Naked victims

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Alan1
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Naked victims

Postby Alan1 » 4 years 5 months ago (Tue Mar 31, 2015 11:05 am)

I searched to see if it was mentioned, but I couldn't find it.
I was wondering why in so many photographs the emaciated people were naked, both the dead and the alive.
Anyone a thought on this?
Thanks

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Hektor
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Re: Naked victims

Postby Hektor » 4 years 5 months ago (Tue Mar 31, 2015 11:35 am)

Alan1 wrote:I...
I was wondering why in so many photographs the emaciated people were naked, both the dead and the alive.
Anyone a thought on this? ...


I think there is several plausible reasons for this:
1.) The clothing has been removed to be burned
2) Other people took their clothing for themselves.

But there are actually other, more sinister, reasons possible as well. i.e.
3.) The emaciated corpses were actually German POW starved to death by the Allies, whose uniforms/clothing has been removed in order not to disclose their real origin. That may also explain why the corpses were on trailers. That they'd been moved there the previous night for a show casing to press, force marched civilians, Allied soldiers.

Here is what I am thinking of:
Image

Image

Image

Image

On some photos cloths can be seen, which looks like German uniforms/uniform material:
Image

Image

Also note that virtually all corpses seem to be males of military age (20-40).

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Re: Naked victims

Postby k0nsl » 4 years 5 months ago (Tue Mar 31, 2015 12:43 pm)

Hi,

I noticed several oddities from Hektor's fourth [specious?] photograph:

PICT059801_k0nsl.jpg
Bashed in skull, Swastika/Hakenkreuz, Smug smile and well-fed "survivor"...


I'm sorry for the bad quality of my hasty editing. The swastika/hakenkreuz is seen best when the image has been enlarged by about 200%.

Those are only a few "odd" things I noticed right off the bat when having a quick glance at it. I didn't inspect the other photographs.

Faithfully,
-k0nsl

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Re: Naked victims

Postby Hannover » 4 years 5 months ago (Tue Mar 31, 2015 1:42 pm)

Same pile of disease victims, different shots. Not a single autopsy revealed that anyone was gassed.

The US Civil War POW camp at Andsersonville was no doubt much worse.

Not sure about the nakedness. They were all given clothes upon entry. Maybe a contagion issue.
Perhaps staged for dramatic purposes.

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If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Re: Naked victims

Postby Dresden » 4 years 5 months ago (Tue Mar 31, 2015 2:14 pm)

Hektor said:

"Also note that virtually all corpses seem to be males of military age (20-40)"

I noticed that.

K0nsl said:

"Smug smile and well-fed "survivor"..."

The smug smile on both of the men with helmets tells me they are not looking at a cart load of Jews or Russian POWs; they are looking at a cart load of Germans.

It looks like they have military haircuts, not just shaven heads.
Maybe, just maybe, they believe what they are telling you about the 'holocaust', but maybe, just maybe, their contempt for your intelligence and your character is beyond anything you could ever have imagined. -- Bradley Smith

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Re: Naked victims

Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 4 years 5 months ago (Tue Mar 31, 2015 2:31 pm)

But Alan1 is probably just not talking about dead bodies. Take the Mogilev film: they are outside, walking and naked. In that film it's clearly propaganda, as I believe Hannover once pointed out on a thread the imposing Nazi soldier shadow on the brick wall in that film.

"Staged for dramatic purposes" as Hannover wrote in this thread. When people are thin, the most startling thing about them are their thin legs. That's what shocks people the most. So Psych Warfare made the most of this and actually had them get naked to show this, sometimes cut pantlegs off to show legs, or draping something over their waist to show as much as possible. The movie "Buchenwald. A Dumb Dumb portrayal of Evil" shows director Billy Wilder accidentally in the camera shot with someone who is naked except for a cloth around groin area, in order to reveal emaciated legs and torso. It could be that Wilder is the one who ordered that to be done.

You can't show genitals, and it would look weird to put them in shorts, so just cut pantlegs off, or drape cloth around waist. Or be naked from a side view, so it's not censored for nudity. Get someone bedridden, out of bed with aid of crutches for the film shot.

Also, the pile of bodies in the above images. That's Buchenwald. Psych Warfare no doubt put the pile together. The film Buchenwald shows a pile of bodies being made by allies at Buchenwald. World at War the 1973 documentary used that cart, panning across it, for a shocking part of one of the episodes. Hektor's assertion that it's being put together to show the Germans is correct.

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Re: Naked victims

Postby Hektor » 4 years 5 months ago (Tue Mar 31, 2015 4:03 pm)

k0nsl wrote:Hi,
I noticed several oddities from Hektor's fourth [specious?] photograph:
PICT059801_k0nsl.jpg

I'm sorry for the bad quality of my hasty editing. The swastika/hakenkreuz is seen best when the image has been enlarged by about 200%.

I enlarged it and indeed a smudged swastika became visible on the side of what appears to be the wooden floor of the trailer. Why would anybody do that?

As for the smirking, this is indeed an odd thing to do. As if they were thinking:"damn Nazi-Krauts, got what you deserved". But would the Americans indeed pose photos there with soldiers that are in the know about the origin of the corpses? If I was PWD I'd use soldiers that are in the dark about this, just to get maximum effect on the pictures.

k0nsl wrote:Those are only a few "odd" things I noticed right off the bat when having a quick glance at it. I didn't inspect the other photographs.
....

I'm sure you'd find more on the other pics as well. I'm especially interested in Wehrmacht uniform/ cloth from uniform parts on the pictures. I think some apparel does indeed look like that, but I may be mistaken.

Carto's Cutlass Supreme wrote:...
"Staged for dramatic purposes" as Hannover wrote in this thread. When people are thin, the most startling thing about them are their thin legs. That's what shocks people the most. So Psych Warfare made the most of this and actually had them get naked to show this, sometimes cut pantlegs off to show legs, or draping something over their waist to show as much as possible. The movie "Buchenwald. A Dumb Dumb portrayal of Evil" shows director Billy Wilder accidentally in the camera shot with someone who is naked except for a cloth around groin area, in order to reveal emaciated legs and torso. It could be that Wilder is the one who ordered that to be done.
....

Got the raw footage with Billy Wilder stepping in here:
https://archive.org/details/BillyWilder ... reDivision
Also, some close ups on the trailer.

As for the reactions by the German public, an articled was published in a Sociology journal on this:
https://archive.org/details/MorrisJanow ... Atrocities

They were engaged hook, line and sinker into how to manipulate the, especially German, public.

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Re: Naked victims

Postby Hannover » 4 years 5 months ago (Tue Mar 31, 2015 4:48 pm)

Hmmm. Indeed younger men and they all appear to be men, odd for a storyline where both genders were supposedly equally victimized.

Being dead soldiers also explains the nudity, those tell-tale uniforms just had to go. Note that below we have partially clad men on the ground before being completely stripped, the footwear has a military look about it.

Image

BTW, we do see one guy's private parts in a different photo, probably not used in Life magazine or The Mayberry Gazette.

The swastika is a bit of subliminal manipulation, of the type often seen in advertising.

Image

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Re: Naked victims

Postby Hektor » 4 years 5 months ago (Tue Mar 31, 2015 7:15 pm)

Hannover wrote:Hmmm. Indeed younger men and they all appear to be men, odd for a storyline where both genders were supposedly equally victimized.

Being dead soldiers also explains the nudity, those tell-tale uniforms just had to go. Note that below we have partially clad men on the ground before being completely stripped, the footwear has a military look about it.

Image

BTW, we do see one guy's private parts in a different photo, probably not used in Life magazine or The Mayberry Gazette.
Indeed that could be army socks, boots, clothing there. But this picture is a bit unclear, so it would be great finding one where this is clearer. My guess is that the corpses on the ground had been moved from the trailer to be undressed further. I'd expect them to be unclothed and put on the trailer on other pictures.

Hannover wrote:The swastika is a bit of subliminal manipulation, of the type often seen in advertising....

Could be a "joke" of one of the guys prepping the scene as well.

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Re: Naked victims

Postby Hektor » 4 years 5 months ago (Tue Mar 31, 2015 8:34 pm)

Addendum:
The picture must be taken out of that Billy WIlder movie I gave a link to above. It's right at the beginning of the movie reel.

There is a close up on the corpses as well. And one frame appears to film what is the corpses in front of the trailer. I can see a very large number on one of the arms, which looks like written with a marker onto the arm. Did Buchenwald prisoners even have number tattoos? Anyway all the tattooed numbers I've seen were far smaller then that one and not spread over the whole arm (for obvious economic reasons it must be like that anyway).

There is more too see like someone that looks like a German beaten to death, Billy Wilder trampling into the frame, emaciated prisoners, the shrunken heads, items that must have been stolen from the anatomy section of a university (I think Weimar had one, but to my knowledge without a medical faculty, there were enough others on the way though and Jena seems to have had a medical faculty at that time), etc.

Just looked further and they also show the dissertation of Dr. Erich Wagner: "Ein Beitrag zur Tätowierungsfrage" - which he did at Jena. And Jena University does have a faculty for criminological medicine, so that may explain where the anatomical sets may have come from (PWD stole them at the university).

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Re: Naked victims

Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 4 years 5 months ago (Tue Mar 31, 2015 11:07 pm)

It could be the living have no pants on because they were in an infirmary. In bed, and Psych Warfare is propping them up with crutches for photos.

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Re: Naked victims

Postby Hektor » 4 years 5 months ago (Thu Apr 02, 2015 8:54 pm)

Carto's Cutlass Supreme wrote:It could be the living have no pants on because they were in an infirmary. In bed, and Psych Warfare is propping them up with crutches for photos.

On some pictures that seems to be the case. And the psychological warfare division was definitely prepping things in the camps. In Buchenwald the first American to enter was from the Sykewar staff - Edward Tenenbaum.- He also wrote a preliminary report together with an Egon Fleck.

Another possibility is also that the Communist nationalized some clothing from prisoners they didn't like:
Image
https://archive.org/details/CommunistAt ... Buchenwald

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Re: Naked victims

Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 4 years 5 months ago (Thu Apr 02, 2015 10:48 pm)

Interesting. I'd never heard of that Robinson article before. The source doesn't give a date, but it was probably after Willis Carto bought the American Mercury.

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Re: Naked victims

Postby Hektor » 4 years 5 months ago (Fri Apr 03, 2015 7:54 am)

Carto's Cutlass Supreme wrote:Interesting. I'd never heard of that Robinson article before. The source doesn't give a date, but it was probably after Willis Carto bought the American Mercury.

Source is dated somewhere else as:
"See also: Donald B. Robinson, "Communist Atrocities at Buchenwald," American Mercury, October 1946, pp. 397-404"

I'm sure there are far more reports on the "liberated concentration camps" some may be already accessible others won't. Especially the internal reports will be of interest, since I expect them to be more realistic and less propagandistic.


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