Any true believer comments !

[ClaudiaRothenbach]

The best way to prevent Typhus is not to build hospitals for sick people. You have to intervene earlier. The SS took measures to prevent people from getting ill.

1. They desinfected luggage, clothes etc. with Zyclon B (this was the state of the art measure at that time)
2. They desinfected barracks and mortuaries
3. They built the "Sauna" for the inmates with showers
4. The hair of incoming people was cut off
5. They built crematories because of hygienic reasons. The groundwater level was to high for mass graves.
6. Later they used a microwave desinfection plant for desinfection of luggage and clothes. This was the first plant of this type developed for the concentration camp (the army still used Zyclon B)

The second best way to prevent Typhus are hospitals. And there was a hospital. Not four, but one big hospital (which produces the same result).

Lets go back to the beginning:

"Crematorium IV , by contrast with crematorium II, was designed after Himmler's second visit to Auschwitz in July 1942. Birkenau had become a site for mass murder. All pretense of civility and civilian rules had been shed. The heimat style of Auschwitz I was replaced by the functional vernacular of Birkenau. The architects no longer bothered to draw in autopsy rooms. The space was used for gas chambers." (Dwork & Van Pelt, between 320-21)

You find the answer to this paragraph here: http://vho.org/VffG/2003/3/Mattogno357-365.html
Carlo Mattogno: Die Leichenkeller der Krematorien von Birkenau
im Lichte der Dokumente

This is in German but will be published in English soon (The Revisionist).

Maybe the crema was designed after Himmlers visit. Himmler cared for the hygienic situation (see Mattogno). The alledged mass murder van Pelt is writing about is not proven - and there is a lot of counter evidence. The rest is assumption. Auschwitz I was built in 'heimat style' by the Austrians before the first world war. It was a kuk-barrack. Birkenau never was a barrack. The space was not used for gas chambers as Mattogno proves!

[Turpitz]

The Harlot of fiction 'Van-Pelt' and his poisonous side-kick 'Ravishing Debbie' Don't seem to elaborate on any of the practical aspects of supposedly gassing people. They just skim across the surface like furious little book-worms.

'In the plan, the north is the top of the page but, contrary to convention, the elevation shows the north and not the south facade. Therefore the incineration room, which in the plan is located to the right, is to the left in the elevation, and the gas chambers, which in the plan are located to the left, are to the right in the elevation. The functional arrangement is simple and straightforward. The entrance on the north side gives access to a corridor (left, on the drawing) that opens to two gas chambers equipped with stoves to preheat the room during winter. Between the vestibule and the incineration room is a large morgue, which in the winter was also used as an undressing room. The center of the incineration room is occupied by a double-four-muffle furnace connected to two chimneys. The section through the lower part of the building shows one of the two gas chambers, the chimney of the stove of the other gas chamber, and the corridor. The section through the higher part of the building shows the furnace room." (Dwork & Van Pelt, between 320-21)

What a pile of superficial humbug !

Didn't Van-Pelt call the plans 'A Map' at Irving's show trial ?

Birkenau had become a site for mass murder. The architects no longer bothered to draw in autopsy rooms. The space was used for gas chambers."

Strange considering this was supposed to be a step up on previous designs, that it had far fewer muffles than it's predecessors!


My god! Don't Van-Pelt and Debbie look ugly as sin ? They have the faces of liars. The pair of them look like two 'Trolls' that have just crawled out, from under a bridge somewhere.

Both of them have gorged themselves on the hate they inflict on others, whose lives they have ruined. They have become obese on the downfall and misfortune of their victims.

Couple of foul individuals, if I may say so.

[aemathisphd]

Are personal attacks on Robert Jan van Pelt's and Debórah Dwork's looks really necessary? In fact, are personal attacks really necessary at all? In fact, are they allowed? I'd suggest that if Turpitz may assail van Pelt and Dwork on their physical appearances, that I be allowed to point out that David Irving has bad teeth, and Mark Weber is now clearly balding.

a.m.

[Moderator]

Valid point.

Turpitz, clean it up a bit, let's not get carried away.

- Moderator

[Turpitz]

Well I expect Irving’s used to it by now! After all, the Zionist journaille use their media cudgel to personally attack people every second of every day, NEVER EVER giving them a chance to answer back of course. Just ask Rudolph.

If that doesn't work, they try to kill them. Just ask Zundel. If he still has the strength left to answer that is.

When the boots on the other foot though..........Oh! The wailing banshees.


Maybe you would care to give me a walkthrough of the physical/practical aspects of using this morgue to gas lots of Zionists?

I've always looked at things from a practical stand-point you see. And have never much cared for the whirly-gig paper chase; the industry tries to lure everyone into. The black-hole of conjecture you know!


You have the 'RE-DRAWN' architects drawings, including Plan, Elevation and two cross-sections taken from alternate gables, showing the foundations (Which I might add, are very strange) all the way up to the ridge line of a pitched roof (around 35 degrees). The roof has a very large overhanging eaves, this is true of the verge also. Complete with the heavily sparred roof space. All four stacks are visible, the Two for the muffles and the two for the stoves. Over the oven room and undressing room are ventilation shafts, seven in total, complete with heavily weathered copings. Running along the eaves of the lower part of the building are air vents, most likely louvered clay air-bricks. None are seen at floor level.


You also have all access to and from the structure, three double doors, the larger being on the oven room. Complete with all six pane, mullion and transom windows. All internal openings are shown, and what looks like all 'single doors' swinging 'out' from the rooms. Yet the two ignored rooms, the door swing is 'in'! The ceiling height according to Claudia is 2 Metres '6 foot seven inches' for the supposed gas chamber (incredibly low). The foul water drainage system is shown. And although most rooms served different purposes they all seem to have gravity fed floor drains, (including one of the two rooms Van-pelt couldn't find a purpose for, as he concocted his potpourri of lies, so casually ignored!) teeing into the main drain running parallel to the building. Three of these branches enter the main drain via inspection chambers, whilst two don't!

So just how do you go about physically gassing lots of Zionists in this lengthy erection?

[aemathisphd]

Turpitz, are you under some false impression that historians believe the majority of Jews killed were Zionists? The polar opposite would, in fact, be the standard view. Most Zionists were already in Palestine by 1941, when mass killing began in earnest. Those that weren't already there, e.g., Menachem Begin, got there soon enough -- Begin deserted from the Polish Army after being released from a Soviet jail following the June 22 invasion.

Tom Segev's book The Seventh Million offers a particularly post-Zionist and infinitely more accurate view of the Holocaust as viewed in the yishuv and by Zionists generally speaking. I highly suggest it as standard reading.

a.m.

[Hannover]

Mathis said:

Most Zionists were already in Palestine by 1941, when mass killing began in earnest. Those that weren't already there, e.g., Menachem Begin, got there soon enough -- Begin deserted from the Polish Army after being released from a Soviet jail following the June 22 invasion.

I see that Mathis is working under an assumption that heretofore he has not backed up. That being the 'mass killings' he believes in. I refer our readers to this thread:
Zyklon-B wire mesh insertion devices debunked
http://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?t=309

Perhaps Mathis would care to take another stab in a new thread?

Thanks, Hannover

[Turpitz]

Turpitz, are you under some false impression that historians believe the majority of Jews killed were Zionists?

No not at all. I purposely call them all Zionist's, just out of respect!

I highly suggest it as standard reading.

I only read suppressed publications, and I prefer them in brail, as I like to 'feel' the truth!


Stop changing the subject again, and tell us how people were 'GASSED' in this rotten edifice.

Pelty and Deb's haven't told me anything, their explanations might satisfy the curiosity of a mentally deficient infant. But I yearn for a more detailed explaination, with all the finer details elaborated on.


There seems to be no rainwater system (gutters, downpipes) on this building !?

[Turpitz]

Another thing. Where is the specification sheet for this building ?

You seem to have the 'RE-DRAWN' Plans, Yet the specification sheet, that goes into the finer details of the buildings fixtures and use, and should always be kept and viewed alongside the drawings is missing!

Why is it that the Industry only ever has 'RE-DRAWN' 'bit's' of things?

Why could they find the drawings, but the all important Specification sheet has mysteriously wandered off ?

[Sailor]

Van Pelt shows on page 325 of his Auschwitz book a cross-section of morgue 1, Krema II, (similar to

http://www.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/camps/aus ... ection.jpg. The Nizkor site is down at the moment) and says:

(Image added by Moderator2)
(I got the wrong Leichenkeller. Sorry. This is the correct one: Leichenkeller 1, showing the vent ducts. fge)

"The conversion of this morgue into a gas chamber was facilitated by the double ventilation system located where the wall touches the ceiling and in the wall itself"

The triangular ducts shown in the top of the morgue are the fresh air intake ducts, the rectangular ducts at the bottom sides are the exhaust ducts.

In order to add these ducts after the construction completion would require practically to rebuild the complete morgue. And with the high groundwater, not an easy and cheap task.

I would like to see some documentation for this, a change order. And I don't understand what a "double ventilation system" is. I worked for 40 years as an engineer but never heard about such a thing.

I have some doubts whether van Pelt is really an architect.

fge

[ClaudiaRothenbach]

van Pelt is no architect.

He is professor of history of architecture. This is comparable with history of art. That means he never learned civil engineering neither construction or something like that. In Germany we call these types of study courses "housewifes courses" (attendees excluded).

This may explain some of his statements.

[Turpitz]

The triangular ducts shown in the top of the morgue are the fresh air intake ducts, the rectangular ducts at the bottom sides are the exhaust ducts.

I looked at these and they do not seem mechanical. How do you open and close them ?

They just look like ordinary clay air bricks to me, built into the walls. I can also see no ducting or pipework on the plans. It just looks like basic pressure ventilation. Is there supposed to be any fans ?

Why do you suggest intake at the 'top' and exhaust at the 'bottom' ?

And I don't understand what a "double ventilation system" is. I worked for 40 years as an engineer but never heard about such a thing.

Neither have I. The only thing I can think of, is that Krema II has ducts running along the eaves, and also has ducts running along the building near floor level. So he calls it double.

Where as Krema IV is concerned, as it only has ducts running along the eaves, Pelty would no doubt call this 'Single ventilation system'.

[Sailor]

The ventilation ducts and their functions are shown in the Rudolf Report
http://www.vho.org/GB/Books/trr/5.html#5.4.1.
In this drawing:

Caption:
Fig. 27 (bottom): Cross-section of morgue 1 (alleged 'gas chamber') of crematoria II and III (mirror symmetrical) in Auschwitz II/Birkenau camp.[180]
1. Ventilation outlet
2. Ventilation inlet
3. soil

See also: Pressac "Die Krematorien von Auschwitz":
Plate 13: Plan g-g: Dachboden des Krematorriums und Verteilung der Geblase mit der jeweiligen Motorleistung (Plan g-g: Attic of the crematorium and location of the blowers with the corresponding power output)

And Plate 14: Schnitt a-a: (nicht angegeben): Aufriß des Krematoriums. Schnittstelle: Lüftung des B-Raums (später Gaskammer). ( Section a-a (not detailed); section of the crematorium. Location of section: Ventilation of the B-room (later gas chamber).


Van Pelt shows in his book "The Case for Auschwitz" on page 194 a sketch of the view of the interior of the alleged gas chamber, morgue 1. He indicated a rather large number of the duct openings for the intake and discharge ducts, also the drainage openings.
How these various openings are operated, opened and closed during the gassings and ventilation procedures, van Pelt does not tell us, nor does any of the "eye witnesses", perpetrators or survivors.
The louvered ventilation openings in disinfestation buildings are operated, closed and opened, from the outside.

Neither have I. The only thing I can think of, is that Krema II has ducts running along the eaves, and also has ducts running along the building near floor level. So he calls it double.

The situation is actually much more "hilarious":
There are two blowers, one for the intake and one for the exhaust. Each one has a capacity of 4,800 m3/h.
Pressac added both together to come to 9.600 m3/h, which of course is ridiculous. It is like saying: "I have $1000 coming in and $1000 going out, therefore I have $2000".
Van Pelt may have taken the information from Pressac and called it a "double ventilation system".

fge

[code yellow]

To aemathisphd: I don't think you understand what Turpitz is saying. His problem with Zionists is that they and their cohorts are the prime perpetraitors of the multibillion dollar international holocaust industry: the most succesful extortion racket built on lurid accusations and camp side spooky stories ever! Take the holocaust memorial museum for instance. It is equal to an amusement park scarey house, complete with faked photos and props of the trade.

[code yellow]

To the avid believers of gas chambers: Of all the desperate theories to combat revisionist findings, there are certain FACTS you have to admit. One is that on top of the gas chamber stories, there are a huge amounts of other fabrications that are quite obvious, as well as the fact that a good number of these fabrications are still being promoted for monetery interests.

If the whole thing was so true to begin with,then why add on all those other lies? If it was all true, then I doubt there would be any need to add the other goodies. It took me years to grapple with this decision. But I have finaly come to the conclusion that in fact the gas chambers are nothing more than a clever myth (well,maybe not so clever at that).