Recent article from David Cole

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Recent article from David Cole

Postby TheBlackRabbitofInlé » 6 years 5 months ago (Sun Jan 12, 2014 7:03 pm)

Full article here:
http://www.countercontempt.com/archives/5045

I'll just quote a few bits:

Saying you’re going after “deniers” is the easiest way to get people on-board with censorship. The desire to pound deniers transcends political left or right. When Congressman John Conyers and the NAACP and a bunch of academic elites held a conference at Hofstra University to craft legislation that would ban “hate speech” in the U.S., what villain did they choose to put on trial in the moot court that was held to test the model legislation? A Holocaust denier.

But, as one of the authors of the model legislation admitted to me in an interview, the legislation would actually affect anyone who’s accused of “insulting” any racial/ethnic/religious minority. The law – and this was explicitly stated to me in my exclusive interview with the person who crafted it – would ban a leftist like Michael Moore from releasing a book titled “Stupid White Men,” and a conservative like David Horowitz from claiming that American blacks aren’t entitled to reparations.

Both sides, left and right, would suffer, all from a law that was to be sold to the public as a way to combat “Holocaust denial.”
That law never passed. Hence, Hikind’s attempt to take a different route by forcing credit card companies to make moral judgments regarding who can use their services. Let’s be clear on exactly what happened. A state politician – a “public servant” – has successfully lobbied major credit card companies to prevent American citizens from using their services based merely on the opinions that those Americans hold. If you say, “so what? Those opinions are odious,” then congratulations, you’ve taken the bait. Thanks for being so easily manipulated; you’re a real hero.

[...]

My forthcoming book is filled with information to debunk the belief that there is some hard line in the sand that separates “revisionists” from “real historians.” I’ll give just a few examples here.

On an episode of the Charlie Rose Show from May 8, 1996, this exchange regarding revisionism took place between Christopher Hitchens and Eric Breindel (editorial page editor of The New York Post):

Hitchens: Most of what I know, I’ve learned from arguing with people with whom I disagree, often very violently.

Breindel: Well, this is true, but there are levels of the game. I mean, I assume that there are serious scholars, or people you would find serious in the sense that they unearth new information, who publish in, for example, the journal of The Institute for Historical Review, which dedicates itself primarily to proving, for example, that there were no gas chambers at Nazi death camps. There has been scholarship, Christopher, in those journals. Let there be no doubt about it. They have uncovered train records that many of us who study this field didn’t know existed. They go to the actual archives.

Hitchens: I also quote Raul Hilberg, who you, I know, know is one of the senior historians of the Holocaust story – in many ways, the original historian of it. His book in 1961, The Destruction of European Jewry, is considered to be the standard. He said to me, “Look, David Irving has made me go back and look at things again. David Irving has made me re-examine things I thought I knew for sure. David Irving has made me go over some ground, ask me how I know things, and I welcome this kind of challenge.”


Twenty years earlier, in Canada, at a criminal trial of a man accused of “revisionism,” the aforementioned Raul Hilberg admitted on the stand that revisionists play an important role in Holocaust history:

Lawyer: It appears, then, that even today some of the relevant documents to give us a clear understanding of this massive situation are still missing. would you agree?

Raul Hilberg: Oh yes.

Lawyer: And some of them might very clearly contradict some of our firmly fixed views.

Hilberg: I can never exclude the possibility of contradiction. After all, there are people who maintain (at the recent historians conference) at Stuttgart that Hitler did not give any orders (for the extermination of the Jews).

Lawyer: Yes. so in fact people questioning these types of situations can be of use to you and to others in stimulating further research.

Hilberg: Obviously.


I caution people against equating an organization like the Institute for Historical Review with odious enterprises like NAMBLA or the Westboro Baptist Church. Good research does indeed come from revisionist historians. Indeed, currently there are many important contemporaneous documents relating to the war and the Holocaust that can be found in English only on some of the sites that Dov Hikind blacklisted (the IHR, David Irving’s site, Castle Hill and CODOH, and Inconvenient History).

Does that mean I vouch for everything on those sites? Of course not. Does that mean I vouch for the character of everyone who buys material from those sites? Of course not. The cowardly nature of the silence of my former conservative allies regarding Hikind’s activities may perhaps be better understood if one imagines how the right would react if a New York Democrat pressured Visa, MasterCard, AmEx, Discovery, and Paypal to withdraw services from gun dealers, on the grounds that some customers of gun shops might be “bad people.”
Nazis tried to create super-soldiers, using steroids ... they sought to reanimate the dead—coffins of famous Germanic warriors were found hidden in a mine, with plans to bring them back to life at the war’s end.
- Prof. Noah Charney

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Re: Recent article from David Cole

Postby fountainhead » 6 years 5 months ago (Sun Jan 12, 2014 8:53 pm)

Wow, so he's finally back? I'm glad at least to hear he's still alive. I noticed he didn't mention whether his statement to the JDL was sincere or not (Where he recanted all his revisionist views). Guess he doesn't want to open up that can of worms again.
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Re: Recent article from David Cole

Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 6 years 5 months ago (Mon Jan 13, 2014 2:15 am)

He raises good points. I hope his new book does well. But the h-myth is more taboo than it was in the early 90's. It's now this thing of us: "hey we're normal people." And mainstream media replying: "you're not normal people." which is a part of the struggle seen in other movements as well. He's trying to make us seem like the normal people of all walks of life that we are. I hope he succeeds.

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Re: Recent article from David Cole

Postby Werd » 6 years 5 months ago (Mon Jan 13, 2014 9:24 am)

Posted comment.


Andrew E. Mathis says:
January 12, 2014 at 7:50 pm

Well, I can see you haven’t learned a God-damned thing. That’s comforting.

First of all, Zündel wasn’t accused of “revisionism.” He was accused of spreading false news, which means lying and knowing you’re lying. Regardless of whether it’s a bullshit charge are not (and it is), you don’t need to misrepresent Zündel’s case.

Second, I can count on the knuckles of one finger the number of Holocaust deniers I’ve encountered who weren’t haters of Jews. If you were honest even for a second, you’d acknowledge that as well. Mark Weber, whom you cite above, is an alumnus of not one but TWO neo-Nazi organizations. Think he’d live next door to you, David?

Third and finally, if you say you’re a revisionist. not a denier, but you deny the method by which half of the Jews killed during WWII died (gas chambers) and the full number of Jews killed, then what exactly do you have left? It’s like saying you’re not a hurricane denier, you just don’t believe that it rains all that hard or that the wind is very strong.

In closing, allow me to congratulate you on being, once again, “ein prima Jude” for the scum of the earth.

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Re: Recent article from David Cole

Postby borjastick » 6 years 5 months ago (Mon Jan 13, 2014 11:05 am)

Another erudite and meaningful piece of nonsense from Mr Mathis. I have met a number of revisionists and wasn't aware of any of them being jew haters. In any case being a jew hater or not isn't the issue: That being allowing the truth of the holocaust to be made public and understood by a very wide audience.

In my opinion those people who hate jews are actually hating Israel and its actions. Your average run of the mill jew is no different to the average Catholic etc. It's Israel's actions and murder of Palestinians etc since 1948 which shapes peoples opinions of 'jews' when in fact it is the zionist in bred loons that shape the opinion.
'Of the four million Jews under Nazi control in WW2, six million died and alas only five million survived.'

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Re: Recent article from David Cole

Postby Werd » 6 years 5 months ago (Mon Jan 13, 2014 1:05 pm)

1. What Zundel was doing was notreally a crime because Canada later struck down the false news law saying it was unconstitutional. People came to their senses and realized he didn't knowingly say things he knew to be wrong. In fact the first trial was so damaging for the holocaust gas chambers that many people refused to be witnesses for the second trial (Raul Hillburg) or the prosecutor remembered how attorney Douglas Christie reduced the jury to laughter at times with other witnesses and wanted nothing to do with them in the second trial.

2. Yes, there are a lot of revisionists who hate Jews and some may in fact be drawn to revisionism because they hate Jews for other reasons. Or some may get into revisionism, see the validity of a lot of it and then hate all Jews. There are a few kooks out there and it needs to be admitted. Unfortunately in some cases anti semitism is earned by certain Jewish behavior. This ALSO needs to be acknowledged once and for all. From the shameful things that have been done in Palestine for decades, to the attacks on free speech in Europe and Canada regarding things as simple is immigraion.

why is it that Jews can openly talk about securing their borders from foreigners in Israel and yet Europeans are not allowed to do so and have to have hate laws over their heads forcing them to shut the fuck up about the influx of Muslim immigrants who are disproportionately prone to raping European women rather than European men. Why did the Jews for example push multiculturalism in Sweden and then ditch out and leave when it got too hectic for them because they couldn't live with what they are telling largely Christian Europeans to live with?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5jl-OJJVAEg

I should think restricting immigration would be something Jews should be FOR since many Muslim savages who immigrate hate Jews AND the non Jewish host nations. See here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dwUrolahPqE

I guess it's the rabbis that are having problems with Muslim immigrants. The communist Jews who live in the good neighbourhoods don't have to deal with the Muslim filth that comes in. But when it gets rough, then they leave.

This is why people are getting pissed off at Jews. Their chutzpah and their double standards. If they want anti semitism to decrease, they need to alter their behavior and start respecting their host nations and culture and stop doing what they can to promote liberalism and open borders while claiming Israel does not have to do so. Talking out of both sides of your mouth will piss people off. When they get mad, analyze your behavior. Look in the mirror and ask if there is anything you need to change in what you say or what you do. Don't say, "It's because I'm Jewish that you hate me isn't it?" If you make it about your religion/culture, you will mistakenly cause others to think that this parasitic behavior is part of your culture by necessity.

3. There are many revisionists about the gas chambers who do not hate Jews. Some do not even think the Rothschilds and other Jews control banking or the media. Some blame the British and the Vatican for controlling the world and using the Jews as frontmen and there is actually some validity to that.

4. I think logically it is possible to be a revisonist and not deny the holocaust. Ernst Zundel AFFIRMED the holocaust and claimed it happened. Did you know that? He said 70 million died from world war two (approximately). He said the second world war was a holocaust for everyone involved. For the Jews, the Japense, the Germans, the French, the English, the Russians, etc.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vSuonGoU8E&NR=1
Start at 7 minute mark.

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Re: Recent article from David Cole

Postby hermod » 6 years 5 months ago (Wed Jan 15, 2014 3:14 am)

Werd wrote:Andrew E. Mathis says:
January 12, 2014 at 7:50 pm

First of all, Zündel wasn’t accused of “revisionism.” He was accused of spreading false news, which means lying and knowing you’re lying. Regardless of whether it’s a bullshit charge are not (and it is), you don’t need to misrepresent Zündel’s case.


"Spreading false news" didn't mean "lying" as Mathis claims. Judicially and historically, that meant "critizing the British King and Nobles". The "spreading false news" offence - now repealed in Canada - was an old British law intended to prevent people from critizing the King and Nobles in the realm of England. The use of that law was just a pretext to silence Zündel and his inconvenient truths.

The "spreading false news" offence, formerly contained in section 181 of the Canadian Criminal Code, found its origins in the ancient statutes dealing with De Scandalis Magnatum (1275) or libels against peers and high officials, enacted in the reigns of Edward I and Richard II, and repealed in England in 1888. The original purpose of the statutes was to "preserve the public peace by the avoidance of rumours and tales 'whereby discord may arise between the king and his people or the great men of his realm'." The statutes did survive long enough to be included under the heading of "spreading false news" in the 1892 Canadian Criminal Code. The inclusion of the offence may have been on an error, since it's doubtful whether anyone in Canada was aware of the British 1888 repeal [of the statutes], which was tucked away in the [English] Law Revision Act. (http://www.aspercentre.ca/Assets/Asper+ ... r+CCLA.pdf - see page 10).

When they used the old "spreading false news" offence against Zundel, did the Canadian Jews attempt to tell us Jews are today's Kings and Nobles and they can't be critized by Gentile serfs? :twisted: (Just joking))

Whatever. Every people knowing the 'Holocaust' tales in depth can see the irony in that story. Defending those farcical holo-tales with a medieval law originally intended to prevent "rumours and tales" from being spread is in fact highy laughable. :lol:

Does Mathis sincerely think a medieval anti-free speech law could help the truth or is he deliberately distorting the "spreading false news" offence in order to lure gullible readers and depict Zündel as a liar? Or maybe worse, is he just an ignorant babbler who doesn't know what he's talking about?
"But, however the world pretends to divide itself, there are ony two divisions in the world to-day - human beings and Germans. – Rudyard Kipling, The Morning Post (London), June 22, 1915

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Re: Recent article from David Cole

Postby Scotsman » 6 years 5 months ago (Wed Jan 15, 2014 5:01 am)

Well, I for one am glad he is 'back' perhaps as a semi-regular revisionist in some capacity, even if it is just for moral support as a sympathetic writer. It is hard not to blame him for wanting to get out of the game, considering he had serious threats against his life.

And let's face it, some unsavory characters have been attracted to revisionism for the wrong reasons, ie. as another way to hate Jews. The quest for historical truth in itself must be the goal, and revisionism need not be tied to any one movement or group. We need more David Coles, who cannot be said to have ulterior motives like the hate groups SPLC and ADL like to claim.

Edit: What is Cole talking about here? This is a story I have not heard:

..and he was stalked by a neo-Nazi serial killer whose story would later be dramatized on “Law and Order.”

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Re: Recent article from David Cole

Postby Werd » 6 years 5 months ago (Wed Jan 15, 2014 9:58 am)

Great post Hermod.


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Re: Recent article from David Cole

Postby Thames Darwin » 6 years 5 months ago (Wed Jan 15, 2014 2:16 pm)

Mathis is a terrorist JDL thug.

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Re: Recent article from David Cole

Postby Hannover » 6 years 5 months ago (Wed Jan 15, 2014 3:45 pm)

Thames Darwin wrote:Mathis is a terrorist JDL thug.
Well, an impotent wannabe thug perhaps, and a very insecure little man, but a terrorist? That and "Jew hater" is the language that Jewish supremacists like Mathis use on anyone who disagrees with them. I wouldn't use that term.

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Re: Recent article from David Cole

Postby Werd » 6 years 5 months ago (Wed Jan 15, 2014 5:38 pm)

Alphonso says:
January 14, 2014 at 5:41 pm

Why should David Cole or any other person who happens to be Jewish receive death threats for simply stating an opinion on a historical subject? http://www.ihr.org/books/ztn.html
Do you think Paul Eisen should receive death threats as well?
http://pauleisen.blogspot.com.au/2008/0 ... enier.html
As for the alleged gas chambers they have been demolished by
The Leuchter Report – http://www.ihr.org/books/leuchter/leuchter.toc.html
The Luftl Report – http://codoh.com/library/document/2383
The Rudolf Report – http://www.holocausthandbooks.com/index.php?page_id=2
And claims of diesel gas chambers are countered here – http://www.nazigassings.com/dieselgaschambera.html
Also watch the documentaries here – http://codoh.com/library/categories/1167

Andrew E. Mathis says:
January 15, 2014 at 11:03 am

Did I say David Cole should receive death threats? No.
Do I think Paul Eisen should receive death threats? No.
If you want to discuss gas chambers, please let me know. We can play my little game with Krema II. So far, no denier has ever won. Want to be the first?

Does anyone know what Mathis is talking about here?

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Re: Recent article from David Cole

Postby TheBlackRabbitofInlé » 6 years 5 months ago (Wed Jan 15, 2014 5:57 pm)

What is Cole talking about here? This is a story I have not heard:

..and he was stalked by a neo-Nazi serial killer whose story would later be dramatized on “Law and Order.”


I'd not heard that either, but I'd not heard "he faked his death by pretending to drown off the coast of San Diego" :!:

I've never watched a single minute of a single episode, but with Google and Wikipedia, I can find a few (i.e. 2) mentions of 'nazi' or 'neo-nazis' in plot summaries for Law and Order, the second being for a spin-off show: Law & Order: Special Victims Unit. The first was about an elderly German-American, ex-Aktion T4 staff, who euthanasias his sick wife, that was broadcast in the mid-1990s. The other is about some 'neo-nazis' who run a gun shop, a black child gets shot at school by one of their guns, later one of them shoots-up a courtroom killing a judge; broadcast in 2005/6.

Neither of them sound likely. Maybe they dropped the 'neo-nazi' bit for the show?
Last edited by TheBlackRabbitofInlé on Wed Jan 15, 2014 5:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Nazis tried to create super-soldiers, using steroids ... they sought to reanimate the dead—coffins of famous Germanic warriors were found hidden in a mine, with plans to bring them back to life at the war’s end.
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Re: Recent article from David Cole

Postby TheBlackRabbitofInlé » 6 years 5 months ago (Wed Jan 15, 2014 5:58 pm)

Werd wrote:
Andrew E. Mathis says:
If you want to discuss gas chambers, please let me know. We can play my little game with Krema II. So far, no denier has ever won. Want to be the first?

Does anyone know what Mathis is talking about here?


Nope. But ask him what his Krema II game is.
Nazis tried to create super-soldiers, using steroids ... they sought to reanimate the dead—coffins of famous Germanic warriors were found hidden in a mine, with plans to bring them back to life at the war’s end.
- Prof. Noah Charney


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