DenialTheFilm.com - Revisionist rebuttal of upcoming Lipstadt movie defaming Revisionists

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Re: DenialTheFilm.com - Revisionist rebuttal of upcoming Lipstadt movie defaming Revisionists

Postby Hektor » 3 years 2 months ago (Tue Sep 27, 2016 3:43 pm)

Hieldner wrote:The very good second part is out


All mentions of CODOH have been dropped from this new episode and the website. Ostensibly, Hunt lost the CODOH support because of the troll joke in the first episode
Lost major donor because of troll joke in part 1. Need viewer donations to continue. Thanks.

https://twitter.com/holocaustdenier/sta ... 6416369664
For me, it was the comments on Lipstadt’s inner/outer ugliness that appeared a bit too fierce. I think her comments comparing revisionists to child rapists and her appearance are ugly enough, no need to characterize her further.

Can’t these short bits be cut out/replaced, the copiers notified to upload the new version, and the project finished with support from CODOH?

I partially agree. But since they deemed it necessary to engage a Hollywood-villain actor, that doesn't have any resemblance with Irving, expect that they're both White and of advanced age, it was within acceptable limits to point out what the equivalent would be, if the same standard would have been applied to Lipstadt herself.

Except for the reddish hair, there isn't really much resemblance in the actress towards Lipstadt. The equivalent here would be using an aging handsome James Bond character to play David Irving.

And one may think this won't be necessary, but obviously such manipulations need to be pointed out to many people, I mean just look what they readily swallow in line of the Holocaust narrative.

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Re: DenialTheFilm.com - Revisionist rebuttal of upcoming Lipstadt movie defaming Revisionists

Postby Hieldner » 3 years 2 months ago (Wed Sep 28, 2016 5:07 am)

Hektor wrote:
Hieldner wrote:The very good second part is out


All mentions of CODOH have been dropped from this new episode and the website. Ostensibly, Hunt lost the CODOH support because of the troll joke in the first episode
Lost major donor because of troll joke in part 1. Need viewer donations to continue. Thanks.

https://twitter.com/holocaustdenier/sta ... 6416369664
For me, it was the comments on Lipstadt’s inner/outer ugliness that appeared a bit too fierce. I think her comments comparing revisionists to child rapists and her appearance are ugly enough, no need to characterize her further.

Can’t these short bits be cut out/replaced, the copiers notified to upload the new version, and the project finished with support from CODOH?

I partially agree. But since they deemed it necessary to engage a Hollywood-villain actor, that doesn't have any resemblance with Irving, expect that they're both White and of advanced age, it was within acceptable limits to point out what the equivalent would be, if the same standard would have been applied to Lipstadt herself.

Except for the reddish hair, there isn't really much resemblance in the actress towards Lipstadt. The equivalent here would be using an aging handsome James Bond character to play David Irving.

And one may think this won't be necessary, but obviously such manipulations need to be pointed out to many people, I mean just look what they readily swallow in line of the Holocaust narrative.

I agree that the producers made a point out of Lipstadt’s appearance themselves by choosing Weisz, so this issue is okay to be debated and even ridiculed, but I think such a characterization unnecessarily damages the narrator’s impartiality, since Lipstadt’s looks don’t need further explanation and judgemental comments like these are better suited at the end of the episode/film, not at the beginning.

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Re: DenialTheFilm.com - Revisionist rebuttal of upcoming Lipstadt movie defaming Revisionists

Postby PRHL » 3 years 2 months ago (Thu Sep 29, 2016 5:44 pm)

In the 2nd video, beginning at 0:55, the section with Ricky Gervais and Kate Winslet (and later Leonardo DiCaprio) is very impressive:
Jokes about the Holocaust film industry with "Schindler's bloody list", happiness and hilarity all around ... An interesting insight into Hollywood!
Such insights should be published separately, i.e. without any revisionist context and without any comment. Let such material speak for itself!
Here in Germany, every revisionist work is condemned as a whole. That is: If e.g. a video or a book contains even only one single revisionist opinion, it is illegal as a whole. Even a single footnote in a book, and this footnote even written in Latin, can be enough to make the whole book illegal.

Or take the "Jewish soap": Today, even the German government itself officially spreads the word that the soap story is just a myth. Therefore it would be a good idea for a video to just collect and present videos and books where eyewitnesses talk about the soap. And after having presented all these testimonies, simply show the declaration: According to current German scholars, there has never been Jewish soap.
https://translate.google.de/translate?s ... edit-text=

A possible source for such a soap video could be the Phil Donahue show with Bradley Smith and David Cole. In that program, Michael Shermer himself first rejects the soap myth, but only a few minutes later, Shermer claims that a caller who tells the soap story is a proof that "the Germans themselves admit the holocaust". Yes, according to Shermer, a completely unknown caller who tells a notoriously false story is a proof that "the Germans" (i.e. all of them) admit the holocaust!
Again: Let it all speak for itself. Do not comment, do no explain, do not underline anything. Just put the quotes together. Otherwise, the whole video will be banned, and it will be illegal to link to it.

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Re: DenialTheFilm.com - Revisionist rebuttal of upcoming Lipstadt movie defaming Revisionists

Postby Hektor » 3 years 2 months ago (Fri Sep 30, 2016 5:54 am)

Hieldner wrote:.....
I agree that the producers made a point out of Lipstadt’s appearance themselves by choosing Weisz, so this issue is okay to be debated and even ridiculed, but I think such a characterization unnecessarily damages the narrator’s impartiality, since Lipstadt’s looks don’t need further explanation and judgemental comments like these are better suited at the end of the episode/film, not at the beginning.
.....

Sequence needs to be considered. But taking care that cracking down on Lipstadt doesn't earn her sympathies is the key issue. Remember, she tries to portray herself as being victimized by the supposed bully Irving her. She even went so far to state, she would be defending her "freedom of speech" based on the fact that Irving initiated the trial. I think the best is to rather be sarcastic with figures like Lipstadt, ridicule her that way.

The issue that they picked a younger, more attractive looking and also more soft spoken actress is quite telling and ought to be pointed out in contrast how they dealt with the Irving part.

The movie is for a mass audience and the aim is image building for Holocaust proponents while denigrating the image of Holocaust Revisionists. So it's an attempt of further muddying the waters and setting the playing field in their favor. The traditionally play this game and they certainly need to do that, given that rational arguments aren't their strong part.

PRHL wrote:In the 2nd video, beginning at 0:55, the section with Ricky Gervais and Kate Winslet (and later Leonardo DiCaprio) is very impressive:
Jokes about the Holocaust film industry with "Schindler's bloody list", happiness and hilarity all around ... An interesting insight into Hollywood!
Such insights should be published separately, i.e. without any revisionist context and without any comment. Let such material speak for itself!
Here in Germany, every revisionist work is condemned as a whole. That is: If e.g. a video or a book contains even only one single revisionist opinion, it is illegal as a whole. Even a single footnote in a book, and this footnote even written in Latin, can be enough to make the whole book illegal.
Yes, the sources may be useful. I'm sure there is far more on youtube, but screening takes time and effort.

PRHL wrote:Or take the "Jewish soap": Today, even the German government itself officially spreads the word that the soap story is just a myth. Therefore it would be a good idea for a video to just collect and present videos and books where eyewitnesses talk about the soap. And after having presented all these testimonies, simply show the declaration: According to current German scholars, there has never been Jewish soap.
https://translate.google.de/translate?s ... edit-text=
I recall Lipstadt also disputing the soap tale.

PRHL wrote:A possible source for such a soap video could be the Phil Donahue show with Bradley Smith and David Cole. In that program, Michael Shermer himself first rejects the soap myth, but only a few minutes later, Shermer claims that a caller who tells the soap story is a proof that "the Germans themselves admit the holocaust". Yes, according to Shermer, a completely unknown caller who tells a notoriously false story is a proof that "the Germans" (i.e. all of them) admit the holocaust!
Again: Let it all speak for itself. Do not comment, do no explain, do not underline anything. Just put the quotes together. Otherwise, the whole video will be banned, and it will be illegal to link to it.
Don't recall that, but probably a caller with a thick German accent. Even if for real, it still doesn't prove anything relevant. The government and substantially parts of the elites certainly profess the Holocaust, at least publicly or officially. But was that that proof. Germany essentially has got a puppet regime.

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Re: DenialTheFilm.com - Revisionist rebuttal of upcoming Lipstadt movie defaming Revisionists

Postby Werd » 3 years 2 months ago (Fri Sep 30, 2016 9:59 am)

Denierbud pointed out that the phone call on Donahue was a fraud because the caller said she met Mengele but she was in the camp at Lebensbraun (sp?). Mengele wasn't even there. :lol:

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Re: DenialTheFilm.com - Revisionist rebuttal of upcoming Lipstadt movie defaming Revisionists

Postby HeiligeSturm » 3 years 2 months ago (Fri Sep 30, 2016 4:22 pm)

Werd wrote:Denierbud pointed out that the phone call on Donahue was a fraud because the caller said she met Mengele but she was in the camp at Lebensbraun (sp?). Mengele wasn't even there. :lol:


She actually refers to Lebensborn*. But the whole phone call is typical mess of Holocaust lore just like many of the so called testimonies.
Despite being supposedly Aryan as her mother was in Hitler Jugend, Mengele did experiments on her.
She saw the Jewish tortures. She saw everything. Soap made from people, lampshades, gas stoves [sic]... :D


*"Yes, my mother was in Hitler Youth and she was a fanatic follower...
and she produced babies for Adolf Hitler and I was born in Lebensborn the special clinic next to Dachau..."
Carol Stulberg: Were you ever in the gas chamber? Did you see the gas chamber?
Morris Venezia: Of course I was every day over there.
Carol Stulberg: Can you describe to us what it looked like?
Morris Venezia: It’s nothing to describe

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Re: DenialTheFilm.com - Revisionist rebuttal of upcoming Lipstadt movie defaming Revisionists

Postby flimflam » 3 years 2 months ago (Fri Sep 30, 2016 7:02 pm)

"Such insights should be published separately, i.e. without any revisionist context ... "

Well, they have been published separately ....





Even better is an interview with Dina Babbitt who taught kindergarten in Auschwitz and was interviewed by Spielberg ...



Are these vids available in Germany. A clip could be made of the Babbit vid of just the kindergarten section.

If someone posted several such vids, would they pass the censor?

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Re: DenialTheFilm.com - Revisionist rebuttal of upcoming Lipstadt movie defaming Revisionists

Postby hermod » 3 years 2 months ago (Fri Sep 30, 2016 10:35 pm)

ginger wrote:"From the TV documentary –– https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OCERa40KP64 - at 43:25 to 47:07 – we hear Van Pelt say 120,000 bodies were cremated each month. Then we hear Irving argue that it would require mountains of fuel. Van Pelt responds that it could be done with small amounts of fuel - a water bottle of fuel per corpse – Van Pelt then reads from a report written in the 1980’s on the patent application proposed by Topf during the war – saying it was “self-heating” (but really it would have required small amounts of fuel).

One representation of the oven can be found here:

http://www.topfundsoehne.de/cms-www/ind ... id=120&l=1

I would be surprised if Van Pelt’s testimony of the oven is emphasized in the new movie “Denial” because the oven was never built."

CODOH - Is there a way to introduce the subject of the TV documentary, the testimony of Van Pelt, the magic oven that was never built, to this website discussion? It should cause readers to question the integrity of the Court, the integrity of Van Pelt, the intelligence and integrity of Deborah Lipstadt.


They'd better not mention it. Because it should cause readers to question the 'Holocaust' it self too. Some people could ask why the Germans had such a super-oven available during the war (the patent was from 1942 if memory serves me right) AND nevertheless chose not to equip their alleged murder factories with devices blatantly perfect for the gargantuan task of disposing of mountains of dead bodies on and on.
"But, however the world pretends to divide itself, there are ony two divisions in the world to-day - human beings and Germans. – Rudyard Kipling, The Morning Post (London), June 22, 1915

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Re: DenialTheFilm.com - Revisionist rebuttal of upcoming Lipstadt movie defaming Revisionists

Postby ginger » 3 years 2 months ago (Sat Oct 01, 2016 11:38 am)

Yes, hermod, we agree. This, to my mind, is a major stumbling block of the stories, especially the stories around Auschwitz. In 1944, it is said, 440,000 people were killed there in 2 months!

Is "Denial" is being shown in theater now? I suppose I'll see it eventually to find out if Van Pelt testifies about the magic oven that was never built.

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Re: DenialTheFilm.com - Revisionist rebuttal of upcoming Lipstadt movie defaming Revisionists

Postby Rogal Dorn » 3 years 2 months ago (Sun Oct 02, 2016 5:32 am)

I have yet to find a mainstream scholar who said Nazis never made soap out of anyone, ever.

What I have found, is them saying human soap was not produced on an industrial scale, and that it was not made out of Jews.

Only Lipstadt's quote gets close, but her quote is 30 years old

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Re: DenialTheFilm.com - Revisionist rebuttal of upcoming Lipstadt movie defaming Revisionists

Postby Kingfisher » 3 years 2 months ago (Sun Oct 02, 2016 7:44 am)

Rogal Dorn wrote:I have yet to find a mainstream scholar who said Nazis never made soap out of anyone, ever.

What I have found, is them saying human soap was not produced on an industrial scale, and that it was not made out of Jews.

Only Lipstadt's quote gets close, but her quote is 30 years old

Ok so let's concede that someone somewhere might once have made soap from corpses. We just don't know. What does that have to do with the Holocaust ®?

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Re: DenialTheFilm.com - Revisionist rebuttal of upcoming Lipstadt movie defaming Revisionists

Postby Hektor » 3 years 2 months ago (Sun Oct 02, 2016 8:56 am)

Thanks flimflam!
Rogal Dorn wrote:I have yet to find a mainstream scholar who said Nazis never made soap out of anyone, ever.
What I have found, is them saying human soap was not produced on an industrial scale, and that it was not made out of Jews.
Only Lipstadt's quote gets close, but her quote is 30 years old


That's what I also get and this seems to be the modus operandi followed concerning other issues like the Altreich gas chambers. Don't throw it out completely, but just minimize the claim.

That saves them from having to say that this was complete fiction. (And that earlier propaganda in this regard was complete fiction). So they can say:"Yeah, some claims may have been exaggerate, but it's essentially true and that's what matters". Consider that this story doesn't live on facts, but perceptions, emotions, impressions in the public. It's like a marketing ploy where the sales don't depend on the product, but on feelings aroused with the "customers". That's how con scams work, not science or serious historical research.

"I am very careful in the movie," said Ballas. "I believe the viewers are intelligent and will understand the complexity of the myth. I think it is worthwhile for people to hear the truth. It may ease the fears of those who believe the story. The Nazis did so many horrible things; there is no need for another one. If Yad Vashem explains how the myth was created, that will damage the claims of Holocaust deniers."
Said Bauer: "Already at the Nuremburg Trials it was clear that this was not [true]. They saw the laboratory in Danzig was only experimental. The rumor about soap was a psychological plot against the Jews - classic viciousness of the Nazis. [People] ask me endlessly about the matter."
Bauer argues that the soaps should be removed immediately from all Holocaust memorials. He is eagerly awaiting the release of Ballas' film. Anything that weakens and refutes such myths is good, he says. But he doubts the soap myth will be put to rest so easily.
read more: http://www.haaretz.com/jewish/features/ ... m-1.527623
http://www.haaretz.com/jewish/features/ ... m-1.527623


So Bauer blames the Nazis, .... and not their opponents propaganda. Essentially that's a case of blame shifting. I see it also as a psychological ploy of first exaggerating claims, then paddle back a bit and thereby insinuating that the "truth is somewhere in the middle". A dangerous method to obtain truth IMO. If one guy says the exact truth and others come up with inflated and distorted stories. Then the truth isn't the "average" of all stories. It's with the position that is exact.

Note the mentioning of Holocaust deniers. Essentially the paddling back by admission of error is a face-saving exercise by the Holocaust industry.

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Re: DenialTheFilm.com - Revisionist rebuttal of upcoming Lipstadt movie defaming Revisionists

Postby Hannover » 3 years 2 months ago (Sun Oct 02, 2016 10:02 am)

Rogal Dorn wrote:I have yet to find a mainstream scholar who said Nazis never made soap out of anyone, ever.

What I have found, is them saying human soap was not produced on an industrial scale, and that it was not made out of Jews.

Only Lipstadt's quote gets close, but her quote is 30 years old

As if the age of a quote matters. Once again:
The soap rumor was prevalent both during and after the war. It may have had its origin in the cadaver factory atrocity story that came out of World War I. The soap rumor was thoroughly investigated after the war and proved to be untrue. The fact is that the Nazis never used the bodies of Jews, or for that matter anyone else, for the production of soap."

- Deborah Lipstadt, Nazi Soap Rumor During World War II, Los Angeles Times, May 16, 1981, p II/2

So called 'holocaust historian' Hilberg said:
To us the importance of the soap rumor lies in its effectiveness as a carrier of information about the mass killings.
"Mass killings" which didn't occur.
Consequently Hilberg sees a usefulness of the human soap lie in conditioning people to believe in the false "mass killings" nonsense.


As for the false Danzig 'experimental' claim:
- Where is a verifiable analysis?
- Where is this so called 'human soap' today to examine?
It's part of desperate attempt to retain a piece of alleged 'truth' concerning the non-existent human soap.
The 'experimental' claim is as bogus as the original 'mass produced' claim.

see more:
claim: Nazis used human remains to make soap
viewtopic.php?t=3714
and:
Human soap & Human skin lampshades debunked
viewtopic.php?t=481

- Hannover

Revisionists are just the messengers, the absurd impossibility of the laughable 'holocaust' storyline is the message.
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Re: DenialTheFilm.com - Revisionist rebuttal of upcoming Lipstadt movie defaming Revisionists

Postby hermod » 3 years 2 months ago (Sun Oct 02, 2016 11:21 am)

Rogal Dorn wrote:I have yet to find a mainstream scholar who said Nazis never made soap out of anyone, ever.

What I have found, is them saying human soap was not produced on an industrial scale, and that it was not made out of Jews.

Only Lipstadt's quote gets close, but her quote is 30 years old


"Historians have concluded that soap was not made from human fat." - Schmuel Krakoski, Yad Vashem, April 1990.

"There is no evidence Nazi Germany used corpses for soap" - Israeli Holocaust historian Yehuda Bauer, April 1990.

"The Nazis never made soap from Jews because they did not have such technology." - Israeli Holocaust historian Yehuda Bauer, April 1990.

"There is no proof the Nazis made soap from human bodies during the Holocaust." - a Yad Vashem spokeswoman, February 2005.

"The fact is that the Nazis never used the bodies of Jews, or for that matter anyone else, for the production of soap."- Deborah Lipstadt

Image

Image

Image
(Note the pic of the alleged Nazi soap brought by the Soviets at Nuremberg, to illustrate the fact that "there is no proof the Nazis made soap from human bodies during the Holocaust.")

Image
https://s25.postimg.org/5a1tt1jbz/Holoc ... _war_2.jpg
"But, however the world pretends to divide itself, there are ony two divisions in the world to-day - human beings and Germans. – Rudyard Kipling, The Morning Post (London), June 22, 1915

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Re: DenialTheFilm.com - Revisionist rebuttal of upcoming Lipstadt movie defaming Revisionists

Postby hermod » 3 years 2 months ago (Sun Oct 02, 2016 11:47 am)

Hektor wrote:
Said Bauer: "Already at the Nuremburg Trials it was clear that this was not [true]. They saw the laboratory in Danzig was only experimental.

http://www.haaretz.com/jewish/features/ ... m-1.527623



Bauer's blame shifting and complete turnabout (compared to his statement from 1990) is just another lie. There was no experimental lab for the manufacture of human soap at Danzig. That place was an anatomical institute. And among various things, anatomical institutes prepare skeletons for studies and collections. One of the byproducts from the preparation of skeletons for anatomical purposes is fat, human fat in the case of human skeletons, fat from body fat stores and also fat from the degreasing of bones. Any anatomical institute in this world produces human-fat 'soap' similar to the piece provided by the Soviets at Nuremberg, as a byproduct of its activities.
"But, however the world pretends to divide itself, there are ony two divisions in the world to-day - human beings and Germans. – Rudyard Kipling, The Morning Post (London), June 22, 1915


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