Impossible Treblinka claims = 10 X L.A. Coliseum capacity

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Impossible Treblinka claims = 10 X L.A. Coliseum capacity

Postby Hannover » 5 years 4 months ago (Mon May 12, 2014 9:20 pm)

The Los Angeles Coliseum holds about 90,000 spectators.

The claim by Zionists is that ca. 900,000 Jews were murdered & buried at the "death camp" Treblinka. That's ten times the capacity of the Los Angeles Coliseum. An utterly laughable & impossible claim.

Image
Los Angeles Coliseum filled to capacity.

No such mass graves exist, nor could they exist at the site alleged.

For more see:
E. Hunt's "Treblinka Archaeology Hoax" Video / READY TO VIEW

The 'holocaust' storyline is one of the most easily debunked narratives ever contrived. That is why those who debunk it are arrested and persecuted. That is why violent racist Jewish supremacists demand that there be no open debate.

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Re: Impossible Treblinka claims = 10 X L.A. Coliseum capacit

Postby Dresden » 5 years 4 months ago (Mon May 12, 2014 10:33 pm)

For a very rough comparison:

The "mass graves" of Treblinka, according to Vasili Grossman's wild imagination, were about 18,000 square meters all together.

The Coliseum is about 75,000 square meters; ten Coliseums would be about 750,000 square meters, or, about 42 times the size of the Treblinka "mass graves".

It would be like burying a horse in a shoe box!

A horse in a shoe box wouldn't require an "archaeologist" to find it.
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Re: Impossible Treblinka claims = 10 X L.A. Coliseum capacit

Postby borjastick » 5 years 4 months ago (Tue May 13, 2014 1:31 am)

Steve you may well be right that Grossman's calculation was 18,000sqm or four and a half acres. However according to some reports the camp area shown today is only 2-3 acres thus making it even more ridiculous.

Thomas Dalton compares the claim as the equivalent of the population of Montana simply disappearing without a trace!

No wonder in the Sturdy-Colls film the chief rabbi of Poland wanted her to stop immediately if they should find a mass grave. After all the shock would be too much to take given that there is no mass grave there...
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Re: Impossible Treblinka claims = 10 X L.A. Coliseum capacit

Postby Dresden » 5 years 4 months ago (Tue May 13, 2014 9:17 am)

borjastick said:

"Steve you may well be right that Grossman's calculation was 18,000sqm or four and a half acres. However according to some reports the camp area shown today is only 2-3 acres thus making it even more ridiculous"

I wasn't really sure of the dimensions of the camp itself; I found one article that said it was a trapezoid roughly 400 meters by 600 meters, but you're right, if it was only 2-3 acres, then it makes it even more ridiculous.....if that's even possible!

Thanks! :D
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Re: Impossible Treblinka claims = 10 X L.A. Coliseum capacit

Postby Zulu » 5 years 4 months ago (Tue May 13, 2014 2:47 pm)

Steve F wrote:For a very rough comparison:

The "mass graves" of Treblinka, according to Vasili Grossman's wild imagination, were about 18,000 square meters all together.

The Coliseum is about 75,000 square meters; ten Coliseums would be about 750,000 square meters, or, about 42 times the size of the Treblinka "mass graves".

It would be like burying a horse in a shoe box!

A horse in a shoe box wouldn't require an "archaeologist" to find it.

What about the documentary traces of the combustible.?
In the various testimonies I read, there is no mention of the handling of a huge quantity of wood necessary to feed the pyres of thousands of corpses as well as the large manpower needed to discharge the combustible from the trains or trucks and to bring it to the pits.

The religious cremations performed in India are a concern under an ecological point of view because the large consumption of wood they require. To solve that issue, several systems are proposed by different "inventors". Their descriptions are interesting because they mention cremation data which are useful to our purpose.

1- An article published by CNN describes
[quote]Garg says the benefits are manifold: It takes up to two hours and 150-200 kilograms of wood to burn a body completely, while a traditional pyre takes six hours and burns 500-600 kilograms of wood. As a result, he says, the cost is reduced significantly and emissions are cut by up to 60%.
http://edition.cnn.com/2011/09/12/world ... index.html[quote]

According with this "inventor", the normal weight of wood needed to cremate a corpse is about 500 kg. The combustion's improvement implied by using that system would reduce the wood consumption in order that only 150 to 200 kg would be required.

2- Another source mentions 400 kg http://www.mokshda.org/

So, even by taking a low estimation of 200 kg per corpse and 850 000 bodies to cremate, the Sonderkommandos would have needed to handle about 170,000 tons of wood.
Where did that fantastic volume of material come from ? Any documentary trace of providers, requisitions, bills of lading, invoices etc??
Is the total disappearance of all those material traces possible?
To be noticed that Chil Rajchamn didn't mention the people who were supposedly in charge for handling that enormous quantity of wood while he listed in detail the manpower which allegedly performed the cremations. This very is strange because the people needed to carry out the wood's handling would have to transport at least 4 time more weight than the people in charge of handling corpses. Not so strange taking into account the alleged little space of 70 cm maximum available under the rails of the roasters for putting the combustible described as "dry twigs". Completely irrealistic description!

On the absurdity of the claims of Chil Rajchman and Yankel Wiernik (quoted also by Arad) about the supposed fantastic cremations at Treblinka
Cremation nonsense!
https://archive.org/details/CremationNonsense
Version with French subtitles
Les Crémations Absurdes de Treblinka
https://archive.org/details/CremationsAbsurdesVOstFR

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Re: Impossible Treblinka claims = 10 X L.A. Coliseum capacit

Postby Hannover » 5 years 4 months ago (Mon May 19, 2014 6:31 pm)

And as Sturdy-Colls' LIDAR images revealed, the claimed enormous mass graves for the fabled 900,000 are not there. Simple as that.
E. Hunt's "Treblinka Archaeology Hoax" Video / READY TO VIEW

The 'holocaust' storyline is one of the most easily debunked narratives ever contrived. That is why those who question it are arrested and persecuted. That is why violent racist Jewish supremacists demand that there be no open debate.

This is too easy.

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If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Re: Impossible Treblinka claims = 10 X L.A. Coliseum capacit

Postby Kingfisher » 5 years 3 months ago (Tue May 20, 2014 6:18 am)

Very good analysis of Sturdy Colls's "investigation" here: http://www.westernspring.co.uk/treblinka-forensic-examination-fails/

Treblinka – The Forensic Examination Fails
Published by Max Musson on December 2, 2013 | 34 Comments
By Max Musson:

This weekend my attention was caught by adverts for a repeat showing of Channel 5’s documentary, ‘Treblinka: Inside Hitler’s Secret Death Camp’, part of their ‘Genius and Genocide’, series featuring no less than six, 90 minute documentaries trawling once more over the alleged ‘facts’ and ‘diabolical nature’ of the Nazi Third Reich.

Publicity material for the documentary claimed that it would be, “… following a team of British archaeologists who have been granted unprecedented access to investigate and excavate Hitler’s most notorious death camp.”

It was declared that forensic archaeologist, Dr Caroline Sturdy Colls and her team, would, “carry out the first ever comprehensive forensic investigation of Treblinka”, and the publicity blurb went on, “Between 1942 and 1943, the Nazis murdered more than 800,000 people at Treblinka in north east Poland, brutally exploiting many more as slave labour. Today no visible traces of those atrocities remain. The Nazis dismantled the camp in 1943 in an attempt to conceal what had happened there.”

“This film follows Caroline and the team as they get to work at Treblinka, uncovering the location and remains of the camp and detailing its key structures, including the processing rooms, gas chambers and burial pits. Drawing on testimony from one of the last survivors of the camp and newly-discovered documentary sources, the programme provides a new, visceral and compelling narrative of one of the darkest chapters in human history.”

While I don’t usually concern myself with the pro’s and con’s of the Holocaust, this programme interested me for two reasons:

Firstly, because it rather admitted up front that hitherto, no physical evidence has been established as proof of the claimed exterminations of large numbers people at Treblinka during World War II; and

Secondly, because the programme claimed to comprehensively provide that missing proof.

For someone such as I, who is aware of the controversies that exist and the way in which the propagation of the traditional Holocaust narrative has been used to denigrate nationalists, I was interested that someone apparently well qualified in forensic investigation, had at last conducted a ‘comprehensive’ examination of the two sites forming the Treblinka concentration camp complex. Surely we would now get to the truth, one way or the other!

In the programme, Caroline Sturdy Colls introduces herself as a forensic archaeologist, stating, “I work with police forces investigating murder cases and cases of missing individuals who may be buried” and this creates the expectation that the investigation will be dispassionate and unbiased, because for someone such as Dr Sturdy Colls, the uncovering of grisly human remains must be an almost routine experience and her police work must have instilled in her the discipline to avoid jumping to conclusions prior to an examination of the evidence found.

In this respect however, we are quickly disappointed as Sturdy Colls declared her desire to find the evidence needed to fit a predetermined outcome.

As the narrator of the documentary explains, of the two sites forming the Treblinka complex, Treblinka 1 has traditionally been regarded simply as a slave labour camp, while Treblinka 2 is believed to have been the extermination camp, he states that Caroline has long believed that Treblinka 1 was also a place, “of large scale systematic murder”.

Caroline is then shown stating, “Just because Treblinka 1 was smaller and just because Treblinka 1 wasn’t branded as an extermination camp, that doesn’t make the crimes that happened there any better.

“It’s the part of the site that gets completely forgotten because everybody talks about the history of the death camp, and what I really want to show with my work is that actually, Treblinka was one large landscape that comprised of the death camp and the labour camp, and all these places, whatever form it took, the executions were all equally a brutal and equally horrific as each other.”

The investigation begins with aerial photography with special imaging that enables an image of the land surface to be generated with all trees and vegetation removed. The resultant image showed a number of depressions in an area ten minutes walk south of Treblinka 1 and Caroline decided to dig two exploratory ‘trenches’ at a couple of these sites.

During the digging the remains of an old leather shoe are found and Caroline immediately declared, “This is the shoe of someone who was buried in a mass grave”, despite the fact that a shoe could have been discarded in any number of ways and for any number of reasons.

Then a number of bone fragments were unearthed, some of which, although not all were obviously human, the most significant of which appeared to be an adult arm bone and the jaw-bone of a child, and immediately Caroline is heard exclaiming, “Seeing all this, I get so angry, its not just bones, it’s a person!

“What could they have possibly done to make the Nazis want to treat them this way?”

Without stopping to think that during World War II the front line would have passed across this area at least three times and that the people to whom those bone fragments belonged might have been killed by either side, Caroline assumed that the bones must have been those of concentration camp inmates murdered by the Nazis.

With just a small number of bone fragments discovered from possibly just two individuals, Caroline declared, “We have enough to prove that this is a mass grave!”

Furthermore, just to emphasise the ‘overwhelmingly’ distressing nature of these findings, we were treated to the sight of Caroline sobbing and being comforted by a male member of her team. It would seem that finding these few bone fragments was too much even for an experienced forensic archeologist – even one who one would suppose would have been hardened by all of the grisly police work she must have undertaken over the years.

It apparently did not cross Caroline’s mind that the bones may have resulted from a common murder, or from the murder of Polish people oppressed by the Communists after the war. No, she was certain they were the bones of people murdered by the Nazis, and she declared, “This whole landscape is part of Treblinka’s killing machine essentially, this is the area where Nazis came to hide their crimes that they perpetrated.”

The investigation then shifted further north to the site of Treblinka 2, the alleged extermination camp in which between 800,000 and 900,000 people are claimed to have died, despite the narrator of the programme admitting that, “The remains of the 900,000 people who died have never been found.”

Today there is a memorial covering most of the site of Treblinka 2, consisting of a large stone structure bearing the inscription, “Never again!” in several languages, and an assemblage of 17,000 smaller, roughly hewn standing stones set in concrete.

There is also an imitation ‘grill pit’, an imitation of one of the long pits that the Nazis are alleged to have used to burn the large number of corpses that had accumulated. It is a long rectangular pit filled with basalt, which is meant to symbolize the charred wood used to burn the bodies.

Caroline and her team stopped by the side of it and reaching down to examine the sandy bank to the pit Caroline picked up some tiny fragments barely millimeters across and declared, “These are fragments of human bone!”

There was obviously no time to waste on DNA analysis, Caroline could apparently tell for certain, just by rubbing it between her fingers.

Caroline then set about digging two ‘trenches’, which were more like 1.5 metre square holes, in the lawns set between the standing stones and after a couple of days digging the team found just a few fragments of hair combs and dentures and cheap jewelry in one hole and in the other, several pieces from terra cotta ceramic tiles.

The tiles each had a smooth glazed surface and on the other side a dimpled surface bearing the manufactures mark, which consisted of a capital ‘D’ next to a circle containing a six pointed star, which coincidentally looked rather like a Star of David.

Caroline immediately decided that these were tiles from the floor of a gas chamber and that they featured the Star of David motif in order to lure the Jews into a false sense of security.

“What immediately springs to mind when I see this”, she declared, “is that witnesses who were allowed in the gas chamber area, talked about the Star of David actually being on the outside of the gas chamber buildings to build up that illusion that people were going to somewhere that was safe.”

It didn’t occur to her to consider that the dimpled side of the tiles was almost certainly designed to form a surface for tile cement to bind to and that only the glazed side of the tiles would have been visible in whatever building they were used to form the floor surface.

It also didn’t occur to Caroline that Pavel Leleko, one of the survivors of the concentration camp, had earlier in the programme described how camp guards and their Ukrainian helpers would forcefully herd the Jews, naked and hysterical, into the gas chambers by hitting them with clubs and whips, and it would be doubtful therefore that the existence of a Star of David emblem on the external wall of the gas chamber would do much to alleviate their panic, let alone tiny Star of David motifs on the floor tiles inside.

As Caroline and her team dug deeper in the hope of finding more substantial and convincing evidence of a gas chamber, they realized that there was a one metre deep layer of quarried sand covering the site – sand containing fossilised sharks teeth.

Again Caroline jumped to the conclusion that the quarried sand had been put there by the Nazis in an attempt to cover up their misdeeds, ignoring completely the fact that after Treblinka was closed and the Germans demolished the concentration camp buildings, a farm complex was built on the site, until that too was demolished after the war to make way for the building of the memorial that exists there now.

It did not occur to Caroline consider whether the sand layer could have been put there by Polish workers who would have wanted to level the site for the memorial and who might have used sand to mix the concrete into which 17,000 standing stones are set. Instead, her team dug down until they had located some larger stones beneath the sand and then declared that they had identified the location of a gas chamber!

During the programme we were informed that the gas chambers at Treblinka were capable of killing as many as 5,000 people in twenty minutes, yet as the programme concluded, Caroline stated, “For the men within eight to ten minutes of arrival in Treblinka they would be dead and they would be killed in the gas chambers, and for the women, it was more like 15 minutes, because of the fact that they had to have their heads shaved before they actually took that walk into the gas chamber themselves”.

Neither Caroline nor the programme makers realised the contradictions in their statements, nor how ludicrously premature their assumptions were given that this was supposed to be a scientific investigation into Treblinka by a doctor of forensic archeology experienced in police work.

The publicity material for this programme stated “This film follows Caroline and the team as they get to work at Treblinka, uncovering the location and remains of the camp and detailing its key structures, including the processing rooms, gas chambers and burial pits. Drawing on testimony from one of the last survivors of the camp and newly-discovered documentary sources, the programme provides a new, visceral and compelling narrative of one of the darkest chapters in human history.”

In fact, all that was achieved is that they discovered a number of bone fragments in circumstances which don’t provide any clues as to who they belonged to nor how they came to be buried in the woods c. 300 yards from Treblinka 1, and in Treblinka 2, Caroline’s team merely discovered a few fragments of personal artifacts, half a dozen broken floor tiles and some large stones.

If this was going to be an investigation that would silence the tongues of so called ‘Holocaust deniers’, Caroline Sturdy Colls has fallen a long way short of the mark, and I have a feeling it will probably have the opposite effect and will instead re-ignite the debate. Certainly if the comments left by those who have viewed websites promoting the programme are anything to go by.

By Max Musson © 2013

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Re: Impossible Treblinka claims = 10 X L.A. Coliseum capacit

Postby borjastick » 5 years 3 months ago (Tue May 20, 2014 9:20 am)

Well he hit the nail on the head with this review, but for me the telling fact is that Channel Five is owned by Richard Desmond, or was up until last week when he sold it for about £400m, and Mr Desmond is a jew and as far as I am aware an active jew in the education and memory of the holocaust.

Ms Sturdy Colls has really shot herself in the foot and let the truth about Treblinka out of the bag, making it freely available and very sensible and obvious to anyone with a few brain cells.

As the reporter quoted in the narration “Between 1942 and 1943, the Nazis murdered more than 800,000 people at Treblinka in north east Poland,..." A forensic archeologist is bound and obligated to reveal the facts of any situation and not start from a position and then manipulate the investigation and audience towards a pre-set conclusion.

It's quite clear to me and I suspect many others that Treblinka was not the place where 800,000 people were murdered.
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Re: Impossible Treblinka claims = 10 X L.A. Coliseum capacit

Postby Hannover » 5 years 3 months ago (Tue May 20, 2014 10:10 am)

Kingfisher said:
Very good analysis of Sturdy Colls's "investigation" here: http://www.westernspring.co.uk/treblink ... ion-fails/
Nice find, thanks.
It's interesting to note that the total number of alleged, but never tested, human bones do not even comprise enough to make a single skeleton. Yet we're supposed to believe that ca 900,000 were murdered and buried there?
And why would the Germans leave human bones supposedly scattered about the surface? We are told that they tried to hide all of their alleged crimes.
The fact that at Treblinka, Jews deposited pieces of cremated remains of those that died natural deaths outside of Treblinka is damning.
But then this is the 'holocaust' storyline, where proof of allegations is never required and all manners of Jewish supremacist skullduggery are encouraged. The entire matter is simply laughable.
see:
E. Hunt's "Treblinka Archaeology Hoax" Video / READY TO VIEW

Remember, this many X 10.
Image

The 'holocaust' storyline is one of the most easily debunked narratives ever contrived. That is why those who question it are arrested and persecuted. That is why violent racist Jewish supremacists demand that there be no open debate.

The tide is turning.

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If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.


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Re: Impossible Treblinka claims = 10 X L.A. Coliseum capacit

Postby NZSRP » 5 years 3 months ago (Thu May 22, 2014 6:42 am)

Zulu wrote:So, even by taking a low estimation of 200 kg per corpse and 850 000 bodies to cremate, the Sonderkommandos would have needed to handle about 170,000 tons of wood.
Where did that fantastic volume of material come from ? Any documentary trace of providers, requisitions, bills of lading, invoices etc??
Is the total disappearance of all those material traces possible?
To be noticed that Chil Rajchamn didn't mention the people who were supposedly in charge for handling that enormous quantity of wood while he listed in detail the manpower which allegedly performed the cremations. This very is strange because the people needed to carry out the wood's handling would have to transport at least 4 time more weight than the people in charge of handling corpses. Not so strange taking into account the alleged little space of 70 cm maximum available under the rails of the roasters for putting the combustible described as "dry twigs". Completely irrealistic description!


I think I read somewhere that they used to put the women on the bottom because the women burn hotter and therefore would burn the men better.

Problem solved.......

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Re: Impossible Treblinka claims = 10 X L.A. Coliseum capacit

Postby Hannover » 5 years 3 months ago (Fri May 23, 2014 11:25 am)

NZSRP said:
I think I read somewhere that they used to put the women on the bottom because the women burn hotter and therefore would burn the men better.
Then there is the absurd lie about knowing who was being cremated by observing the color of smoke.
People gave off different Colored Smoke / said under oath
Hannover wrote:Here we have a case of 'survivor' delusions, yet this crank is no different from the others, he just had the misfortune of being cross examined in a court of law. So, see what happens when they're cross examined, read on.

Warning! Doubt this "eyewitness" and you'll go to jail in Europe, Canada, Australia.

- H.

excerpt:
He told of how he and other internees even thought they could tell whether fat or skinny people, Ukrainians or Poles, were being cremated by looking at the color of the smoke.

full story:
'Globe and Mail'
Toronto, January 12, 1985

Witness indecisive: Lawyer challenges crematoria theory
by Kirk Makin

ERNST Zundel's lawyer challenged the testimony of a Holocaust survivor yesterday, telling the man he couldn't have seen concentration camp chimneys belch smoke and flames from exterminated Jews because crematoria don't emit anything. "I suggest it is quite impossible for smoke to come from a crematoria from human beings," said Doug Christie, whose client is charged with spreading false news.
"What do you say about that, sir?" "Nothing," Arnold Friedman, prisoner number B14515, initially replied. "If you're talking of crematoria in Toronto and crematoria in Auschwitz, those are two different things. In Birkenau (part of Auschwitz complex), smoke came out of the chimney." "I put it to you that you don't really understand anything about crematoria, to say: 'Aha, that is a crematorium,' because that is quite wrong, sir," Mr. Christie said. Many observers in the packed courtroom were left shaking their heads or fidgeting uncomfortably as Mr. Friedman, 56, then agreed that perhaps Jews were not being burnt in the chimneyed buildings.

Over a two-day span, Mr. Friedman has testified repeatedly to seeing thousands of boys herded toward the crematoria, and of seeing trainloads of people unloaded near the ominous buildings. He told of how he and other internees even thought they could tell whether fat or skinny people, Ukrainians or Poles, were being cremated by looking at the color of the smoke.

Mr. Friedman's sudden indecision in the face of Mr. Christie's forceful questioning touched off an almost-perceptible shockwave in the courtroom. "Couldn't there have been other explanations (for the smoke and flames)?" Mr. Christie asked, pressing home his advantage. "Yes, there could have," Mr. Friedman replied. "If I had listened to you at the time when I was listening to other people (in the camp), I might have listened to you. But at the time I listened to them."

The dramatic testimony took place at the trial of Ernst Zundel, who has pleaded not guilty to two charges of knowingly publishing false news which caused or was to cause damage to social and racial tolerance. In one of two articles forming the subject of the charges, the author maintains information on the Holocaust has been grossly exaggerated or faked. One of the Crown's tasks is to prove Mr. Zundel knew the articles were false.
So, why wasn't this liar charged with perjury?

The 'holocaust' storyline is one of the most easily debunked narratives ever contrived. That is why those who question it are arrested and persecuted. That is why violent racist Jewish supremacists demand that there be no open debate.

The tide is turning.

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If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Re: Impossible Treblinka claims = 10 X L.A. Coliseum capacit

Postby NZSRP » 5 years 3 months ago (Sat May 24, 2014 6:26 am)

It really is just amazing how people gobble up these stories as gospel truth and then look at those of us who can see the the logic is faulty as if we were mad men.

I had a brief conversation with my mother-in-law about how the Anne Frank diary was a fake......man, did the room turn icy!

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Re: Impossible Treblinka claims = 10 X L.A. Coliseum capacit

Postby Hannover » 5 years 3 months ago (Sat May 24, 2014 10:54 am)

NZSRP:
I had a brief conversation with my mother-in-law about how the Anne Frank diary was a fake......man, did the room turn icy!
She experienced what is called 'cognitive dissonance', when someone's beliefs don't match up with reality. That occurs via brazen repetition of a false narrative, aka: the Big Lie technique. Her problem, not yours.
Rather like a child, after years of conditioning, being told that there is no Santa Claus. That "icy" feeling to be sure.

The 'holocaust' storyline is one of the most easily debunked narratives ever contrived. That is why those who question it are arrested and persecuted. That is why violent racist Jewish supremacists demand that there be no open debate.

The tide is turning.

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.


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