Be sure to read the Rules/guidelines before you post!
Mattogno is showing his proficiency in Polish and Muehlenkamp is getting demolished. I am in the second last chapter of the 1500 page tome and I am simply blown away by the mathematics Mattogno has gone through. Truly a sharp mind he has.
I also wanted to mention that Graf stated in this massive book that due to them responding to the cut and paste manifesto, a book on the einstazgruppen has been delayed. Mattogno stated that a work of his culminating in twenty years research called THE AUSCHWITZ CREMATORY OVENS has not been put into English yet because of his time spent on this response to the cut and paste manifesto. He mentions this on page 1296 and you can see the Italian version here.
So the future looks great for these fine gentlemen.
blogbuster Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 1:42 am
Pretty clear the infamous Internet crimimals:
-Nicholas Terry of Exeter University
-Sergey Romanov the insidious Russian Homosexual
-Roberto Muehlenkamp the bi polar son of a Nazi war criminal
(Andrew the weasel Mathis ran away a long time ago)
-have bailed out on hate blogging since their overwhelming defeat by the anti kook watch dog group Hate Blog Watch!
They barely post on their own blog, and no longer post on public forums using their real names!
Furthermore, that moron Nick Terry is the laughing stock of the university campus...
They are done!
All they have left are a lonely Favela boy and a dirty drunk
Well if others are in fact whispering among themselves in the faculty lounge that Nick Terry's contribution to the HC group is laughable because of what the revisionists have exposed about them, I have to wonder if more educators are becoming revisionists themselves but staying in the closet, or if they are true believers in the holocaust religion but save their skepticism for the HC tactics of plagarising the research and sources of others - much like in the vein of the HEART group and the hateblogwatch group. Either way, believer or not, more people need to be aware of the laughable 'scholarship' of the HC group.
HC’s Operation Reinhard White Paper eviscerated
https://rodoh.info/forum/viewtopic.php? ... 0&start=20
Charles Traynor Tue Nov 19, 2013 7:41 pm
Great news! The MGK tome: “The “Extermination Camps” of "Aktion Reinhardt" is now available for purchase in book form.
One assumes the HC crew never got around to publishing their cut and paste manifesto in hard copy because they were worried about the possibility of being dragged through the courts over the many copyright infringements contained within “their” work.
Statistical Mechanic Posted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 1:57 am
"Leafing" through this forum, I've noticed that even more than most deniers this one, Charles Traynor, rarely gives specifics for his exercises in rhetoric. Here is another example of this habit: he claims "hundreds of cases" of plagiarism in a blog and concern on the part of its author for legal jeopardy on account of said plagiarism - implying in the process that plagiarism will not be penalized in blog-form while it will be in "hard copy."
As I am not a mind reader, I am unable to determine exactly what Charles Traynor is talking about and certainly, without his citing examples of his claims, do not take his word for it.
Perhaps he should do some more googling on his computer and he would be able to find the pdf of the MGK tome. Then he could "leaf" through that instead of the rodoh forum and acting like he knows the material when I myself have just completed the whole 1500+ page book. Perhaps Hannover is right. The tide is turning. I happen to think if that is true, more people are staying in the closet due to the current climate of political correctness.
From myself on page one of this topic.
Werd wrote:I just read a little more tonight and in the third chapter, Mattogno simply slaughters Nicholas Terry and exposes him for his underhanded scholarship. So much so that Terry basically commits plagraism by having quotes with a footnote to a source that he never found or read himself but TOOK FROM ANOTHER PERSON'S BIBLIOGRAPHY without crediting that OTHER PERSON.* Hmmmm. Where have I seen this before? Oh yeah, Joan Peters in her book FROM TIME IMMEMORIAL wrote about Palestine being allegedly empty and years later, a young undergraduate named Norman Finkelstein debunked her book while a undergrad student. That would serve him well because someone gave him an uncorrected proofs copy of Alan Dershowitz's THE CASE FOR ISRAEL and he found that Dershowitz borrowed from Peters in the same fashion. Have a quote with a footnote exactly like Peters. Finkelstein pointed out Dershowitz got so involved with doing it that he exposed himself by having elipses in the same places that Peters had them when she was quoting things in her book. NICK TERRY ALSO DID THE SAME STUPID ELIPSES THING AND MATTOGNO BUSTED HIM. And that's just the small potato in chapter 3.
I can't stop reading this pdf. It is amazing.
* Hilariously he seems to have done with with a couple Mattogno books at least twice. He tried to use Mattogno's sources against him basically, but he utterly failed.
Blogbuster used to post here and I know the non-revs have been checking codoh since the MGK book just came out. So maybe Statistical Mechanic will find his way over here in the future and read the pdf. Here's hoping another soul converts and realizes what a joke the HC crowd is.
By the way, this huge book THE EXTERMINATION CAMPS OF AKTION REINHARDT by Mattogno, Graf and Kues will prove many things. One small thing it does is show how Nick Terry is not really a scholar and does not know how to do proper research and citation. And it also undermines his whole curriculum which supposedly proves to students that six million Jews died in gas chambers because the 'final solution' was one of physical extermination.
Statistical Mechanic still can not accept what plagarism is defined as. If you steal a quote from someone and quote it the same way they do in a book you have read, and you also borrow their footnote without telling your reader that this quote and footnote was already used by someone else, then it is plagarism.
What SM, this intellectual dwarf fails to understand or refuses to accept because apparently the holocaust controversies writers are excellent in his warped mind, is that plagarism isn't just putting a quotation from another book in your report word for word and not citing where you got it, it is also making like somone's research into primary sources is your own when it is in fact not. Plagarism is not just about falsely taking credit for a phrase or words. It's about falsely passing off someone's own research and conclusions as your own when you are clearly not the originator.
If this is the best that HC sock puppets can come up with, to ignore the college level definition of plagarism, then they clearly have nothing. In other words, Nick Terry his violated manuals of procedure this his own students are expected to operate by. If this is not hypocrisy, then I do not know what is.
http://hateblogwatch.nazihunter.net/for ... ?f=3&t=302
Larry Posted: Sun Nov 24, 2013 12:16 am
If any of our readers have followed Muehlenkamp on his Holocaust Controversies blog, and not many have looking at the figures, its been a little while since he posted anything. That is very unusual. The man has been prolific in all things Holocaust - for years.
The question must be raised why is Muehlenkamp missing in action now?
Has Mattogno, Kues and Graf wall of text response of some 1500 pages to the shabby cut and paste HC paper on AR sent Roberto into a black depression?
Did the HC Crazy Gang think MGK would not respond - or has Roberto finally realised that debating with Holocaust Deniers is such a drag.
Let us remind our readers that HBW have never deviated from the ARC Challenge to HC members, for years. That we wanted to show the HC Criminals that we had the evidence to prove that they had planted fakes and forgeries on the ARC website, is a well worn path now.
Let us recap;
We invited Romanov to view the evidence - he ignored the request and fled from New York to Canada
We invited Nick Terry to view the evidence - no response
We invited Roberto Muehlenkamp to view the evidence - no response
We invited Mike Peters aka Hans aka Fritz the Rat to view the evidence - no response
We also invited the HC Crazy Gang along with MGK to view the evidence - so far no response.
You have to stop and ask yourself would HBW do that if they didn't have the evidence !!!
So for Roberto and the rest of the Crazy Gang - everyone can see that by refusing to accept the ARC Challenge their credibility is shot.
But lets return to Roberto - his mental illness problems are well known and self-confessed and perhaps he has sought professional help.
For him that might be good news - and a little break might restore his mental health.
Perhaps he is working on a 15,000 page response to MGK - well that's a great use of time. Will that lift his depression?
Will he return - maybe he will - maybe he wont - MGK and HBW have shown him up for what he is and HBW for what they are!
Maybe he will return using another identity - he has used a few other names in the past on RODOH and Axis History Forum
Maybe he will return once the medication has kicked in
Maybe he has realised that Hans has been exposed as Mike Peters and that what HBW has been saying all along aren't baseless smears -but in fact the simple truth - a truth they cannot face, and has now thrown in the towel?
Roberto has been soundly thrashed over the past few months - no wonder he is laying low - this is a well know tactic that Romanov and Terry have employed in the past - didn't do them much good.
if Roberto has been silenced for good - that can only be good news for those that really fight Holocaust Denial.
I will speculate that the HC crew is actually composing a response to the MGK 1500 page tome. But as we have already seen, they and their sockpuppets have made excuses or outright denials of their documented plagarism so I do not expect their response to be of the utmost quality. Perhaps this is what MGK expected they would do and perhaps this is why they said they will not entertain anymore nonsense from the HC crowd after this 1500 page response. They need to get back to work on other projects like a fortcoming study on the Einstazgruppen as well as getting Mattogno's CREMATORY OVENS OF AUSCHWITZ book translated in English as it's already in Italian.
Statistical Mechanic is still making excuses for plagarism. He brags he will not read one word of this MGK response.
http://rodoh.info/forum/viewtopic.php?f ... 0&start=30
You see, I've not read, and shan't be reading, this MGK work you mention. But I knew you'd dodge, because that's what I've seen you do.
Excuse me, but Charles Traynor is not dodging. What's wrong SM? Mattogno writing on page 52 that the HC crowd were busted planting fakes on that website years ago only to be exposed and booted from HEART? You just got spanked by Charles Traynor and you know it.
Charles Traynor PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2013 8:02 am
I’m not going to waste my time giving any specific examples of HC dishonesty because they are already well documented in this great work by MGK. You should actually be grateful I don’t have the time or inclination to pursue this matter further because I notice you’ve already been reduced to hand waving and playing a rather sad game of semantics in a vain effort to defend your heroes in this thread (new window).
A case of shabby plagiarism from Holocaust Controversies
Post subject: Hate blogger and kook Roberto Muehlenkamp is back!
PostPosted: Mon Dec 09, 2013 12:06 am
Looks like Roberto was released from the loony bin as he is back and posting in his same insane manner!
Roberto can you tell us what meds they got you on now? you bi polar nutjob
If that is so, it is not on his blog. The topic Jurgen Graf Keeps On Giving still has only 43 comments, the last dating from Monday, October 21, 2013 2:38:00 pm from Roberto himself.
They even made a thread called F___ Off blogbuster
and blogbuster is continually being accused of being Carmello Lisciotto, the IT expert who helped Chris Webb get control of his website back after the holocaust controversies crowd sabotaged it. And of course they are insulting the name of Lisciotto. The fact that these allegedly 'new guys' have the same modus operandi as the HC crowd to discredit and attack the name of Lisciotto, the man who saved Webb's work and stop the HC takeover, pretty much confirm that they are mere nicknames for the HC crooks. No wonder blogbuster claimed Roberto is back in action. It would appear to be just under a different name. Hell, we even saw a quote earlier from Satistical Mechanic called the new 1500 page book crap but also admitting to not reading it and claiming he was not going to.
Hate blogger and kook Roberto Muehlenkamp is back!
Blogbuster Posted: Sat Dec 14, 2013 1:56 pm
Hey Roberto your ex wife contacted HBW....some fun stuff she shared!
Roberto Luc PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2013 2:55 pm
I really don't understand how the moderators of this forum to allow you post here. If you've been joining in the discussions of the forum I'd understand it, but to let you and C. Webb stalking all the time against HC people it's because they agree with it.
blogbuster Posted: Sat Dec 14, 2013 3:13 pm
Roberto, she did a serious hack job on you... tell all details specific to your ongoing bout with mental illness!
You think people dont know why you disappear for long periods... folks Roberto is in treatment for mental illness!
this guy you all debate and battle with online is really a psycho nutcase, and thats not a joke, its true
blogbuster PostPosted: Sun Dec 15, 2013 9:49 pm
I bet its the inside scoop that the HBW folks say they have on Roberto's struggle with mental illness and constant relapses are what is spurring on bernards irrational lying attacks against that site lol
blogbuster Posted: Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:07 am
the lying frauds wont address this
Duke Umeroffen Posted: Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:51 am
I will do so and quite simply
fuck off Troll.
Blogbuster Posted: Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:53 am
thats what robertos wife told him... then she went to HBW and told all
Why Nick Terrry Holocaust plagiarist fears a return to Rodoh
Blogbuster Posted: Wed Dec 18, 2013 12:11 pm
There was a time in the history of this forum that infamous fat pig of Exeter Nick Terry was a regular poster here.
He was always known for snide/snobby comments, intolerant discourse, vitriol-filled posts, and a plethora of historically inaccurate statements. That being said, he and his pals like weird Andy Mathis, lysing sack of shit Sergey Romanov, and bi polar kook Roberto Muehlenkamp ran rip-shod over this place!
Revisionist posters were abused, believers were attacked, and plots were hatched to steal other peoples websites and take control over RODOH!
Well, things have changed, when Nick and company were shown the door, they pulled the nuclear option, and got Yuku to pull the plug on this forum, after 10 years of existence!
Now RODOH is back yet the pig isn't! Why?
Well all the scandals he and the holocaust controversies hate bloggers were involved with has caused him public disgrace, his crap research was proved to be plagiarized bunk, his hateful personality exposed, but most of all, this disgusting pig knows he wont be able to pull any such stunts today as h did on the past!
Yes the HC clowns are still here, all hiding behind fake sockpuppet personas, supported by idiotic trolls, but they are the shadow of their former selves.... never to recover!
I thank all who played a part in bringing down these despicable people!
Destroying rodoh when it was hosted by yuku back in the day? I wonder why they would do that? Perhaps Carlo mattogno has the answer on page 58.
it is easy to see why, after a few initial responses, I decided to refrain from continuing to reply to the claims of the “controversial bloggers” unless their claims were published in print, a condition which they, typically, interpreted as “desperation” on my part (p. 11). This condition was intended solely to establish substantially what on the web is only virtual, a fact obvious even to the bloggers themselves, since they state “internet links are ephemeral and tend to ‘decay’ as time passes.” (p. 1). In other words, in blogs one can write the most obvious nonsense and it may disappear after a few years, to the benefit of the authors of that complete nonsense. A printed text, on the other hand, remains in existence, fixing the author’s responsibility for a much longer period of time.
So is it any wonder the HC crowd have resorted to using sock puppets on the internet to troll on the new rodoh and the hateblogwatch forum and cause disruption? Because apparently an archive of the old rodoh has been saved?
Holocaust Controversies scum caught with their Panzers down!
http://hateblogwatch.nazihunter.net/for ... ?f=3&t=294
Notice the date is very close to the pdf release of the 1500 page response of MGK
hateblogwatch Posted: Fri Oct 25, 2013 12:59 pm
Most of you know that prior to Nick Terry lobbying for the RODOH forum to be shut down at its hosting site YUKU.COM, HBW had web-spider'd the entire forum and preserved it offline for posterities sake.
Nick Terry and his pals from HC wanted RODOH removed from the Internet so there was no public record of their past activities and misdeeds. Well we have ensured that record exists.
We have restored the forum in a secure location and plan to release damning posts that reveal the nature of the Holocaust Controversies criminals and those that support them.
There is some stuff here that is a the nail in the coffin for liars like HANS/Michael Peters, Andrew Mathis, Nick Terry, Sergey Romanov and the idiot Robeto Muehlenkamp.
Attached to this post is a pdf of just one thread we found to be amusing.
It is called: "Guess the sockpuppet"
It has many of the cast of characters from RODOH back in the day when the ARC website was vandalized.
The only honest person in the thread is Scott Smith of RODOH, the rest are lying scum.
Funny, the last post we show in the thread is someone admitting that HANS was a character name Max, and we all know Max was the address of the Andy Schmidt sock puppet created by Sergey Romanov and Michael Peters when they created their fake holocaust photos.
lol these HC idiots just keep digging themselves deeper and deeper with their denials!
http://hateblogwatch.nazihunter.net/for ... .php?id=74
So in other words the HC crowd got hit doubly hard in late October. By the revisionists and by fellow exterminationists who hate their guts for good reasons. Thanks to the work of both sides of the holocaust debate, Roberto Muehlenkamp does not get a lot of flattering returns for his name in a google search anymore. I say, good! Finally, check this out. This is the old thread HAS ROBERTO BEEN SILENCED FOR GOOD?
Boaz Posted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 8:21 pm
Blogbuster from the RODOH forum believes that Sergey Romanov has begun a renewed effort to attack the ARC website and is using sock puppets on that forum as a distraction.
It may be time for us to put some of our evidence into play?
I don't know what this means. Perhaps some of the evidence obtained from IT expert Lisciotto about the HC crew's cybercrimes with their attacks on Webb's site? The stuff they have been claiming to have been sitting on for years only to release it at an ARC teleconference where the HC would stand to answer for the accusations levelled against them? Inquiring minds wish to know. The more dirt on these people, the better.
I tried to access the hateblogwatch website listed in Werd's last post and my internet security wouldn't allow me access because the site tried to install a trojan program on my computer.
Edited to ask:
Werd, why wont the members of either of these two groups (HBW & HC) come here and defend their beliefs by answerig all the great questions that are being asked on CODOH about the so-called holoacaust?
First of all, Roberto I think used to post here and he has been demolished. Whenever Roberto Muehlenkamp of holocaust controversies is mentioned, or someone here promotes his work because they think they can refute revisionists, Hannover usually posts links to certain topics in quote tags. The topics that can be found here.
irrational Roberto Muehlenkamp demolished at this forum
irrational Roberto Muehlenkamp demolished at this forum
Hannover wrote:Here we have another promoter of the Jewish supremacist 'holocaust' story line, 'Roberto Muehlenkamp'. Here we also have examples of the complete absurdity of his arguments.
It's funny how such individuals continue to purvey their impossible rants in spite of being utterly debunked. Have a look at these:
R.Muehlenkamp: 'gas chambers' were hosed down, so no cyanide
Those Prussian Blues Just Won't Wash
Roberto Muehlenkamp: no fuel required for Auschwitz ovens
Roberto Muehlenkamp shredded on 'gassings' & cyanide
Roberto Muehlenkamp debunked on 3.5kg of coke cremations
Cremation patent & 3.5 kg of coke per corpse debunked
As to your other question, Roberto having been here solved nothing for his ridiculous cause. I think Nick Terry used to post here too but as to why he no longer does I have no idea. Perhaps a moderator can let us know. As for blogbuster, he used to post here but I think he was banned. He and I have quoted each other back and forth on the respective boards we post on in order to expose the tactics of the holocaust controversies bloggers.
'We don't need evidence, we have survivors' - israeli politician
Nick Terry is registered, his account is active and he can post here if he chooses. One would think he'd welcome the chance to debate his position.I think Nick Terry used to post here too but as to why he no longer does I have no idea. Perhaps a moderator can let us know.
Mods please delete this current post you are reading now.
http://rodoh.info/forum/viewtopic.php?f ... &start=140
blogbuster Holocaust Controversies Hate Blog Exposed!
The Holocaust Controversies hate bloggers have been thoroughly vanquished by the Hate Blog Watchers for their infamous attacks on the HEART and ARC websites.
Nick Terry, Sergey Romanov, Andrew Mathis, and Roberto Muehlenkamp all realize they stand no chance against the formidable Internet watchdog group HBW so they have gone underground and begun a new campaign of slander and harassment, this time here on RODOH.
Abandoning their real names (because no one takes those idiots seriously), they took on the form of sock puppets calling themselves "Statistical Mechanic" or some other moronic pseudo name...
They have infested RODOH attacking in the Holocaust debate forum, as well as in the SE forum desperately trying to destroy any and all opposition to HC!
One character, widely known as "pissboy" a degenerate drunk from Scotland, who calls himself Duke Umerofferon or the "dirty duke" is making a total fool of himself slandering the RODOH moderation team.
He launched a spam/troll campaign against the Hate Blog Watchers by attacking their forum, but they rapidly shut him down and humiliated him. (the posts HE made are all still there at the HBW forum)
Will this trio of filth, Duke, Bernard, StatMoron, HANS, all HC idiots succeed in a renewed attempt to destroy the RODOH forum a second time?
Doubtful, as DC the RODOH moderator is clearly on the ball!
blogbuster Posted: Fri Jan 03, 2014 1:24 pm
Rumor has it the criminal hat bloggers are planning a new website from which they plan to attack holocaust historians and revisionists.
We are ready for then . Every time they turn up the heat we take humiliating them to a whole new level. exposing their crimes, theirs misdeeds. their abuse of Jews and victims oft he holocaust...
Nick Terry you can look forward to this forever, give thanks to Sergey and your troll
blogbuster Posted: Fri Jan 03, 2014 11:09 pmBlogbuster wrote:
Check out the latest FACTUAL REPORT from the HC exposure blogs!
Here is one relevent link: http://holocaustcalamities.blogspot.com ... caust.html (new window)
Despite all their lies, here we see HC stealing from HEART!
hahaha lying hypocrites
http://holocaustcalamities.blogspot.ca/ ... caust.html
A mimicry blog designed to raise awareness to the insidious nature of the Holocaustcontroversies hate blog created by Sergey Romanov and Nick Terry!
Tuesday, June 18, 2013
More research theft from Holocaust Controversies (the criminal hate blog)
Despite the hateful slander attacks against www.HolocaustResearchProject.org, the criminals from the notorius hate blog "Holocaust Controversies" have decided to steal research work from that greate website when it suits their needs.
Nick Terry (an Exeter University Lecturer)
Roberto Muehlenkamp ( a documented bi-polar loon)
Sergey Romanov ( a documented thug and kook )
Andrew E. Mathis ( a proven stalker and thug)
are each and every one of them a hypocrite, and lying sack of shit!
See photo for proof (although Roberto will probably change the link to www.HolocaustResearchProject.org as soon as he realizes we busted him!
Another case of Nicholas Terry not reading the works he cites
Posted on December 18, 2013 by holocausthistorychannel
As I have previously pointed out, the bloggers of holocaust controversies are not particularly honest in their citation practices. This dishonesty extends beyond the fraudulent citations of archival documents: the bloggers also enjoy padding their bibliography and upping their footnote count (to which they attach considerable importance) by citing books and articles they have not actually used in preparing their writings. The following example illustrates this dishonest practice.
In the holocaust controversies manifesto, Nick Terry writes that John Demjanjuk’s death sentence “was overturned on appeal due to the emergence of new evidence and the realisation that this was a case of mistaken identity”. He gives the following citation:
The most comprehensive examination of the mistaken identity aspect of the case is in Willem A. Wagenaar, Identifying Ivan. A Case Study in Legal Psychology. Hemel Hempsted, 1988. Wagenaar was an expert witness for Demjanjuk’s defense.
Later, Terry states that “the entire affair was a case of manifestly mistaken identity, whose origins however could easily be traced back to the fact that Demjanjuk did indeed look rather like Ivan Marchenko, the real ‘Ivan the Terrible’” and cites “Wagenaar, Identifying Ivan” – again without giving any specific page number.
It’s evident that Terry did no more than skim Wagenaar’s book – evident because the book does not confirm Terry’s statements. Wagenaar never mentions the name Ivan Marchenko. Nor, for that matter, does Wagenaar confirm Terry’s claim that this was a case of mistaken identity. In fact, his book concludes with the statement “If the reader wants an answer to the question whether John Demjanjuk is Ivan, I can only refer to the court’s verdict. It is the best answer we have.” Whatever doubts he may have had, Wagenaar went along with the Jerusalem court’s verdict that Demjanjuk was “Ivan the Terrible” – so how can Terry cite Wagenaar for the “mistaken identity aspect of the case”? Certainly Wagenaar might be cited for the flaws in the identification procedures, but not for the “mistaken identity aspect”. This is another giveaway that Terry did not read Wagenaar’s book with any care.
In fact, Terry habitually cites books he has not studied. For example, in a discussion with me (intermediated by Roberto Muehlenkamp), he revealed a shocking ignorance of the contents of David Engel’s two books on the Polish government in exile, despite having cited them both in his writings. This behavior is particularly hypocritical coming from the leading member of a team that likes to polemicize against their opponents’ “lack of reading”.
Will Nick Terry ever offer an open and honest confession to his dishonest bibliographic puffery? The upcoming second edition of the manifesto offers the opportunity for him to make a clean breast of it, but I’m not holding my breath.
http://holocausthistorychannel.wordpres ... roversies/
A case of shabby plagiarism by Holocaust Controversies
Posted on November 21, 2013 by holocausthistorychannel
Ever since the December 2011 release of their “white paper”, the bloggers of Holocaust Controversies have been dogged by the accusation of plagiarism. A number of cases which substantiate this accusation are discussed in a recently released book, but even this lengthy book could not address all instances of the bloggers’ plagiarism and misrepresentation. This post will discuss a case which said book does not mention, and which also has a significance beyond illustrating the misconduct of the controversial bloggers.
On page 50 of the “white paper”, Nick Terry refers to a report which he introduces as follows:
A second report came from two Belgian POWs, who had observed hundreds of wagons passing through the Rawa Ruska rail junction and returning empty. Those who died on the way or were shot trying to escape were dumped unceremoniously onto the side of the tracks.
He then quotes the report:
What made the most impression on them was the extermination of the Jews. They had both witnessed atrocities. One of the Belgians saw truck loads of Jews carried off into a wood and the trucks returning a few hours later – empty. Bodies of Jewish children and women were left lying in ditches and along the railways. The Germans themselves, they added, boasted that they had constructed gas chambers where Jews were systematically killed and buried.
and offers the following citation
PRB Stockholm to PID London, 18.5.43, PRO FO 371/34430; cf. Bankier, p.110
Nick has explained his citation system: this form of reference means that he has seen the original document
Where we have seen the documents ourselves, but it is already known in the literature, we have written Kommandant in Weissruthenien Ia, Befehl Nr. 24, 24.11.41, gez. v. Bechtolsheim, NARB 378-1-698, p. 32; cf. Browning, Origins, p. 289.
and added that
where we have cited archival documents, they were seen in their original context.
so we know that he is claiming to have seen the document himself – and in its proper file context to boot.
Now, let’s take a look at the relevant passage of the document from PRO FO 371/34430
Notice a couple of differences: first, in the document the gas chambers are located in Lemberg, whereas in Nick Terry’s version their location isn’t given. Perhaps I’d better point out that Belzec and Lemberg are in opposite directions from Rawa Ruska. There’s no way anyone in Rawa Ruska would have confused Lemberg with Belzec.
Second, the bit about seeing “hundreds of wagons passing through the Rawa Ruska rail junction” is not supported by the document in any way.
On the other hand, here is the relevant page from the book by Bankier:
Bankier’s rendition is identical to Nick Terry’s version.
1. Nick Terry took his quotation from and description of this document from David Bankier rather than from the original document. For the sake of generosity, I will take him at his word and accept that he has seen the document, but will add that it appears unlikely that he read the document, and quite certain that he did not use the document.
2. David Bankier published a severely altered quotation which actually went so far as to reverse the order of sentences – and than claimed that he was using “the words of the British agent who spoke to [the Belgians]“. His altered quotation omitted the key fact that the reported gas chambers were located in Lemberg, not Belzec. This is very poor behavior on the part of the onetime head of the International Institute for Holocaust Research at Yad Vashem.
3. The document is not evidence about the “discovery process” of extermination in gas chambers at Belzec, but rather a nice illustration of the prevalence of false wartime rumors about gas chambers.
In their white paper, the bloggers emphasize the importance of openly acknowledging mistakes:
We also expect MGK to take note of many of the serious errors which we have spotlighted in this critique. We have demonstrated that they are unequivocally wrong on innumerable occasions. Simply adapting or omitting their mistakes from future versions of their work will not be good enough; instead, we would hope that MGK admit their mistakes in an honest fashion, open to their readers and the public.
Similarly, I would hope that Nick Terry and his fellow bloggers address this shameful case of misrepresentation in an open and forthright fashion. Sadly, it is to be expected that in this as in other cases, they will attempt to quietly fix the error without any admission of wrongdoing.
MGK admitted to a few mistakes in their past books in THE AKTION REINHARDT CAMPS book 1500 pages long. So what does the HC crew do? Make excuses as already shown on page one of this topic, run away and hide when those arguments are shot down, and emerge later as sock puppets on rodoh and hateblogwatch and troll and disrupt the hell out of those two boards. And and refuse the ARC teleconference challenge for the third year in a row.
http://www.holocaustcontroversies.blogs ... art-3.html
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests