So how many Jews died?

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Iggy
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So how many Jews died?

Postby Iggy » 1 decade 3 years ago (Wed Apr 20, 2005 4:53 pm)

I'm curious to know the opinions of the non-believers in the Holocaust on this question.

How many innocent Jews were killed by the Nazis during World War II?

I'm just trying to gage the range of opinions on this.

Thanks.



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Hannover
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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 3 years ago (Wed Apr 20, 2005 6:33 pm)

The word 'innocent' is the fly in the ointment here.

Some points to remember:

- labor camps included common criminals, some were Jews, ofcourse

- Jews were very active in the illegal terrorist partisan groups (non-uniformed combatants), they suffered casualties via Einsatzgruppen anti-terrorist actions, they were certainly not 'innocent'

- inmates were also killed by Allied air attacks on the labor camps, undoubtedly some Jews were involved

- The 'death books' of Auschwitz compiled by the Germans are incomplete for all years, However, it's deduced from the existing records that ca. 125,000 died there. Just how many of these were Jews, and how 'innocent' they were, I do not know. There were certainly executions for crime at Auschwitz and other labor camps, no doubt some Jews were involved. I suspect such books were kept for most of the labor camps, curiously they have disappeared and the numbers now alleged by the 'holocau$t' Industry are absurd and unsustainable when scrutinized.

- We must consider the Allies illegal attacks on civilian transportation which caused needed medical supplies and food to never reach the labor camps.

- As in all wars there were atrocities and 'collateral damage' by both sides. It's my opinion that the Allies were guilty of much more of that than the Germans in WWII, very much more. I have seen no information to change that view.

I would think the question as to 'how many innocent Jews died?' needs to be re-worded.

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Postby Iggy » 1 decade 3 years ago (Wed Apr 20, 2005 6:40 pm)

Hannover, I accept all of your points. I think the operative part of my question is "by the Nazis." How many Jews who weren't partisans, criminals of some sort, or killed because of the Allies were directly murdered by the Nazis.

The IHR's 66 Q&A says that at most 500,000 died in camps. How many were innocent and not killed by Allied bombardment?

That's what I'm trying to gage.

Thanks again.

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AshesAreBurning
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Postby AshesAreBurning » 1 decade 3 years ago (Wed Apr 20, 2005 6:45 pm)

Jews were very active in the illegal terrorist partisan groups (non-uniformed combatants), they suffered casualties via Einsatzgruppen anti-terrorist actions, they were certainly not 'innocent'


Hannover,
That is precious. We have whole families wiped clean off th face of the earth , men, woman and children were all terroroists and not innocent.



The 'death books' of Auschwitz compiled by the Germans are incomplete for all years, However, it's deduced from the existing records that ca. 125,000 died there. Just how many of these were Jews, and how 'innocent' they were, I do not know. There were certainly executions for crime at Auschwitz and other labor camps, no doubt some Jews were involved. I suspect such books were kept for most of the labor camps, curiously they have disappeared and the numbers now alleged by the 'holocau$t' Industry are absurd and unsustainable when scrutinized.


So where did the millions of others go. Were 2 milllion Polist Jews shipped to the US and Palestine? Please account for the msyterious disappearence of these communities.


I would think the question as to 'how many innocent Jews died?' needs to be re-worded.


Please explain this.

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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 3 years ago (Wed Apr 20, 2005 6:50 pm)

For more on the 'death books' see:
http://www.corax.org/revisionism/misc/deathbooks.html

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 1 decade 3 years ago (Wed Apr 20, 2005 7:03 pm)

Ashes are burning wrote:
Were 2 milllion Polish Jews shipped to the US and Palestine?

I don't have the figures but that could be right. Israel has 6 or 7 million people. Over half are ashkenazi Jewish? What was the ashkenazi Jewish population of Israel in 1960? Whatever it was, a large part would be Polish Jews.

Could the US have absorbed a million Polish Jews via immigration from 1940 to 1960? I think so. But again I don't have any figures.

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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 3 years ago (Wed Apr 20, 2005 7:06 pm)

ashes said:
That is precious. We have whole families wiped clean off th face of the earth , men, woman and children were all terroroists and not innocent.

No strawmen please; no one said "all".
Your problem is that you have no evidence for "wiped clean off th[e] face of the earth". Accordingly it would seem that only Jews' and their 'communities' can simply vanish. Now, that is truly precious.

You're just spouting the standard storyline for which there is no evidence. You certainly haven't/can't produce any. Why not?

Actually, women and children were involved in the terrorist partisans, and I suggest you read international law of the period.

Your points are addressed here, you really should read:

'Jews of Poland. Where'd they go?'
http://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?t=1612

Cheers, Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 3 years ago (Wed Apr 20, 2005 7:35 pm)

The illegal terrorist partisans, women and children galore:

Image
Image
Image

But yet, their combat deaths and legal executions are 'holocau$t' deaths.

How many, indeed.

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Postby Iggy » 1 decade 3 years ago (Wed Apr 20, 2005 7:42 pm)

Yes indeed. How many? All this back and forth and I still haven't gotten an answer.

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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 3 years ago (Wed Apr 20, 2005 8:13 pm)

Does that include typhus deaths?

- H.
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 3 years ago (Wed Apr 20, 2005 8:15 pm)

How many does Iggy think?

- H.
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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code yellow
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Postby code yellow » 1 decade 3 years ago (Wed Apr 20, 2005 10:10 pm)

:) Iggy,your problem is that you are hooked,like many others,on the nazi killing machine canard.If you are realy concearned about the truth,you'll

leave backdated history books on the subject and history channel sensationalist programs alone,because all that has been reported to the

general public for decades is a one sided exploration of the events that occured.Although,looking at the history channel the other night,I was

suprised to hear WW2 vets and the narator talking of " huge typhus outbreaks".It seems to me that the so-called concearned individuals and

or groups would investigate the elaborate claims more thoroughly and hope that these people didn't die in such horrific ways.As far as elleged

mass killings from nazi's are concearned,remember,Hitler decreed that no excesses be commited towards jews,and laws were created that forbade

the misstreatment of concentration camp inmates under penalty of death.A good example of this would be Koch,who was tried by an SS court and executed for extorting money from jews and then killing them.

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Postby kk » 1 decade 3 years ago (Wed Apr 20, 2005 10:14 pm)

Again , Sanning is a great help in assesing loss of the jewish population
during the war years.
Why not reffering to him?

You may find a german version in a pdf:
http://vho.org/aaargh/fran/livres/SANNING.pdf

Is there an english translation of this book on the web?

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Postby Moderator » 1 decade 3 years ago (Wed Apr 20, 2005 10:26 pm)

Ashes:

It was Carto's Cutlass who said what you quote, not Hannover. Try again. The rest of what you said is:
1. unrelated to the post
2. referring to events prior to the war
Only lies need to be shielded from debate, truth welcomes it.

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Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 1 decade 3 years ago (Wed Apr 20, 2005 10:51 pm)

How many innocent Jews were killed by the Nazis during World War II?

A direct question deserves a direct answer: I don't know. The revisionist side doesn't have the billions of dollars and thousands of professors.

On one hand was enmity toward the Jews.

On the other was a PR nightmare leading to Germany letting in Red Cross observers.

On another hand was that an aspect of German culture involves playing by the rules. Thus perhaps less "Abu Ghraibs" than other cultures might have. (In other words less unauthorized shootings of Jews.) This is a striking aspect of their culture that can be clearly seen by watching Germany play World Cup soccer, when you notice that the German team isn't secretly trying to head-butt or elbow members of the other team when the referee isn't looking, unlike so many other teams. Something like this is quite noticeable with, for instance, Germany vs. Cameroon.

On another hand is the Catholic Church coming out as not a friend to Nazism (due to very different ideologies.) And helping to smear you. Even through the Red Cross perhaps. Right now the Red Cross has important info. It's not open to the public. And they were the big watchdogs that could have helped answer this thread's question. I don't think the Red Cross made up stuff, but like the Catholic Church, they sat there and watched the lies happen, and didn't do much to refute them. At the same time they had an office at Auschwitz and never reported mass killings.

How many innocent Germans were killed by the Jews. Well, we know a little about that because we have John Sack's book called Eye For an Eye. But that wasn't your question.
Last edited by Carto's Cutlass Supreme on Wed Apr 20, 2005 11:21 pm, edited 2 times in total.


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