Belarus / another bogus mass grave claim

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Belarus / another bogus mass grave claim

Postby Hannover » 1 decade 6 years ago (Sat Aug 09, 2003 1:11 pm)

More of the same old bizarre nonsense in this article. Have a look and see my comments. Responses invited.

http://famulus.msnbc.com/FamulusIntl/re ... reg=EUROPE

Jewish leaders call for Belarus Holocaust memorial

MINSK, Aug. 8 — Jewish leaders in Belarus called on authorities on Friday to erect a memorial to hundreds who died in the Holocaust after their graves were destroyed by the construction and renovation of a soccer stadium.

The mass grave in the town of Grodno near the border with soon-to-be EU member Poland was uncovered when construction workers started renovating the 40-year-old stadium and found bones in the newly removed soil.
Jewish leaders said the desecration of the cemetery in Grodno, where Jews were killed by Nazis on Belarussian soil, was yet another sign of the government's lack of interest in remembering those who died and could spur growing anti-Semitism.
''When they started reconstructing the stadium, they took up a lot of soil and threw it away in a street. In spring, the soil subsided uncovering bones,'' Yakov Basin, head of a group which defends Jewish rights, told Reuters.
He said he believed the most Jewish groups could expect from the cash-strapped government was for the area where the bones were found to be cordoned off and signalled by a small memorial. The stadium was build 40 years ago and most of the cemetery was most likely all but ruined then, he added.
The government declined to comment on the situation.
''This kind of problem does not just happen in Grodno. The problem is that the authorities have little control over preserving such cemeteries,'' he said.
Belarus, a country of 10 million bordering an expanding European Union and Russia, has been criticised for failing to clamp down on what Jewish groups call premeditated attacks on Jews, cemeteries and memorials for Holocaust victims.
In May, police were forced to step up security at a memorial after vandals drew swastikas and anti-Semitic slogans on it.
Before World War Two, there were 400,000 Jews in Belarus but tens of thousands were killed by the Nazis and many more left to escape Soviet anti-Semitism. Now about 100,000 remain.


was stated:
Jewish leaders in Belarus called on authorities on Friday to erect a memorial to hundreds who died in the Holocaust after their graves were destroyed by the construction and renovation of a soccer stadium.

''When they started reconstructing the stadium, they took up a lot of soil and threw it away in a street. In spring, the soil subsided uncovering bones,'' Yakov Basin, head of a group which defends Jewish rights, told Reuters.

Erect a monument = pay someone a lot of money to build it and maintain it. Who gets this money? Any guesses?

What bones? Show us. How many bones? Two from the same body? Were the bones 'Jewish' bones? Were they human bones? Show us the forensics. They can't.

then was said:
''This kind of problem does not just happen in Grodno. The problem is that the authorities have little control over preserving such cemeteries,'' he said.


Ah yes, it then changes to being a "cemetery", not a "mass grave". As per usual they can't keep their story straight.

and then:
Belarus, a country of 10 million bordering an expanding European Union and Russia, has been criticised for failing to clamp down on what Jewish groups call premeditated attacks on Jews, cemeteries and memorials for Holocaust victims.
In May, police were forced to step up security at a memorial after vandals drew swastikas and anti-Semitic slogans on it.


Maybe the "clampdown" is not warranted, perhaps the basis for the "Jewish groups" assertions cannot be considered truthful.

Vandals drew swastikas and wrote "anti-semitic slogans"? I wonder who would benefit by having these "anti-semitic slogans" curiously appear?

Then there's another double talking contradiction/can't keep their stories straight howler as it states the police 'stepped up security', yet the police were previously accused of "failing to clamp down" .

more falsehoods, The Big Lie technique:
Before World War Two, there were 400,000 Jews in Belarus but tens of thousands were killed by the Nazis and many more left to escape Soviet anti-Semitism. Now about 100,000 remain.


"...tens of thousands"? Evidence please. Mass graves please. Forensics please.

The 'escape from anti-semitism' meant going to Israel for a free ride at US taxpayers expense. I suggest that this is where the "tens of thousands" of allegedly murdered Jews from Belarus ended up after the war.....where they are now fraudulently referred to as 'holocaust victims'. There is no evidence they were killed. Just saying they were killed doesn't make it true.

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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 6 years ago (Wed Aug 20, 2003 5:32 pm)

Now we're getting a spin job on the phoney 'holocaut mass grave', note this picture of ONE bone from who knows where, the caption reads:

'All human remains that were exposed will be reburied'

Image

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/3163735.stm

Belarus halts graves dig

Belarus has halted controversial renovation work on a football stadium built over an 18th-Century Jewish cemetery.
Local and international Jewish groups protested after builders dug up human remains and broken headstones during work on the stadium, in the western city of Grodno.

The stadium was built during the Soviet era on the site of 14,000 graves, some dating back several hundred years. Grodno was once a leading centre of Jewish culture and religion.

As well as halting the excavations, the authorities have agreed to change the building plans and rebury all the human remains exposed.

"This is the most important thing, because it means that nobody will be touching the Jewish remains anymore," said Yuri Dorn, president of the Jewish Religious Union of Belarus.

Mr Dorn signed an agreement to halt further work on the stadium's grounds in the capital, Minsk, with Grodno regional governor Vladimir Savchenko on Monday.

"We have tried to correct the situation. We are moving in the right direction," Mr Savchenko said.

The agreement also calls for the creation of memorial indicating that a Jewish cemetery is located on the site, and stipulates that any further work on and around the stadium requires the approval of the Jewish community, the Associated Press news agency reports.

International condemnation

A delegation of European Union ambassadors visited the cemetery and urged the authorities to call a halt to the work in July.

Twenty-two US congressmen sent a letter to the Belarusian President Alexander Lukashenko to get the excavations stopped, with New York State Senator Hillary Clinton also adding her name to the protests.

The cemetery holds the remnants of Grodno's Jewish 20,000-strong community, which was nearly wiped out during World War II, the union says.

Grodno was one of the first cities captured by Nazi Germany in the 1941 invasion of the Soviet Union.

Only 200 Jews are thought to have survived the occupation and many fled to Israel or the West following the 1991 Soviet collapse.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/e ... 163735.stm


There is no evidence that the alleged "20,000-strong community" of Jews was wiped out, I challenge anyone to bring evidence for such nonsense.

So where's the alleged mass grave as a result of the alleged Nazis 'holocau$t' that was originally claimed? Where's the massive remains? Why would there be headstones for an alleged mass grave?

Yep, the liars have been caight lying again. What was once claimed to be a 'holocaust' mass grave (none have ever been found that support the storyline) is now called a cemetery.

But hey, we do have a picture of one bone on some dirt.

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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 5 years ago (Fri May 07, 2004 8:48 pm)

Speaking of phoney 'mass graves'. This is a classic.

Yep, this is their 'mass grave'.
Image
Laughable.

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Postby trtsk » 1 decade 5 years ago (Fri May 07, 2004 10:25 pm)

Hannover that is a single photo. What did you want? For an online newspaper to run a photo spread?

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Postby trtsk » 1 decade 5 years ago (Fri May 07, 2004 10:26 pm)

By the way Hannover are you suggesting tha the BBC fakes its stories?

Tom

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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 5 years ago (Sat May 08, 2004 12:55 pm)

trtsk asks:
What did you want? For an online newspaper to run a photo spread?

If there had been any such 'mass grave' excavation that's exactly what we'd have seen. Imagine the propaganda value if this story was true as alleged. The 'holocau$t' Industry' would milk it for all they could. If true, we'd be seeing in depth coverage in academic journals and popular magazines; but zippo, nada, zilch.

trtsk asks:
By the way Hannover are you suggesting tha the BBC fakes its stories?

It's difficult to know the true origin of the story, we have two articles, one from Reuters, one from the BBC. Was it their reporters in the field, or was it a locally spun story that they picked up on? Doesn't really matter, there is no 'mass grave' as is alleged, otherwise we'd be seeing it ad nauseum.

And, the standard story states that all the alleged mass graves were exhumed and the contents burned to eliminate the alleged evidence....oops. It sure is hard keeping all those lies straight.


Image
There it is, a photo of 1 bone lying on some dirt and we don't even have a means to verify it, much less this laughable claim of a 'mass grave'... it's pathetic. The story is a lie and Revisionists have exposed it as such.

Not ONE mass grave has ever been shown to match the claims of the 'holocau$t' as alleged ... not ONE.

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hmm

Postby sykokinesis » 1 decade 5 years ago (Sat May 08, 2004 6:57 pm)

Well if all they show is one foto of one bone than one is to asume that it is false. If they uncovered a mass grave, there would be tons of fotos with plenty of wide angle shots to document this historical find.

The New York Times faked stories... Why should the BBC be any different. How many lies and half-truths go by unseen is the scary part.
I'm not saying they lied, only that you are putting your trust into something that you can't control.

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Postby Haldan » 1 decade 5 years ago (Sun May 09, 2004 5:17 am)

trtsk wrote:By the way Hannover are you suggesting tha the BBC fakes its stories?

Tom


Media isn't reliable anymore
<?php if ($Holocaust == false ) {deny_repeatedly(); } else { investigate(); } ?>
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Postby J William » 1 decade 5 years ago (Sun May 09, 2004 6:46 am)

The bones in question appear to have come from a 1700s cemetary. Just what does a bone between 2 and 3 hundred years old have to do with the 1940s invasion of USSR ? It would appear that everything relates back to the big H and every chance to exploit the big H is taken.

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Postby trtsk » 1 decade 5 years ago (Sun May 09, 2004 8:43 am)

Would you mind telling us how you can tell the age of a bone by looking at a photograph?

Tom

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Postby Goethe » 1 decade 5 years ago (Sun May 09, 2004 11:41 am)

I'm surprised the articles don't describe Grodno as a 'vibrant' Jewish community, the typical expression used to bestow a sense of superority. They do say "Grodno was once a leading centre of Jewish culture and religion", which they seem to say about all cities these days.
I think Mr. William meant 18th century since that is the age of the cemetery mentioned in the article. Let's all say it together: 'No bones, no Holocaust'.

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Postby sykokinesis » 1 decade 5 years ago (Sun May 09, 2004 12:19 pm)

The stadium was built during the Soviet era on the site of 14,000 graves, some dating back several hundred years. Grodno was once a leading centre of Jewish culture and religion.

What date was it built?
The cemetery holds the remnants of Grodno's Jewish 20,000-strong community, which was nearly wiped out during World War II, the union says.

The entire story is confused. And I don't want to start a new thread about the process of stadium construction & renovation.
The stadium must not be that old, why wasn't there information released when the stadium was first constructed. Meaning why didn't the Jewish community say something when ground was first broken?
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Postby J William » 1 decade 5 years ago (Mon May 10, 2004 5:20 am)

trtsk wrote:Would you mind telling us how you can tell the age of a bone by looking at a photograph?

Tom


If the bone is from an 18th century cemetery (1700 to 1799) as the article infers, it is a logical conclusion provided the actual bone really came from that site. Of course it may really be a religous relic from one of the destroyed Catholic churches or just a bone thown in to make a point. The point I am making is that the bone is represented as coming from an organized cemetery and there is no proof that it was a mass grave site for murdered Jews or anyone else. One can go to any cemetery and, if allowed, dig up bones which proves nothing more than that there are bones there. The same type question posed above could and should be asked concerning the myraids of photos labeled as showing the big "H".

"Belarus has halted controversial renovation work on a football stadium built over an 18th-Century Jewish cemetery.
Local and international Jewish groups protested after builders dug up human remains and broken headstones during work on the stadium, in the western city of Grodno."

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Postby sykokinesis » 1 decade 5 years ago (Mon May 10, 2004 1:29 pm)

"Belarus has halted controversial renovation work on a football stadium built over an 18th-Century Jewish cemetery.
Local and international Jewish groups protested after builders dug up human remains and broken headstones during work on the stadium, in the western city of Grodno."


In my opinion no stadium should have been built over a cemetary in the first place. But since they did, I think that it's only logical that they move the bone to an area that already has a memorial in place.
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