bullets at Katyn, the site where they killed Polish officials. Then we have the Sobibor ‘investigation’, overseen by the Israeli archaeologist Yoram Haimi. From a Ha’aretz article of June 7, 2013:

“Further excavations are planned at the site with the approval of the Polish chief rabbi, Rabbi Shudrich, including in two places where Jews are thought to be buried.”

http://www.haaretz.com/jewish-world/jew ... m-1.528438 [6]

Chief Rabbi Shudrich is the same Rabbi Dr. Sturdy Colls had to ask permission of to do her so-called investigation at Treblinka. Why did the Rabbi not allow her to dig, as he did at Sobibor?

This article by Dr. Sturdy Colls is nothing but an attempt to explain why a thorough investigation, by experts in the field, will not be done. The reasons given are however not convincing, far from it. Germans are accused of having murdered between 5 and 6 million Jews, yet no investigation by experts in the field of crime investigations has ever been undertaken. Enough stalling already, and no more attempts at devising special methods to make it appear an investigation is done. If everything is as obvious as claimed, call in the experts and allow them to do their work.

If Revisionists are to go away, substantial evidence has to be produced, and that article makes it clear that this will not be the case. Why not? The burial law? That law is applied selectively, if it is suspected that bodies will be found exceptions are made. This leaves only one possibility: The promoters of “The Holocaust” know that no graves will be found at Treblinka, for instance, graves large enough to have held the hundreds of thousand allegedly killed there and buried at first. Efforts are therefore made to hide behind laws, and sadly, a scientist like Dr. Caroline Sturdy Colls is supportive of those efforts.

Wilfried Heink

Article printed from Inconvenient History | Revisionist Blog: http://revblog.codoh.com

URL to article: http://revblog.codoh.com/2013/08/how-to ... stigation/

URLs in this post:

[1] http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/m ... 2/art00002: http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/m ... 2/art00002

[2] http://www.ushmm.org/education/foreducators/guideline/: http://www.ushmm.org/education/foreducators/guideline/

[3] http://revblog.codoh.com/2011/06/a-clos ... %E2%80%9D/: http://revblog.codoh.com/2011/06/a-clos ... %E2%80%9D/

[4] http://web.utsandiego.com/news/2009/Apr ... ve-042109/: http://web.utsandiego.com/news/2009/Apr ... ve-042109/

[5] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sV-Xs-SY9co: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sV-Xs-SY9co

[6] http://www.haaretz.com/jewish-world/jew ... m-1.528438: http://www.haaretz.com/jewish-world/jew ... m-1.528438
Only lies need to be shielded from debate, truth welcomes it.

neugierig
Valued contributor
Valued contributor
Posts: 352
Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2002 7:01 pm

Re: Caroline Sturdy Colls publishes

Postby neugierig » 6 years 11 months ago (Fri Aug 02, 2013 1:58 pm)

Thank you, Mr. Moderator. I just didn't want to clutter the place up, and thank you also for doing some work on the article.

Regards
Wilf

User avatar
TheBlackRabbitofInlé
Valuable asset
Valuable asset
Posts: 834
Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2011 10:38 am

Re: Caroline Sturdy Colls publishes

Postby TheBlackRabbitofInlé » 6 years 11 months ago (Fri Aug 02, 2013 7:48 pm)

Great article Wilf.

Here's some of Dr. Sturdy Colls' findings on display in the museum at Treblinka:
http://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=7361&hilit=colls
Nazis tried to create super-soldiers, using steroids ... they sought to reanimate the dead—coffins of famous Germanic warriors were found hidden in a mine, with plans to bring them back to life at the war’s end.
- Prof. Noah Charney

neugierig
Valued contributor
Valued contributor
Posts: 352
Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2002 7:01 pm

Re: Caroline Sturdy Colls publishes

Postby neugierig » 6 years 11 months ago (Fri Aug 02, 2013 8:04 pm)

Thanks for the flowers, Rabbit. And yes, I don’t need much, a few hinges, some pots, shoes, spoons and so on and I am convinced that “The Holocaust” happened. It’s just these terrible deniers that keep asking for real evidence. :mrgreen:

Regards
Wilf

User avatar
Hannover
Valuable asset
Valuable asset
Posts: 10065
Joined: Sun Nov 24, 2002 7:53 pm

Re: Caroline Sturdy Colls publishes

Postby Hannover » 6 years 11 months ago (Fri Aug 02, 2013 8:06 pm)

Wilf, I concur, an excellent, well focused piece.

The Black Rabbit said:
Here's some of Dr. Sturdy Colls' findings on display in the museum at Treblinka:
Dr. Sturdy-Colls discoveries at Treblinka

Indeed, the presence of everyday objects and backyard rubbish prove without a doubt that this was a mass extermination site. :roll:
"These Holocaust deniers are very slick people. They justify everything they say with facts and figures."

- Steven Some, Chairman of the New Jersey Commission on Holocaust Education, Newark Star-Ledger, 23 Oct. 1996, p 15.

Revisionists are just the messengers, the absurd impossibility of the 'holocaust' story line is the message.
The tide is turning.

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

Thames Darwin
Valued contributor
Valued contributor
Posts: 193
Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2013 12:55 pm

Re: Caroline Sturdy Colls publishes

Postby Thames Darwin » 6 years 11 months ago (Fri Aug 02, 2013 8:13 pm)

I agree as well. No doubt this "Sturdy Colls" is one of the tribe.

User avatar
Hannover
Valuable asset
Valuable asset
Posts: 10065
Joined: Sun Nov 24, 2002 7:53 pm

Re: Caroline Sturdy Colls publishes

Postby Hannover » 6 years 11 months ago (Fri Aug 02, 2013 8:18 pm)

Thames Darwin wrote:I agree as well. No doubt this "Sturdy Colls" is one of the tribe.

Not sure about that, but she is feeding at the trough nonetheless. Her embarrassing spin on the lack of results is actually quite humorous.

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

User avatar
borjastick
Valuable asset
Valuable asset
Posts: 2642
Joined: Fri Aug 26, 2011 5:52 am
Location: Europe

Re: Caroline Sturdy Colls publishes

Postby borjastick » 6 years 11 months ago (Sun Aug 04, 2013 5:55 am)

I have recently done some rudimentary research, call it a casual google search and subsequent reading, into the mass murder by the Khmer Rouge. The point being to look at the differences between the acceptance of these crimes and those claimed to have happened in the holocaust. The Sturdey Colls report and Wilf's assessment of it highlights some of the major differences.

The issue of the KR crimes seems to be in little doubt. The numbers are wide ranging from 500,000 - 2,500,000 but no one doubts the acts themselves as there are sites, excavations, and plenty of human remains. This is entirely different to the holocaust. Sturdey Colls' proposed method of holocaust archeology is quite extraordinary. She seems to be saying that one can stand at a site claimed as a site of mass murder, in this case Treblinka, and carry out zero invasive research and yet arrive at an acceptable definitive conclusion.

If I go to the killing fields I can see with my own eyes the skeletons by the tens of thousand and yet there appears to be no revisionist activity concerning this part of history, I guess there's no money to be chased, or land to be thieved from the locals!
'Of the four million Jews under Nazi control in WW2, six million died and alas only five million survived.'

'We don't need evidence, we have survivors' - israeli politician

neugierig
Valued contributor
Valued contributor
Posts: 352
Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2002 7:01 pm

Re: Caroline Sturdy Colls publishes

Postby neugierig » 6 years 11 months ago (Sun Aug 04, 2013 9:46 am)

Thank you all for the kind remarks, Gentlemen.

And yes, you are correct borjastick, any crime scene is thoroughly investigated by experts. In fact Dr. Sturdy Colls mentions this, but then suggests that with the alleged Holo crime scenes all one needs to do is “…stand at a site claimed as a site of mass murder…and carry out zero invasive research and yet arrive at an acceptable definitive conclusion”, as you put it so aptly. A contradiction to be sure, but that seems to have escaped her.

The ‘investigation’ method suggested by Dr. Sturdy Colls will no doubt be adopted. In the radio show about this Treblinka ‘investigation’, we have this:

“CH: Does your work have implications for other mass burial sites in Poland and elsewhere?
25:00 C: I think so, its not just about demonstrating what exists in T its very much hoped that the results show the potential for these methods, particular with regards to Jewish sited where these methods can be taken, they can be utilized to isolate execution sites for example and its mass graves in Jewish cemeteries where the Nazis rounded up whole villages and executed them. A lot of those sites aren't museums, they aren't marked, they aren't commemorated and I really hope that this is the first stage, if you like, in a long program to seek out these graves of the Holocaust.
25:30 CH: Poland chief Rabbi agrees, implications are immense, opening up a whole new area of research of the Holocaust.
25:40 Rabbi: I have no question that once we see that this method works, not only six death camps but also hundreds of smaller mass graves , Jews were shot, discovering over the last couple of years how many of these graves are still unmarked today. Bystanders testifying, synagogue burned with Jews in it and buried “there”, pointing,…”
. (my rough transcript. CH=Jonathan Charles, commentator; C=Dr. Caroline Sturdy Colls) http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b019rlns

Brace yourselves, with the alleged crime scenes moving further east, we might be in for a whole mass of similar ‘investigations’, expanding “The Holocaust”.

I have suggested before that we make efforts to launch a real investigation. It will cost money and there is no guarantee that we will find experts to investigate. But all of that could be used in our favor. Sadly however, the Revisionist community does not exist, only individuals, some with huge Egos. The reason why we are not successful.

Sadly Yours
Wilf

neugierig
Valued contributor
Valued contributor
Posts: 352
Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2002 7:01 pm

Re: Caroline Sturdy Colls publishes

Postby neugierig » 6 years 9 months ago (Sun Sep 15, 2013 7:57 pm)

I just received this, titled “Unearthed... the horrors of Hitler's WW2 death camp in Treblinka”
http://www.express.co.uk/entertainment/ ... -Treblinka

It is of course re. the ‘investigation’ done by Dr. Caroline Sturdy Colls. It appears that we are treated to a film first, for conditioning, before the final report will be released. This would suggest that the report is, ahem, inconclusive, because if it would present indisputable evidence we would have seen it first.

But then, here I go again with my conspiracy hallucinations. :mrgreen:

Regards
Wilf


Return to “'Holocaust' Debate / Controversies / Comments / News”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Archie and 5 guests