David Cole On Natzweiler Gassings

[borjastick]

There has been quite a stir here concerning the recent comments by David Cole that he has proof of gassings at Natzweiler camp in France. He says he has a solid paperwork trail to support this.

I found this thread of comments on Axis Forum on the Natzweiler gassings, and included in the thread was a post by Sergey Romanov in 2004. It is well worth a read. This section is from a piece by David Cole on the matter after his meeting and conversation with Faurisson.

I always had questions about the Struthof "gas chamber," but after
seeing it in person and meeting with Jean-Claude Pressac (who does a
very good job in his book _The Struthof Album_ published by the
Klarsfeld Foundation) and seeing many of the original documents, I can
now speak with more certainty; this gas chamber may very well have
been used homicidally. It might turn out that Struthof is the only
Nazi camp to ever have had a homicidal gas chamber...but in any event,
the matter is far from closed, as Faurisson would have us believe. The
Struthof episode also stresses the need to continually question and
revise (if necessary) the work of other revisionists, no matter how
well-respected they might be.

He does not offer any further back up or indeed proof at this point so I wonder what is the nature of his current claimed paper work proof.

http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic. ... 5&start=15

However what strikes me is that this gassing of 87 people, if it happened, was a one off for a specific and macabre desire. It does seem as odd that once again we have a different process of gassing claimed. In this case it was 'salts' added to water that was then introduced into the gas chamber. If the believers are to be believed, hundreds of thousands of people had been gassed in the AR camps by diesel and or gasoline, depending on which version you read and of course by zyklon B in Auschwitz. If the wholesale killing of Jews was happening as claimed, a system with strict guidelines would have been put in place with operational protocols and written instructions as to the building and use of them. Yet none exists and they appear to have to make it up as they went, it's a type of osmosis process.

As for the recent ridiculing of David Cole here I find it wrong on every level. I may well start a different thread in support of David Cole.

[Kingfisher]

Can we establish first of all where and what the gas chamber we are talking about is? I don't know Natzweiler or anything about the alleged gas chamber on public display but in his book David Cole says the gassings took place in an SS anti-gas training room, whereas Vincent Reynouard has published a video rubbishing the Natzweiler gassings in a shower room

[hermod]

I would also like to have more information about the paperwork trail mentioned by Cole. I read that in Pressac's work a while ago. I remember there were intriguing words such as "Gas raum" (gas room). What's your opinion about that? Were those documents fake? Were they referring to a room used to experiment combat gases? Or was it something else?

[hermod]

However what strikes me is that this gassing of 87 people, if it happened, was a one off for a specific and macabre desire. It does seem as odd that once again we have a different process of gassing claimed. In this case it was 'salts' added to water that was then introduced into the gas chamber. If the believers are to be believed, hundreds of thousands of people had been gassed in the AR camps by diesel and or gasoline, depending on which version you read and of course by zyklon B in Auschwitz. If the wholesale killing of Jews was happening as claimed, a system with strict guidelines would have been put in place with operational protocols and written instructions as to the building and use of them. Yet none exists and they appear to have to make it up as they went, it's a type of osmosis process.

A chemical nonsense. If you want to gas people with cyanide salts (let's say KCN), you need a strong acid, not water.

KCN dissociates into ions K+ and CN- in solution. Then, if you want to produce HCN (toxic gas), you need ions H+ (reaction: H+ + CN- ---> HCN). But water (H2O) is a very poor provider of ions H+. One molecule of H2O out of 55 million dissociates into ions H+ and OH-. That's the reason why U.S. jails used to execute prisoners in gas chambers by pouring sulfuric acid (H2SO4), a very strong acid (i.e. en excellent provider of ions H+), on KCN pellets (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gas_chambe ... en_cyanide). Pouring water on cyanide salts to produce toxic gas is ridiculous. I'd readily enter a gas chamber using such a moronic technique as a murder weapon.

And Kramer couldn't have misidentified sulfuric acid and believed it was water. Anybody having already worked with strong acids knows that such liquids can be manipulated only with great caution. Without mentioning the peculiar pungent odor of sulfuric acid (the odor threshold of sulfuric acid in air is 1 milligram per cubic meter of air - http://www.atsdr.cdc.gov/phs/phs.asp?id=254&tid=47)...

[borjastick]

Can we establish first of all where and what the gas chamber we are talking about is? I don't know Natzweiler or anything about the alleged gas chamber on public display but in his book David Cole says the gassings took place in an SS anti-gas training room, whereas Vincent Reynouard has published a video rubbishing the Natzweiler gassings in a shower room

It all appears to be explained in the long thread, as in axis history forum, linked to my post.

[Werd]

That was indeed an interesting thread on axishistory. Consider this from Jurgen Graf's introduction of the new Mattogno book.

Thanks to his profound knowledge, acquired over more than two decades of research, Mattogno relentlessly dissects the elements of “proof”advanced by the authors of this anthology and unmasks these historians for what they really are: at best incompetent and naïve amateurs, at worst blatant impostors. The total bankruptcy of orthodox historiography cannot be made any more devastating than by comparing Neue Studien zu nationalsozialistischen
Massentötungen durch Giftgas with Mattogno’s reply. The Great Lie can only be maintained by brainwashing, censorship and repression – for the time being.

As stated above, this merciless judgment does not apply to the authors of the chapters on “euthanasia.” It may well be that what they say about this point does correspond more or less to the facts. Neither Mattogno nor I can assess this topic. We also have to exempt from this accusation the author of the chapter “The gas chamber in the Natzweiler concentration camp” (“Die Gaskammer im Konzentrationslager Natzweiler”). For me, who translated Mattogno’s book from Italian to German, the conclusion that a gassing was “probably” perpetrated in the Alsatian camp at Natzweiler was very surprising. In August of 1943, 86 Jews were sent to the Natzweiler camp from Auschwitz and were subsequently murdered. The documents do not permit any doubt in this regard. The criminal deed was initiated by an SS professor who wanted to prepare a collection of Jewish skeletons. Without providing us with any clear documentary evidence, Mattogno believes that the murders were probably carried out by means of phosgene gas. By allowing such a hypothesis, the Italian researcher risks being rebuked by other revisionist historians. The fact that he accepts this risk proves that he does spread neither black nor white propaganda but is trying to do serious science.

Both the followers and the opponents of revisionism will wonder: if Mattogno, the leading revisionist historian, suspects that the gassing action at Natzweiler did in fact take place, could it not be that gassing actions also took place at other locations? The only answer which we, as revisionists, are able to provide in this respect is: if we are presented with proof or at least with circumstantial evidence pointing to such gassings, we shall take them into serious account. Passing over counter-arguments with complete silence is something the other side may practice. They have decades of experience in this field.

16 August 2011

I haven't yet made it to that chapter in Mattogno's book, but I will soon.

[Valfrum]

The paragraph in Republican Party Animal describing the one-off gassing of less than 100 internees at a remote French location stuck with me over the years. In the book, Cole is sworn to secrecy or something similar for being shown the gas room, making it sound like the dead canary of the holocaust. But, in the above AxisH forum thread someone describes a road sign pointing to "Gas Chamber" :

#19 Post by steve248 » 11 Jul 2004, 10:08
By coincidence I actually drove past the Natzweiler site in the Alsace just a month ago - roadworks and nowhere to stop due to hundreds of other cars taking every possible place. However there is an official road sign pointing to the "Gas Chamber" site.

The "Gas Chamber" site appears to be some distance from the main Camp site, maybe up to a kilometer.