Guess who thinks Hitler didn't want to kill the Jews / Netanyahu that's who

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Hektor
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Re: Guess who thinks Hitler didn't want to kill the Jews / Netanyahu that's who

Postby Hektor » 4 years 1 month ago (Tue Oct 27, 2015 2:00 pm)

neugierig wrote:Hermod, sorry, but I don’t exactly know what you are getting at. Of course Germans were appalled when shown the body piles, they knew however that it was no evidence of intentionally wrong doing, i.e., mass murder. But that is all the Allies had.

Still, and that is why this IfZ article is revealing, in spite of all the original efforts, Germans did not feel responsible, therefore the beat had to go on. The Frankfurt Auschwitz trial, followed by this Eichmann show, were all steps on the way. And now, success, finally, the new Germans, as a whole, are convinced, save for a few exceptions.
....

I find that statement somewhat problematic. Some certainly smelled a rat and that evidence was misrepresented to serve Allied propaganda goals. Others may have been more gullible in that regard and bought into the story. I can't say what the ratio between the two was initially. The text I cited hints at that, but I'm sensing that there may have been another text that I read in this regards, which reflects the level of believe in atrocity propaganda among Germans in the 1940s.

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Re: Guess who thinks Hitler didn't want to kill the Jews / Netanyahu that's who

Postby neugierig » 4 years 1 month ago (Tue Oct 27, 2015 7:28 pm)

Hektor, no doubt some bought into it, but the efforts by the western allies to have Germans accept responsibility, collectively, failed miserably, the article makes this quite clear.
http://www.ifz-muenchen.de/heftarchiv/1 ... berlin.pdf

The author, Brewster S. Chamberlin, in closing observes that this film, Death Mills, should perhaps have been shown later, rather than when it was. The reaction might have been different with time passing, in other words, after more lies had been told.

That Germans as a whole did not accept what was alleged at that time reflects in the publications up to the 1970s. The Germans no doubt were appalled when shown the body piles, but as mentioned, the majority knew why they died.

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Re: Guess who thinks Hitler didn't want to kill the Jews / Netanyahu that's who

Postby hermod » 4 years 1 month ago (Wed Oct 28, 2015 4:29 am)

neugierig wrote:Hermod, sorry, but I don’t exactly know what you are getting at. Of course Germans were appalled when shown the body piles, they knew however that it was no evidence of intentionally wrong doing, i.e., mass murder. But that is all the Allies had.


I'm not as sure as you are that the Germans of that time knew typhus body piles were no evidence of intentionally wrong doing/mass murder. The use of such pics by the Allied denazification forces would have been useless and even ridiculous if that had been the case. And most Germans wouldn't have moved from "Hitler was right" to "Hitler was wrong" and "Hitler went too far" in so little time if they had realized that they had been shown mere pics of epidemics.
"But, however the world pretends to divide itself, there are ony two divisions in the world to-day - human beings and Germans. – Rudyard Kipling, The Morning Post (London), June 22, 1915

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Re: Guess who thinks Hitler didn't want to kill the Jews / Netanyahu that's who

Postby Turpitz » 4 years 1 day ago (Wed Dec 09, 2015 11:17 am)

The communist from Stasi - Soviet East Germany, Merkel.


This vile creature has just been proclaimed Time 'Person of the Year'. That will be for flooding Germany with immigrants I shouldn't wonder. It can't be denied, Jewry certainly takes care of its confederates.

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Re: Guess who thinks Hitler didn't want to kill the Jews / Netanyahu that's who

Postby Hektor » 4 years 1 day ago (Wed Dec 09, 2015 4:13 pm)

Turpitz wrote:
The communist from Stasi - Soviet East Germany, Merkel.


This vile creature has just been proclaimed Time 'Person of the Year'. That will be for flooding Germany with immigrants I shouldn't wonder. It can't be denied, Jewry certainly takes care of its confederates.


That infusion is being slowed down at the moment it seems. Maybe also due to winter. But I'm convinced that'll get speed up once it's getting warmer again. At the moment they try to sedate the public with some law and order rhetoric., but they've deceived the German public so many times and in so many ways that this magic isn't going to work on the long run. They may control most of (subsidized) civil society, politics, media etc. but the more the situation gets absurd, the more people will listen to those that point out that the emperor is naked.

Funny enough they use the Auschwitz-club more sparsely then in the past. although most debates with lefties will end exactly there. Do they realize that the power of the myth is fading away? This may also a chance for Revisionists, if we play the cards right.

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Re: Guess who thinks Hitler didn't want to kill the Jews / Netanyahu that's who

Postby NLH » 4 years 1 day ago (Wed Dec 09, 2015 4:57 pm)

Does it?

"Details of the meeting between al-Husseini and Hitler are sketchy. The Nazis released a grainy propaganda video showing the mufti making a Nazi salute before a warm handshake. The official record from the meeting says Hitler pledged "the annihilation of Jewry living in Arab space."


Source: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/wires/ap/art ... caust.html

And will Netanyahu be imprisoned for his foul Holocaust denial? ;)

Hektor wrote:
Steve F wrote:There is already a thread on this topic here:

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=9864

Just Noticed that.....Should it be merged?

Tomt wrote:So I wonder if his wik page is going to change to read "Benjamin Netanyahu is a holocaust denier and is prime minister of Israel."


Ah, that may be an idea... I see they debate this on the talk page right now.


The conversation on the Wiki talk page is hilarious. I recommend you read it.
https://ewikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Benjam ... ust_Denial
"Believe me, I came into Auschwitz in a much worse condition than I actually left it."
- Kitty Hart-Moxon, Jewish Holocaust Survivor.

June 1998 testimony, USC Shoah Foundation, Visual History Archive.
Part 2 - YouTube - 1:21:42

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Re: Guess who thinks Hitler didn't want to kill the Jews / Netanyahu that's who

Postby Hektor » 4 years 15 hours ago (Thu Dec 10, 2015 4:09 am)

hermod wrote:...I'm not as sure as you are that the Germans of that time knew typhus body piles were no evidence of intentionally wrong doing/mass murder. The use of such pics by the Allied denazification forces would have been useless and even ridiculous if that had been the case. And most Germans wouldn't have moved from "Hitler was right" to "Hitler was wrong" and "Hitler went too far" in so little time if they had realized that they had been shown mere pics of epidemics.

I think he means the class of Germans that could think a bit further the just believing what is show on face value. But even, if you realize that starvation+diseases is the probable cause of death, there remains a suspicion of the possibility of other bad things that may have been done by "some Nazis". Also consider the total disillusionment Germans must have felt being vanquished after a six year war with millions of dead, raped, starving homeless. It's a climate of desperation most of us can not really imagine. Then there was Allied control of the media licensing this to a variety of collaborators, being "Anti-Nazi" was a requirement for doing so. Those that really weren't would make that shoe fit by even going further then their colleagues.

To understand institutionalized Holocaust believe, you need to understand the big deal of social psychology on how public opinion and cultural hegemony works. Partially this works analogue to how religious cults utilizing thought reform do work. When I was first finding out how they operate, I thought by myself:"My god, this is exactly how they did the mind changing with the Holocaust and Reeducation". Holocaust being the collective shaming device for Germans, but also for the rest of the White Western world.

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Re: Guess who thinks Hitler didn't want to kill the Jews / Netanyahu that's who

Postby hermod » 3 years 10 months ago (Thu Jan 28, 2016 10:38 am)

Additional material about that...

Image
http://s25.postimg.org/tvxhd600v/Holoca ... estimo.jpg

Netanyahu’s fairytale about Hitler and the mufti is the last thing we need

Tom Segev


Wednesday 21 October 2015 20.47 BST


For many years historians have tried without success to determine when and how Adolf Hitler reached the decision to exterminate Europe’s Jews. Among the many mysteries accompanying the history of the second world war this is one of the most intriguing.

But now Binyamin Netanyahu, the Israeli prime minister, has found the answer. Speaking last night at the opening of the World Zionist Congress in Jerusalem, Netanyahu stated that it was actually a Palestinian, the grand mufti of Jerusalem, who gave Hitler the idea.

The mufti Haj Amin al-Husseini was appointed by the British in 1921. The title recognised his position as the major religious and political authority among the Palestinian Arabs. In accordance with the principle of “my enemy’s enemy is my ally”, the mufti sought support from Nazi Germany and in return backed Hitler’s war, including the extermination of the Jews.

He initiated the formation of a predominantly Muslim unit of the Waffen SS in Bosnia. In November 1941 he was received by Hitler in Berlin. According to Netanyahu, “Hitler didn’t want to exterminate the Jews at the time; he wanted to expel the Jews. But Husseini protested to Hitler that “they’ll all come here” – in other words, to Palestine. “So what should I do with them?” Hitler asked, according to Netanyahu. The mufti replied: “Burn them.” Netanyahu did not describe Hitler’s response, but one can imagine that it was something like: “Wow – how come I never thought of that?”

All Israeli governments have used the Holocaust as a political argument. Every Arab leader since 1948 has been compared at least once to Hitler. All Arab countries have compared Israel to the Nazis. And the Arabs have always refused to acknowledge that the Holocaust is a central element of the Israeli identity. This is particularly unfortunate because unless one understands one’s enemy, one cannot make peace.

Netanyahu has used such rhetoric in his flamboyant speeches against the Iran nuclear agreement, particularly in the US Congress and the UN general assembly. The story of the mufti is also not new to him; apparently it appears in one of his books. It is based on the postwar contention of one of Adolf Eichmann’s aides, Dieter Wisliceny, who also described a conducted tour of Auschwitz that the mufti was supposedly given by Adolf Eichmann. But the exact dialogue between the mufti and Hitler that Netanyahu presented this week goes far beyond anything even he has claimed before.

In addition to meeting Hitler, Husseini sat down with Eichmann and sabotaged a plan to transfer Jewish children from eastern Europe to Palestine. He should have been brought to trial along with other war criminals. His conduct during the war remains a shameful chapter in Palestinian history.

But there is no solid evidence to suggest that he played any role in the decision to exterminate the Jews. For, as Bernard Lewis wrote in Semites and Anti-Semites, it “seems unlikely that the Nazis needed any such additional encouragement from outside”.

It is equally implausible that Husseini was given a guided tour of the Auschwitz gas chambers in operation. In fact, his meeting with Hitler, which has been established in both Arab and German records, did not go very well for the mufti, who sought a statement of support for the Palestinian national rights: a kind of German Balfour declaration for the Arabs. Hitler refused to sign such a document. Foolishly Husseini agreed to have his picture taken with Hitler, which has haunted the Palestinian cause ever since.

The mufti’s support for Nazi Germany demonstrated the evils of extremist nationalism. However, the Arabs were not the only ones who were seeking a deal with the Nazis. At the end of 1940 and again at the end of 1941, before the Holocaust reached its height in the extermination camps, a small Zionist terrorist organisation – Fighters for the Freedom of Israel, also known as the Stern Gang – made contact with Nazi representatives in Beirut, hoping for support for the struggle against the British. One of the Sternists, in a British jail at the time, was Yitzhak Shamir, a future Israeli prime minister.

Netanyahu’s fictitious dialogue between Husseini and Hitler has come at an extremely delicate moment, with a new wave of Palestinian terror once again raising fear and hatred in both Israel and the Palestinian territories. Involving the Holocaust once again can only make matters worse. This should be a moment for responsible leadership and restraining language. The last thing the present situation needs is a fairytale about Hitler and the mufti.

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfre ... -holocaust
"But, however the world pretends to divide itself, there are ony two divisions in the world to-day - human beings and Germans. – Rudyard Kipling, The Morning Post (London), June 22, 1915

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Re: Guess who thinks Hitler didn't want to kill the Jews / Netanyahu that's who

Postby Spect3r » 3 years 10 months ago (Wed Feb 03, 2016 9:02 am)

I laughed so hard when this came out i almost fall off my chair.
How desperate has him to be to come out and basically do a 180º turn in all they have been claiming for the past 70 years or so... is pure madness!!!
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