The problems with the nuremberg trial

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The problems with the nuremberg trial

Postby Brainscan2015 » 4 years 7 months ago (Sun Mar 29, 2015 1:44 pm)

Can anyone please delineate exactly what were some issues with the nuremberg trial, as it is obvious it was a show trial meant to promote the holohoax. But what are some details regarding this trial. I know they used forged evidence, that the Defense refused to cross examine witnesses, that the confessions were extracted by weak "torture". But what else and what specifically was questionable about the procedures in the trial.

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Re: The problems with the nuremberg trial

Postby Hannover » 4 years 7 months ago (Sun Mar 29, 2015 3:37 pm)

Brainscan2015 wrote:Can anyone please delineate exactly what were some issues with the nuremberg trial, as it is obvious it was a show trial meant to promote the holohoax. But what are some details regarding this trial. I know they used forged evidence, that the Defense refused to cross examine witnesses, that the confessions were extracted by weak "torture". But what else and what specifically was questionable about the procedures in the trial.

Hello Brainscan & welcome.

"Weak" torture? Not really.
Here are some examples from one of my earlier posts, others will certainly join in.
Also see recommended link at bottom of quotes.

- Hannover

good read here:
How the British Obtained the Confessions of Rudolf Höss'
http://codoh.com/library/document/1968/

U.S. Congressional Representative, Lawrence H. Smith of Wisconsin said:

" The Nuremberg Trials are so repugnant to the Anglo-Saxon principles of justice that we must forever be ashamed of that page in our history."

Congressional Record, appendix, v.95, sec.14, 6/15/49


U.S. Supreme Court Justice William O. Douglas:

"I thought at the time and still think that the Nuremberg trials were unprincipled. Law was created ex post facto to suit the passion and clamor of the time."

H. K. Thompson and H. Strutz, eds., Dönitz at Nuremberg: A Reappraisal (IHR, 1983), p. 196.


"The London Cage was used partly as a torture centre, inside which large numbers of German officers and soldiers were subjected to systematic ill-treatment. In total 3,573 men passed through the Cage, and more than 1,000 were persuaded to give statements about war crimes"

https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2005/nov ... dwar.world


The prisoner [former Auschwitz commandant, Hoess] was torn from the top bunk, the pyjamas ripped from his body. He was then dragged naked to one of the slaughter tables, where it seemed to [Bernard] Clarke the blows and screams were endless. Eventually, the Medical Officer urged the Captain: 'Call them off, unless you want to take back a corpse.'"(12)
- 12.R. Butler, Legions of Death, Hamlyn, (London, 1983), p.237


The admission of Bernard Clarke was corroborated by Mr. Ken Jones in 'The Wrexham Leader', October 17, 1986.
Mr. Jones was then a private with the Fifth Royal Horse Artillery stationed at Heid in Schleswig-Holstein.

"They brought him to us when he refused to cooperate over questioning about his activites during the war. He came in the winter of 1945/6 and was put in a small jail cell in the barracks," recalls Mr. Jones. Two other soldiers were detailed with Mr. Jones to join Hoess in his cell to help break him down for interrogation."

"We sat in the cell with him, night and day, armed with axe handles. Our job was to prod him every time he fell asleep to help break down his resistance," said Mr. Jones.

When Hoess was taken out for exercise, he was made to wear only jeans and a thin cotton shirt in the bitter cold. After three days and nights without sleep, Hoess finally broke down and made a full confession to the authorities.

recommended:
http://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=6653

The 'holocaust' storyline is one of the most easily debunked narratives ever contrived. That is why those who question it are arrested and persecuted. That is why violent, racist, & privileged Jewish supremacists demand censorship. What sort of truth is it that crushes the freedom to seek the truth? Truth needs no protection from scrutiny.
The tide is turning.
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Re: The problems with the nuremberg trial

Postby Dresden » 4 years 7 months ago (Sun Mar 29, 2015 4:17 pm)

Besides torture, the "defendants" families were threatened with being shipped off to Siberia if the accused didn't cooperate.
-----------------------------------------------------

Nuremberg Trial Proceedings Vol. 1
Charter of the International Military Tribunal:

Article 19.

The Tribunal shall not be bound by technical rules of evidence. It shall adopt and apply to the greatest possible extent expeditious and nontechnical procedure, and shall admit any evidence which it deems to be of probative value.

Article 21.

The Tribunal shall not require proof of facts of common knowledge but shall take judicial notice thereof.
Maybe, just maybe, they believe what they are telling you about the 'holocaust', but maybe, just maybe, their contempt for your intelligence and your character is beyond anything you could ever have imagined. -- Bradley Smith

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Re: The problems with the nuremberg trial

Postby Reviso » 4 years 7 months ago (Mon Mar 30, 2015 4:55 am)

An interesting thread about the role of Zionists in the prosecution :
hermod @ U.S. prosecutor at Nuremberg Robert Jackson was a Zionist
R.

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Re: The problems with the nuremberg trial

Postby Hektor » 4 years 7 months ago (Mon Mar 30, 2015 6:29 am)

Steve F wrote:;;;
Nuremberg Trial Proceedings Vol. 1
Charter of the International Military Tribunal:

Article 19.
The Tribunal shall not be bound by technical rules of evidence. It shall adopt and apply to the greatest possible extent expeditious and nontechnical procedure, and shall admit any evidence which it deems to be of probative value.

Article 21.
The Tribunal shall not require proof of facts of common knowledge but shall take judicial notice thereof.


And Robert Jackson brings it straight to the point:
As a military tribunal, this Tribunal is a continuation of the war effort of the Allied nations. As an International Tribunal, it is not bound by the procedural and substantive refinements of our respective judicial or constitutional systems, nor will its rulings introduce precedents into any country's internal system of civil justice.
http://avalon.law.yale.edu/imt/07-26-46.asp

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Re: The problems with the nuremberg trial

Postby Brainscan2015 » 4 years 7 months ago (Fri Apr 10, 2015 5:56 pm)

Thanks.

Do you know if the "evidence" of eletricity at belzec, air sucking machines at treblinka, and chlorine at sobibor were used at nuremberg to convict the germans?

Also the "evidence" of gassings in the german camps like dachau?

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Re: The problems with the nuremberg trial

Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 4 years 7 months ago (Sat Apr 11, 2015 2:10 am)

The American prosecutor, Thomas J. Dodd, presented a shrunken head. You can see that in the video Buchenwald A Dumb Dumb Portrayal of Evil.

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Re: The problems with the nuremberg trial

Postby hermod » 4 years 7 months ago (Sun Apr 12, 2015 11:59 am)

Brainscan2015 wrote:Thanks.

Do you know if the "evidence" of eletricity at belzec, air sucking machines at treblinka, and chlorine at sobibor were used at nuremberg to convict the germans?

Also the "evidence" of gassings in the german camps like dachau?


Perhaps you'll also be interested in the Germans who 'confessed' there were gas chambers at Buchenwald (where no historian still claims there were homicidal gas chambers).

Subject:— THIES, Richard
Born:— 27/8/25.

Ref No. 3/3/Pf.47770.
2nd April 1948.

(To) Legal Divison,
65 HQ CCG(HE),
BAOR 15.

(From) OC,
No.3 R and I S,
c/o No.3 Civilian Internment Camp,
408 HQ CCG(HE),
BAOR 23.

1. Please find attached a copy and translation of statements made by the a/n who is due to be transferred to this camp from the Middle East on 23rd April 1948.

2. According to the deposition by the a/n taken on 29th Aug'47 at 380 PW Camp,MEF, he admits:—

(a) to having taken part in the in the [sic] mass execution of Polish subjects in the vicinity of WARSAW in April 1943 as a member of the firing squad.

(b) whilst having been employed as a guard with the Guard Bn BUCHENWALD to have escorted to,and forced into, the Gas Chambers, victims of unknown nationality at BUCHENWALD Concentration Camp between 17th March and 26Th April 1944.

[...]

[TNA PRO WO 309/376, unfortunately the "translation of statements made by" Richard Thies are not found in this particular file.]


DECLARANT: H FRICKE



DECLARATION


Appears the prisoner of war Heinrich ROHDE and says, to have been acknowledged with the subject of the interrogation and exhorted to deposit the truth.

Personal: I am named Heinrich ROHDE, born the 21.7.09 at TRITTAU/Schleswig, single, professional farm labourer. I have not belonged to the Party or one of her organisations.

Facts: I was 12 years in a concentration camp, and over 7 years in the concentration camp EMSLAND and 5 years in the concentration camp BUCHENWALD.

[...]

CONCENTRATION CAMP BUCHENWALD

3. In October 1940 I was sent over to the concentration camp of BUCHENWALD. For political prisoners in B. 1940 - 1945 about 3000 have died an unnatural death. This only regards Reich Germans.

I was sent to BUCHENWALD with 72 arrested. We were led before the pol. section and had already at the beginning by blows and kicks in the abdomen 10 dead. We remaining 62 came in the penal company. There we had to execute most hard labour in quarries and such, and even 15 hours a day. The feeding was very bad. We marched out with work detachments to the strength of 250 men each morning. There - from generally only 120 - 140 came back in the evening. All the others lost their lives either through shooting, mischievous work accidents, or by being driven into electrical tensioned wire. After I had endured the first 3 months I came in Block 4. Here I was 14 days. After these 14 days, a so named, monthly action was accomplished. In the manege (riding school) 500 Russian troopers, officers and commisioners [sic] were executed by neckshot.

These actions were accomplished once a month, mostly 300 - 1000 prisoners were shot. The bodies of the shot were then brought by work detachments (arrestants) in the crematory and burned there.

1 - 3 times monthly 200 - 1000 Jews German and foreigners with their families were sent in.

These were then separated, men, women, children and led in the "Bathroom", there they were killed by gas pouring through the showers.

[...]

Although this translation is undated, the original Vernehmung is dated 7.7.1945.


SUBJECT:- War Crimes.

14 Aug 45.

[unreadable due to treasury tag hole in the paper] Branch (WCS),
[unreadable due to treasury tag hole in the paper] Army Group,

1. Herewith are three statements made by persons under interrogation at RHEINBERG and WICKRATHBERG PW cages together with translations.

2. The witnesses appear to have first hand knowledge of concentration camps including BUCHENWALD and of a camp for extermination of Jews at KULMHOF, WARTHBRÜCKEN, POLAND. There is also an account of war crimes committed in HOLLAND.

'A' Branch.
ISERLOHN.
Tel Ext : 103.
GF/AW______
SDS/APO

[signature illegible]
Lieutenant-General,
Commander, 1 Corps District.


COPY
S.S. Senior Troop Leader Gunter Herman Frich
(Ober Schar Fuhrer)

Appears the Waffen SS Oberschar Fuhrer Gunter - Herman FRICH and declares :—

The 1.12.1925 I was born in Hamburg. I visited the primary school at Hamburg and following this for half a year the superior agricultural proffional school in Arnsberg. I was then in the agricultural exploitation of my father and now and then active as a milker by other farmers.

My wish was always to come to the Waffen SS and even in Hamburg - Fulsbüttel.

By the enlistment an officer of the SS asked me if I would take the SS oath, if I could see blood and if I was hard enough to deal with prisoners of concentration camps. I affirmated [sic] this question. I was further pointed out that itwas [sic] an honour to do service in the SS.

[...]

In Nijmegen I was wounded and came back to the general hospital Bruchühl, District Herford near Osnabruck. After my recovery I reported voluntary again for guard duties in concentration camps and came to the concentration camp Buchenwald.

The concentration camp was the worst camp which I have seen. The treatment and accommodation were unworthy of mankind. The prisoners housed in earth-holes and stonehouses as well as in the ovens [sic] of the in the [sic] camp Buchenwald standing limestone factory. The feeding was conform with the labour performance of the prisoners.

One Sunday morning I heard the crying of a woman's voice. I was called by the SS Obersturmfuhrer GUSTAV WILBRETT and became the order to hit the woman, it was the one who had tus cried before — with a whip to which were attached 6 leaden balls and drive her in a dark room. I then drove this woman as had been ordered to me in this room and went back. I was acknowledged that this woman had to undress herself there and had to stay three days and three nights naked in the room.

For the reason of this punishment the Sturmfuhrer declared, the woman had begged him for bread while she had become nothing more to eat for already three days. Only from bread crumbs which she searched under the tables on which had eat the SS men had she appeased her hunger in some measure. SS Obersturmfuhrer GUSTAV WILBRETT lives in Magdeburg, Lubeckerstr 376. He was because of his cruelty often threatened by the prisoners. He also said to me that he was one of the first who had to leave his life after the war.

In the camp at Buchenwald I also saw chairs on whose seats nails were left in and thereto used to punish prisoners whilst they had to lay themselves on these chairs.

Once I also became a mission to disarm, respectively dig out T mines and other explosives in the Schleswiget Heide with 6 prisoners. The prisoners were fetched from their earth-holes, they then became their eyes blindfolded and were so brought to a ready standing lorry, then they were driven in the moor. So the prisoners did not catch sight how in reality the camp looked like.

Before the execution of this order i was told once more I should take care because mine blowing was dangerous work. By the execution of the blowing two prisoners of my detachment then lost their lives.

it was known to me that there was a combustion room in the camp. I cannot give details of this because only officers were allowed to come in the vicinity of this building.

There was also a gas chamber, Leader of this installation was the SS Sturmfuhrer HERBERT EMIL. For this man it was a pleasure to drive daily 40 to 50 prisoners through this gas chamber. The named Sturmfuhrer stood supplied with a gas mask at the entrance of the gas chamber, and drove the prisoners inside.

He became as a special favour good food and higher pay.

[...]

Image


http://rodoh.info/forum/viewtopic.php?f ... 99d298456e

Image
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article ... buchenwald

Image
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article ... buchenwald
"But, however the world pretends to divide itself, there are ony two divisions in the world to-day - human beings and Germans. – Rudyard Kipling, The Morning Post (London), June 22, 1915

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Re: The problems with the nuremberg trial

Postby Mulegino1 » 4 years 7 months ago (Sun Apr 12, 2015 1:57 pm)

Brainscan2015 wrote:Can anyone please delineate exactly what were some issues with the nuremberg trial, as it is obvious it was a show trial meant to promote the holohoax. But what are some details regarding this trial. I know they used forged evidence, that the Defense refused to cross examine witnesses, that the confessions were extracted by weak "torture". But what else and what specifically was questionable about the procedures in the trial.


Also, keep in mind that the IMT rules of evidence gave "judicial notice" to any and all exhibits presented by the prosecution, i.e., that anything submitted by the prosecution was accepted as true prima facie and could not be disputed by the defense.

This meant that the Tribunal had to accept the Soviet account of the Katyn massacres, even though the Allies knew beyond a reasonable doubt that the murders were committed by the Soviet NKVD, not the Germans. This alone, even without the myriad absurdities such as steam chambers and pedal driven brain bashing machines, is enough to discredit the entire Tribunal as a show trial and farce.

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Re: The problems with the nuremberg trial

Postby Brainscan2015 » 4 years 7 months ago (Sun Apr 12, 2015 2:47 pm)

Thanks. Do you know if the "evidence" of electricitiy, steam chambers, etc. were actually used to convict the germans?

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Re: The problems with the nuremberg trial

Postby Mulegino1 » 4 years 7 months ago (Sun Apr 12, 2015 3:17 pm)

Brainscan2015 wrote:Thanks. Do you know if the "evidence" of electricitiy, steam chambers, etc. were actually used to convict the germans?


I don't think that any evidence was really used to convict the Germans; in my view, the Tribunal had already decided whom it would convict and hang before it began, precisely those whom it considered as supporters of the NSDAP regime. It absolved those with international connections like Von Papen and Schact.

I have no idea why Rudolf Hess was convicted of anything. (Perhaps it was because he knew the truth about the origins of the war and that the British were not willing to negotiate peace under any circumstances, even those involving favorable terms for the British.)

The Tribunal was a circus masquerading as a solemn judicial proceeding.

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Re: The problems with the nuremberg trial

Postby Brainscan2015 » 4 years 7 months ago (Sun Apr 12, 2015 3:24 pm)

Yeah I believe it is obvious that was the case. they wanted to make an example of germany for the western "zionist" cause.

But I'm still curious if it was at least presented at nuremberg.

I found this link regarding the subject:

http://exposing-the-holocaust-hoax-arch ... mberg.html

Absurd "Evidence" Presented at Nuremberg - The "Steam and Electrocution Death Chambers" at Treblinka




Steam chambers for delousing clothing at Birkenau

The Holohoaxers couldn't get their Treblinka "death camp" tale straight at first, with conflicting "eyewitness" stories of "extermination" of jews by gas and steam chambers. The steam chamber fairy tale has been abandoned, and now jewry has settled on gas with bug spray.


source: The Library of Congress, Volume 5, DOCUMENT 3311-PS, from the International Military Tribunal at Nurnberg, Germany.

The following is a a “Collection of Documentary Evidence and Guide Materials Prepared by the American and British Prosecuting Staffs for Presentation before the International Military Tribunal at Nurnberg, Germany.” It is recorded in an eight-volume, 12-book series, known as "Nazi Conspiracy and Aggression", also known as “The Red Series."

From Volume 5, DOCUMENT 3311-PS, we find the following on the "steam chambers" and "electrocution chambers" allegedly at Treblinka:


COPY OF DOCUMENT 3311-PS

CHARGE No. 6

[Seal of Main Commission for the Investigation of German Crimes in Poland]

In accordance with article 6 of the Charter the Poish Government indicts Dr. Hans Frank, Governor General of Poland, of the following crime:

The German authorities acting under the authority of Governor General Dr. Hans Frank established in March 1942 the extermina­tion-camp at Treblinka, intended for mass killing of Jews by suffocating them in steam-filled chambers.

Particulars of the alleged Crime

In 1940 the German authorities established in the village 01 Treblinka. near Malkinia close to the railway-line Warsaw - Bialy­stok, a concentration camp for Poles who refused to deliver contingents of agricultural products ordered by the German administrative authorities. In November 1941, the District Governor of Warsaw, Dr. FISCHER, proclaimed this camp as a general concentration camp for the whole district of Warsaw and ordered all Poles to be deported there who some way or other contravened against the orders or prohibitions of the German authorities. Later on this camp was named "Treblinka A".

In March 1942, the Germans began to erect another camp "Treblinka B", /in the neighbourhood of "Treblinka A"/, intended to become a place of torment for Jews.

The erection of this camp was closely connected with the Ger­man plans aiming at a complete destruction of the Jewish popula­tion in Poland which necessitated the creation of a machinery by means of which the Polish Jews could be killed in large numbers. Late in April 1942, the erection of the first three chambers was finished in which these general massacres were to be performed by means of steam. Somewhat later the erection of the real "death­building" was finished which contains ten death chambers. It was opened for wholesale murders early in autumn 1942.

It may be mentioned here that there were several phases in the development of the persecution of the Jews in Poland. During the first period until October 1940, the Germans were aiming only at the moral degradation and complete pauperisation of the Jews by all kinds of restrictions of their rights, by the confiscation of their property etc., but later on they turned to their gradual an­nihilation and destruction as a nation. This change of policy is apparent in their treatment of the ghettos, first they had only to isolate the Jews from the Aryans but later on they were the ghettos, the very means of the physical annihilation of the Jews.

Healthier and stronger Jews were deported for forced labor while those who remained in the Ghettos were decimated by starvation and epidemics. As these methods did not produce the desired results more drastic measures were adopted. Wholesale massacres were organized in the Ghettos and, finally, a complete annihilation of the ghettos was decided upon.

The Jews had simply ceased to exist. Special camps were established for this purpose where the destruction of human lives was carried on by mechanized means. The best known of these death camps are those of Treblinka, Belzec and Sobiber in the Lublin district. In these camps the Jews were put to death in their thousands by hitherto unknown, new methods, gas and steam chambers as well as electric current employed on a large scale. The Victims were recruited chiefly from the General Government, and particularly from the following districts: Warsaw, Radom, Lublin, Krakow and Lwow, but Jews from outside the General Government were also sent there, particularly from. the Bialystok district where the Ghettos were maintained for a long time and where in the summer months of 1943 about 10,000 Jews were rounded up and transported to Treblinka for extermination.

The main part of the "work" was done in summer and autumn 1942. Winter 1942 and the year 1943 were used for "mopping up operations", i. e. for the extermination of those who managed to dodge the main round-up and, of those younger Jews who were employed in war industry. To indulge in their lust for destruction the Germans did not hesitate to put to death even those younger Jews although their man-power was badly needed and their loss - as admitted by the Germans themselves - was a serious handicap for the war effort.

The Camp B of Treblinka is situated in hilly, wooded country It covered an area of about 5.000 ha (18 sq. miles) and was fenced off by hedges and barbed wire. It is bordered in the north by a young forest, in the west by a railway embankment while low hills shut it off from the East and South. There are several obser­vation posts in the camp for the camp guard (Lagerschutz) as well as searchlights used for securing the camp during the hours of darkness. A side track leads from the main railway track on to a loading platform adjoining a large open place fenced off by barbed wire. where several thousands persons can be accom­modated at the same time. To the north stands a large barrack and in the south-western corner an observation post. The place to the south of the barbed wire fence was used for sorting out pieces of clothes of the victims which were fit for further use (Lumpen­sortierungsplatz). Further to the south is the place of execution and a mass grave. A gate opens from the place to a road leading to the buildings and one of them is divided by a narrow corridor into two parts and measures approx. 40 yards by 25 yards. On each side of the corridor are situated five chambers whose height is about 6 and a half feet. There are no windows. The doors can be shut hermetically.

The second building consists of three chambers and a boiler­room. The steam generated in the boilers is led by means of pipes to the chambers. There are terracota floors which become very slippery when wet. Along the southern wall of the building runs a long platform where the bodies of the victims were piled up after execution. A well is situated near the boiler-room.

Behind this building and separated from the rest of the camp by barbed wire stands a barrack and a kitchen destined for the grave diggers. On both sides of these buildings are situated observation posts. As the executions grew in numbers, mass graves were dug out by motor driven machines and not by hand and shovel as in the beginning.

The camp was guarded by Germans of the SS-detachments and by Ukrainians. The officer to whom this guard was subordinated was the SS-Capt. SAUER. This garrison (Lagerschutz) performed also duties of executioners, while menial services had to be performed by the inmates of the camps themselves, so e.g. the unload­ing of the trucks, stripping of the victims and sorting out of their clothes and shoes (Lumpensortierung), the emptying of the death chambers and the burying of the bodies. When a new transport arrived some of the Jews were picked out to do this work so long till they broke down morally under the impression of this organized and mechanized mass murder. Then they had to dig their own graves and take up their position at them, whereupon they were shot one by one by SAUER personally. Their last duty before dying was to push the body of the preceding victim into its own grave. A new party was then chosen to continue their work in the camp. The sadism of SAUER in enjoying the shooting personally sounds incredible, but his guilt has been proven beyond any doubt.

The average number of Jews dealt with at the camp in summer 1942 was about two railway transports daily, but there were days of much higher efficiency. From autumn 1942 this number was falling.

After unloading in the siding all victims were assembled in one place where men were separated from women and children. In the first days of the existence of the camp the victims were made to believe that after a short stay in the camp, necessary for bathing and disinfection, they would be sent farther east, for work. Explanations of this sort were given by SS-Men who assisted at the unloading of the transports and further explanations could be read in notices stuck up on the walls of the barracks. But later, when more transports had to be dealt with, the Germans dropped all pretences and only tried to accelerate the procedure.

All victims had to strip of their clothes and shoes, which were collected afterwards, whereupon all victims, women and children first, were driven into the death chambers. Those too slow or too weak to move quickly were driven on by rifle butts, by whipping and kicking, often by SAUER himself. Many slipped and fell, the next victims pressed forward and stumbled over them. Small children were simply thrown inside. After being filled up to capacity the chambers were hermetically closed and steam was let in. In a few minutes all was over. Jewish menial workers had to remove the bodies from the platform and to bury them in mass graves. By and by, as new transports arrived, the cemetery grew extending in eastern direction.

From reports received may be assumed that several hundred thousands of Jews have been exterminated in Treblinka. Exact figures are impossible to obtain as the Germans did not bother to keep any records concerning the number of Jews deported to this camp and killed there. It will be even impossible to establish some correct figures because as early as spring 1943 the Germans began to exhume the bodies and to burn them so as to destroy all evidence of the crimes perpetrated. These cremations continue until summer 1943, when the victims were able to start a mutiny and to kill some of the guards enabling thus several hundred Jews to escape from the camp.

The above description of the mass murders in Treblinka gives only a faint idea of the horrors which prevailed in the camp. It is practically impossible to imagine the sufferings of the victims in the camp and to grasp the full extent of the atrocities. For the victims transported to the camp in cattle trucks and exposed for several days to the most cruel sufferings of body and soul, death in the steam chambers must have almost come as a welcome relief. Their only crime consisted in the fact of belonging to a race condemned by Hitler to death.

The responsibility of Dr. Hans FRANK for the setting up of the camp at Treblinka and for the mass killings described above is inherent to his official position as Governor General of Poland.

The camp could not be set up without either his direct order or, at least, his approval, and the numbers of people killed there, clearly indicate, that these atrocities were elements of a systematic policy of extermination. All those connected with the "liquidation" of ghettos and of the Jews themselves took their orders from the Governor General.

[Seal of Main Commission for the Investigation of German Crimes in Poland]

CERTIFICATE

This will certify that the document entitled "Charge No 6. Camp of Treblinka", concerning the extermination of Jews in this camp, is hereby officially submitted by the Polish Government to the International Military Tribunal by the undersigned under the pro­visions set forth in Article 21 of the Charter.

/S/ Dr. Cyprian
Dr. Tadeusz Cyprian
Polish Deputy Representative on the United
Nations War Crimes Commission in London

[Seal of Main Commission for the Investigation of German Crimes in Poland]

Nurnberg, the 5th December, 1945

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Re: The problems with the nuremberg trial

Postby Mulegino1 » 4 years 7 months ago (Sun Apr 12, 2015 3:41 pm)

Brainscan2015 wrote:Yeah I believe it is obvious that was the case. they wanted to make an example of germany for the western "zionist" cause.

But I'm still curious if it was at least presented at nuremberg.

I found this link regarding the subject:

http://exposing-the-holocaust-hoax-arch ... mberg.html

Absurd "Evidence" Presented at Nuremberg - The "Steam and Electrocution Death Chambers" at Treblinka




Steam chambers for delousing clothing at Birkenau

The Holohoaxers couldn't get their Treblinka "death camp" tale straight at first, with conflicting "eyewitness" stories of "extermination" of jews by gas and steam chambers. The steam chamber fairy tale has been abandoned, and now jewry has settled on gas with bug spray.


source: The Library of Congress, Volume 5, DOCUMENT 3311-PS, from the International Military Tribunal at Nurnberg, Germany.

The following is a a “Collection of Documentary Evidence and Guide Materials Prepared by the American and British Prosecuting Staffs for Presentation before the International Military Tribunal at Nurnberg, Germany.” It is recorded in an eight-volume, 12-book series, known as "Nazi Conspiracy and Aggression", also known as “The Red Series."

From Volume 5, DOCUMENT 3311-PS, we find the following on the "steam chambers" and "electrocution chambers" allegedly at Treblinka:


COPY OF DOCUMENT 3311-PS

CHARGE No. 6

[Seal of Main Commission for the Investigation of German Crimes in Poland]

In accordance with article 6 of the Charter the Poish Government indicts Dr. Hans Frank, Governor General of Poland, of the following crime:

The German authorities acting under the authority of Governor General Dr. Hans Frank established in March 1942 the extermina­tion-camp at Treblinka, intended for mass killing of Jews by suffocating them in steam-filled chambers.

Particulars of the alleged Crime

In 1940 the German authorities established in the village 01 Treblinka. near Malkinia close to the railway-line Warsaw - Bialy­stok, a concentration camp for Poles who refused to deliver contingents of agricultural products ordered by the German administrative authorities. In November 1941, the District Governor of Warsaw, Dr. FISCHER, proclaimed this camp as a general concentration camp for the whole district of Warsaw and ordered all Poles to be deported there who some way or other contravened against the orders or prohibitions of the German authorities. Later on this camp was named "Treblinka A".

In March 1942, the Germans began to erect another camp "Treblinka B", /in the neighbourhood of "Treblinka A"/, intended to become a place of torment for Jews.

The erection of this camp was closely connected with the Ger­man plans aiming at a complete destruction of the Jewish popula­tion in Poland which necessitated the creation of a machinery by means of which the Polish Jews could be killed in large numbers. Late in April 1942, the erection of the first three chambers was finished in which these general massacres were to be performed by means of steam. Somewhat later the erection of the real "death­building" was finished which contains ten death chambers. It was opened for wholesale murders early in autumn 1942.

It may be mentioned here that there were several phases in the development of the persecution of the Jews in Poland. During the first period until October 1940, the Germans were aiming only at the moral degradation and complete pauperisation of the Jews by all kinds of restrictions of their rights, by the confiscation of their property etc., but later on they turned to their gradual an­nihilation and destruction as a nation. This change of policy is apparent in their treatment of the ghettos, first they had only to isolate the Jews from the Aryans but later on they were the ghettos, the very means of the physical annihilation of the Jews.

Healthier and stronger Jews were deported for forced labor while those who remained in the Ghettos were decimated by starvation and epidemics. As these methods did not produce the desired results more drastic measures were adopted. Wholesale massacres were organized in the Ghettos and, finally, a complete annihilation of the ghettos was decided upon.

The Jews had simply ceased to exist. Special camps were established for this purpose where the destruction of human lives was carried on by mechanized means. The best known of these death camps are those of Treblinka, Belzec and Sobiber in the Lublin district. In these camps the Jews were put to death in their thousands by hitherto unknown, new methods, gas and steam chambers as well as electric current employed on a large scale. The Victims were recruited chiefly from the General Government, and particularly from the following districts: Warsaw, Radom, Lublin, Krakow and Lwow, but Jews from outside the General Government were also sent there, particularly from. the Bialystok district where the Ghettos were maintained for a long time and where in the summer months of 1943 about 10,000 Jews were rounded up and transported to Treblinka for extermination.

The main part of the "work" was done in summer and autumn 1942. Winter 1942 and the year 1943 were used for "mopping up operations", i. e. for the extermination of those who managed to dodge the main round-up and, of those younger Jews who were employed in war industry. To indulge in their lust for destruction the Germans did not hesitate to put to death even those younger Jews although their man-power was badly needed and their loss - as admitted by the Germans themselves - was a serious handicap for the war effort.

The Camp B of Treblinka is situated in hilly, wooded country It covered an area of about 5.000 ha (18 sq. miles) and was fenced off by hedges and barbed wire. It is bordered in the north by a young forest, in the west by a railway embankment while low hills shut it off from the East and South. There are several obser­vation posts in the camp for the camp guard (Lagerschutz) as well as searchlights used for securing the camp during the hours of darkness. A side track leads from the main railway track on to a loading platform adjoining a large open place fenced off by barbed wire. where several thousands persons can be accom­modated at the same time. To the north stands a large barrack and in the south-western corner an observation post. The place to the south of the barbed wire fence was used for sorting out pieces of clothes of the victims which were fit for further use (Lumpen­sortierungsplatz). Further to the south is the place of execution and a mass grave. A gate opens from the place to a road leading to the buildings and one of them is divided by a narrow corridor into two parts and measures approx. 40 yards by 25 yards. On each side of the corridor are situated five chambers whose height is about 6 and a half feet. There are no windows. The doors can be shut hermetically.

The second building consists of three chambers and a boiler­room. The steam generated in the boilers is led by means of pipes to the chambers. There are terracota floors which become very slippery when wet. Along the southern wall of the building runs a long platform where the bodies of the victims were piled up after execution. A well is situated near the boiler-room.

Behind this building and separated from the rest of the camp by barbed wire stands a barrack and a kitchen destined for the grave diggers. On both sides of these buildings are situated observation posts. As the executions grew in numbers, mass graves were dug out by motor driven machines and not by hand and shovel as in the beginning.

The camp was guarded by Germans of the SS-detachments and by Ukrainians. The officer to whom this guard was subordinated was the SS-Capt. SAUER. This garrison (Lagerschutz) performed also duties of executioners, while menial services had to be performed by the inmates of the camps themselves, so e.g. the unload­ing of the trucks, stripping of the victims and sorting out of their clothes and shoes (Lumpensortierung), the emptying of the death chambers and the burying of the bodies. When a new transport arrived some of the Jews were picked out to do this work so long till they broke down morally under the impression of this organized and mechanized mass murder. Then they had to dig their own graves and take up their position at them, whereupon they were shot one by one by SAUER personally. Their last duty before dying was to push the body of the preceding victim into its own grave. A new party was then chosen to continue their work in the camp. The sadism of SAUER in enjoying the shooting personally sounds incredible, but his guilt has been proven beyond any doubt.

The average number of Jews dealt with at the camp in summer 1942 was about two railway transports daily, but there were days of much higher efficiency. From autumn 1942 this number was falling.

After unloading in the siding all victims were assembled in one place where men were separated from women and children. In the first days of the existence of the camp the victims were made to believe that after a short stay in the camp, necessary for bathing and disinfection, they would be sent farther east, for work. Explanations of this sort were given by SS-Men who assisted at the unloading of the transports and further explanations could be read in notices stuck up on the walls of the barracks. But later, when more transports had to be dealt with, the Germans dropped all pretences and only tried to accelerate the procedure.

All victims had to strip of their clothes and shoes, which were collected afterwards, whereupon all victims, women and children first, were driven into the death chambers. Those too slow or too weak to move quickly were driven on by rifle butts, by whipping and kicking, often by SAUER himself. Many slipped and fell, the next victims pressed forward and stumbled over them. Small children were simply thrown inside. After being filled up to capacity the chambers were hermetically closed and steam was let in. In a few minutes all was over. Jewish menial workers had to remove the bodies from the platform and to bury them in mass graves. By and by, as new transports arrived, the cemetery grew extending in eastern direction.

From reports received may be assumed that several hundred thousands of Jews have been exterminated in Treblinka. Exact figures are impossible to obtain as the Germans did not bother to keep any records concerning the number of Jews deported to this camp and killed there. It will be even impossible to establish some correct figures because as early as spring 1943 the Germans began to exhume the bodies and to burn them so as to destroy all evidence of the crimes perpetrated. These cremations continue until summer 1943, when the victims were able to start a mutiny and to kill some of the guards enabling thus several hundred Jews to escape from the camp.

The above description of the mass murders in Treblinka gives only a faint idea of the horrors which prevailed in the camp. It is practically impossible to imagine the sufferings of the victims in the camp and to grasp the full extent of the atrocities. For the victims transported to the camp in cattle trucks and exposed for several days to the most cruel sufferings of body and soul, death in the steam chambers must have almost come as a welcome relief. Their only crime consisted in the fact of belonging to a race condemned by Hitler to death.

The responsibility of Dr. Hans FRANK for the setting up of the camp at Treblinka and for the mass killings described above is inherent to his official position as Governor General of Poland.

The camp could not be set up without either his direct order or, at least, his approval, and the numbers of people killed there, clearly indicate, that these atrocities were elements of a systematic policy of extermination. All those connected with the "liquidation" of ghettos and of the Jews themselves took their orders from the Governor General.

[Seal of Main Commission for the Investigation of German Crimes in Poland]

CERTIFICATE

This will certify that the document entitled "Charge No 6. Camp of Treblinka", concerning the extermination of Jews in this camp, is hereby officially submitted by the Polish Government to the International Military Tribunal by the undersigned under the pro­visions set forth in Article 21 of the Charter.

/S/ Dr. Cyprian
Dr. Tadeusz Cyprian
Polish Deputy Representative on the United
Nations War Crimes Commission in London

[Seal of Main Commission for the Investigation of German Crimes in Poland]

Nurnberg, the 5th December, 1945


Oh, they definitely presented evidence in the form of affidavits and "eyewitnesses" who testified, but- it is important to remember- this was a show trial, and the evidence presented- such as the ridiculous shrunken heads-was part of the show. The purpose of the show was not to evaluate evidence against the individual defendants per se, but to demonize the NSDAP regime as well as the German people in the eyes of gullible westerners.

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Re: The problems with the nuremberg trial

Postby hermod » 4 years 7 months ago (Sun Apr 12, 2015 7:42 pm)

Brainscan2015 wrote:Yeah I believe it is obvious that was the case. they wanted to make an example of germany for the western "zionist" cause.

But I'm still curious if it was at least presented at nuremberg.

I found this link regarding the subject:

http://exposing-the-holocaust-hoax-arch ... mberg.html

Absurd "Evidence" Presented at Nuremberg - The "Steam and Electrocution Death Chambers" at Treblinka




Steam chambers for delousing clothing at Birkenau

The Holohoaxers couldn't get their Treblinka "death camp" tale straight at first, with conflicting "eyewitness" stories of "extermination" of jews by gas and steam chambers. The steam chamber fairy tale has been abandoned, and now jewry has settled on gas with bug spray.


source: The Library of Congress, Volume 5, DOCUMENT 3311-PS, from the International Military Tribunal at Nurnberg, Germany.

The following is a a “Collection of Documentary Evidence and Guide Materials Prepared by the American and British Prosecuting Staffs for Presentation before the International Military Tribunal at Nurnberg, Germany.” It is recorded in an eight-volume, 12-book series, known as "Nazi Conspiracy and Aggression", also known as “The Red Series."

From Volume 5, DOCUMENT 3311-PS, we find the following on the "steam chambers" and "electrocution chambers" allegedly at Treblinka:


COPY OF DOCUMENT 3311-PS


You can also read it there: http://www.cwporter.com/pg2.htm

Good to know that the Nuremberg 'tribunal' didn't use any original documents but "certified true copies" (documents copied and certified true by a staff 75% Jewish*)...

The Nuremberg DOCUMENTS

Image
Alleged repository of the alleged "original documents" from the Nuremberg Trials

The standard version of events is that the Allies examined 100,000 documents and chose 1,000 which were introduced into evidence, and that the original documents were then deposited in the Peace Palace at The Hague. This is rather inexact.

The documents used in evidence at Nuremberg consisted largely of "photocopies" of "copies". Many of these original documents were written entirely on plain paper without handwritten markings of any kind, by unknown persons. Occasionally, there is an illegible initial or signature of a more or less unknown person certifying the document as a 'true copy'.

Sometimes there are German stamps, sometimes not. Many have been 'found' by the Russians, or 'certified authentic' by Soviet War Crimes Commissions.

Volume XXXIII, a document volume taken at random, contains 20 interrogations or affidavits, 12 photocopies, 5 unsigned copies, 5 original documents with signatures, 4 copies of printed material, 3 mimeographed copies, 3 teletypes, 1 microfilmm copy, 1 copy signed by somebody else and 1 unspecified.

The Hague has few, if any, original documents. The Hague has many original post-war 'affidavits', or sworn statements, the Tribunal Commission transcripts, and much valuable defense material.

They have the 'human soap', which has never been tested, and the 'original human soap recipe' (Document USSR-196), which is a forgery; but apparently no original wartime German documents.

The Hague has negative photostats of these documents, on extremely brittle paper which has been stapled. To photocopy the photostats, the staples are removed. When they are re-stapled more holes are made. Most of these documents have not been photocopied very often, and officials at the Hague say it is very unusual for anyone to ask to see them.

The National Archives in Washington (see Telford Taylor's Use of Captured German and Related Documents, A National Archive Conference) claim that the original documents are in The Hague. The Hague claims the original documents are in the National Archives.


The Stadtarchiv Nürnberg and the Bundesarchiv Koblenz also have no original documents, and both say the original documents are in Washington.

Since the originals are, in most cases, 'copies', there is often no proof that the documents in question ever existed.

http://www.cwporter.com/document.htm

(http://www.cwporter.com/innocent.htm)


http://www.cwporter.com/partone.htm

You'll probably find more stuff of interest on Carlos Whitlock Porter's website (http://www.cwporter.com/two2.htm).

*Consider these Sept. 25, 1945, observations from Tom Dodd, who would emerge as second in command on the American prosecution team:

You know how I have despised anti-Semitism. You know how strongly I feel toward those who preach intolerance of any kind. With that knowledge — you will understand when I tell you that this staff is about seventy-five percent Jewish. Now my point is that the Jews should stay away from this trial — for their own sake. For — mark this well — the charge ‘a war for the Jews’ is still being made and in the post-war years it will be made again and again. The too large percentage of Jewish men and women here will be cited as proof of this charge. Sometimes it seems that the Jews will never learn about these things. They seem intent on bringing new difficulties down on their own heads. I do not like to write about this matter —it is distasteful to me — but I am disturbed about it. They are pushing and crowding and competing with each other and with everyone else.

Note that this admission is coming from someone who is sympathetic to the Jews and opposes "anti-semitism."
"But, however the world pretends to divide itself, there are ony two divisions in the world to-day - human beings and Germans. – Rudyard Kipling, The Morning Post (London), June 22, 1915

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Re: The problems with the nuremberg trial

Postby hermod » 4 years 7 months ago (Sun Apr 12, 2015 8:45 pm)

Image

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"But, however the world pretends to divide itself, there are ony two divisions in the world to-day - human beings and Germans. – Rudyard Kipling, The Morning Post (London), June 22, 1915


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