Which countries have 'denial' laws?

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Carto's Cutlass Supreme
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Which countries have 'denial' laws?

Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 1 decade 4 years ago (Tue Nov 15, 2005 1:47 pm)

Specifically I was wondering if Poland has one.

I know Carlo Mattogno can pursue his research in Italy since Italy has no law.

France's law is such that Robert Faurisson can issue a compilation of all his writings, but only as a private collection, not sold publicly.

England has no law I don't think, but will do things like lock Fred Leuchter in jail for the night before sending him back to America.

Swede Deitlieb Felderer was denied entrance into the United States.

Switzerland has a law which is why Jurgen Graf is in exile.

I did a search her under "law" but couldn't find anything.

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Postby ClaudiaRothenbach » 1 decade 4 years ago (Tue Nov 15, 2005 3:16 pm)

USA do not have a law but behave as if they had one.

Israel has a law. :oops:
"Everything has already been said, but not yet by everyone." - Karl Valentin

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Postby Carto's Cutlass Supreme » 1 decade 4 years ago (Tue Nov 15, 2005 3:31 pm)

Does Poland?

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Hannover
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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 4 years ago (Tue Nov 15, 2005 3:54 pm)

Yes, Poland has a law.

see the whole deal here:

THE CAMPAIGN TO DECRIMINALIZE
WORLD WAR II HISTORY
http://www.outlawhistory.com
excerpt:
Countries that have laws that limit the scope and substance of World War II and Holocaust research include France, Germany, Switzerland, Canada, Australia, Belgium, the Netherlands, Austria, Sweden, Denmark, Poland, and Spain.1 These laws make it a crime for anyone, regardless of their credentials or the factual basis of their views, to question or revise any aspect of the history of World War II or the Holocaust in a manner that goes beyond the somewhat arbitrary standards established by the governments of those countries.2

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Postby Maly Jacek » 1 decade 4 years ago (Tue Nov 15, 2005 4:49 pm)

According to Polish law (passed in Nov 1998) anyone denying "crimes commited against humanity between 1939-1989" can be fined and imprisoned for anything up to 3 tears.Interesting story :

http://www.adelaideinstitute.org/Dissen ... ajczak.htm

There is no such a law in UK for the time being but at least two attempts were made to change that : one in 1995 and second in 2001 - both turned down in the House of Lords.

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Postby Vallon » 1 decade 4 years ago (Tue Nov 15, 2005 5:29 pm)

www.outlawhistory.com wrote:Countries that have laws that limit the scope and substance of World War II and Holocaust research include France, Germany, Switzerland, Canada, Australia, Belgium, the Netherlands, Austria, Sweden, Denmark, Poland, and Spain.

These laws make it a crime for anyone, regardless of their credentials or the factual basis of their views, to question or revise any aspect of the history of World War II or the Holocaust in a manner that goes beyond the somewhat arbitrary standards established by the governments of those countries.

This is not correct, of course.

The laws of some (most?) of the countries in that list do not mention the second world war, or the holocaust. In most of those countries it is "hate crimes" that are forbidden.

I will take Sweden as an example. Some revisionists have been sentenced in Sweden. These are just some names I can think of:

1. Ditlieb Felderer, already mentioned above. He had been called by Zündel as a defense witness. The Canadian prosecution had hem read his material that he was convcted for in Sweden. You can read it on http://www.zundelsite.org/english/dsmrd ... derer.html (near the end). He was mainly convicted for very crude insults.

2. Dan Berner. The court found that he had expresed contempt for an ethnic group (Berner had said that coloured people should be repatriated to their home countries). (And later it was discovered that Berner had killed someone.) Convicted together with Karolina Matti, who had organized his talk at a university.

3. Tommy Rydén, leader of the Creativist Church in Sweden (RaHoWa, and stuff like that). He was condemned for hate crimes. Spent time in jail together with number 4.

4. Ahmed Rami (Radio Islam). Also he was condemned for contempt av an ethnic group (antisemitism in his case).

This law is constantly creating problems. Right now the Swedish Supreme Court is considering whether it should apply to a gay-bashing pentecostal preacher.

My own standpoint is that the kind of stuff that Felderer did should be punishable by law.

Maly Jacek wrote:There is no such a law in UK for the time being but at least two attempts were made to change that : one in 1995 and second in 2001 - both turned down in the House of Lords.

A group of Jewish lawyers has argued against such a law. Their report is on the web.
* A panel of senior British lawyers, chaired by Anthony Julius - he of the Irving-Lipstadt fame - advised the British government against the introduction of legislation in England that would outlaw Holocaust Revisionism.

"They (Holocaust Revisionists) are small, benighted people," sniffed Julius. "Their work does not represent a challenge to historians. They are few in number, and that number is not growing. The response to denial should be proportionate to its menace."

Julius added that Holocaust Revisionists "cannot be convinced of either the wickedness or the idiocy of their cause."
http://www.zundelsite.org/english/zgram ... 00702.html

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Postby gasto » 1 decade 4 years ago (Tue Nov 15, 2005 6:00 pm)

Vallon wrote:
www.outlawhistory.com wrote:Countries that have laws that limit the scope and substance of World War II and Holocaust research include France, Germany, Switzerland, Canada, Australia, Belgium, the Netherlands, Austria, Sweden, Denmark, Poland, and Spain.

These laws make it a crime for anyone, regardless of their credentials or the factual basis of their views, to question or revise any aspect of the history of World War II or the Holocaust in a manner that goes beyond the somewhat arbitrary standards established by the governments of those countries.

This is not correct, of course.

The laws of some (most?) of the countries in that list do not mention the second world war, or the holocaust. In most of those countries it is "hate crimes" that are forbidden.


just wondering...Isn´t the "holocaust" regarded as a hate crime in those countries of that list?

I´ll try to search for "holocaust" laws in these countries, and see what I can find..
So far Belgium´s:
"Concerning a question on the denial of the existence of the Holocaust, the delegation said that acts of revising the Holocaust were prohibited in Belgium. Publications and books written on the subject to undermine the existence of the Holocaust were considered to be revisionist crimes"

source: http://www.unhchr.ch/huricane/huricane. ... endocument
If Human Soap rumour was fake, why can´t all the other absurd claims be too??

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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 4 years ago (Tue Nov 15, 2005 6:07 pm)

Vallon said:
This is not correct, of course.

The laws of some (most?) of the countries in that list do not mention the second world war, or the holocaust. In most of those countries it is "hate crimes" that are forbidden.

Get real, Vallon. Ofcourse they don't mention WWII or the 'holocau$t', that would tip their hand and would reveal the true agenda. Instead they get guys on 'hate crimes' since questioning the so called 'holocau$t' is absurdly considered a 'hate crime.'

Then you said:
A group of Jewish lawyers has argued against such a law. Their report is on the web.

"They (Holocaust Revisionists) are small, benighted people," sniffed Julius. "Their work does not represent a challenge to historians. They are few in number, and that number is not growing. The response to denial should be proportionate to its menace."

In other words Vallon, as soon as these Jews feel that Revisionists are a real menace, THEN there should be laws against them.

I find it appalling that you feel someone should be arrested for 'crude insults'. Free speech; we either have it, or we do not.

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Postby Vallon » 1 decade 4 years ago (Tue Nov 15, 2005 6:44 pm)

Hannover wrote:Free speech; we either have it, or we do not.
Is that why Irving sued Lipstadt for libel?

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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 4 years ago (Tue Nov 15, 2005 7:08 pm)

Vallon,
Was there a law against what Lipstadt said about Irving?

Does Vallon know the difference between libel laws and free speech?

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Postby theTRUTH » 1 decade 4 years ago (Tue Nov 15, 2005 8:44 pm)

In March, 1995 U.S. citizen Gary Lauck was arrested at a Danish airport and held until deported in June, '96 to Germany where he was sentenced in August, '96, to 4 years for mailing illegal Nazi propaganda and inciting racial hatred. Full time was deducted for pre-trial detention in Denmark and Germany, and Lauck was flown to the U.S. on March 27th, 1999. Could this precident be argued to deduct the 2 years that Zundel spent in the Canadian detention center?

Could revisionists entering the following countries be stopped and deported to Germany - Austria, Belgium, Denmark, France, Holland, Poland, Spain, Sweden, and Switzerland ?

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Postby Vallon » 1 decade 4 years ago (Wed Nov 16, 2005 2:33 am)

theTRUTH wrote:Could revisionists entering the following countries be stopped and deported to Germany - Austria, Belgium, Denmark, France, Holland, Poland, Spain, Sweden, and Switzerland ?

Affirmative for Holland: Verbeke was extradited after his arrest on Amsterdam Airport. (Or will be - I do not know if he is in Germany right now.)

And that is on the basis of the European Arrest Order, so it is probably the same even for Great Britain.

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Postby Maly Jacek » 1 decade 4 years ago (Wed Nov 16, 2005 6:21 am)

Could revisionists entering the following countries be stopped and deported to Germany - Austria, Belgium, Denmark, France, Holland, Poland, Spain, Sweden, and Switzerland ?


I guess that would apply to Poland.

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Postby Radar » 1 decade 4 years ago (Tue Nov 22, 2005 9:46 am)

The bottom line is that these laws punish the holding of opinions which contradict "official", government dictated views on certain subjects, in this case events which took place during World War II. In some cases they even punish the publication of views critical of the holdings of the Nuremberg Tribunals which themselves have been widely criticized by jurists in many countries. The laws prevent normal defense tactics such as showing that the defendant in the case was correct in his views and in Germany even run the risk that defense lawyers will be disbarred or prosecuted for defending unworthy clients, the victims of these laws.

It is inconceivable to me that any person interested in freedom of thought could defend such a system. Any historic event is subject to critical examination and the events of "the Holocaust" in particular, which have already been shown to have been riddled with fraudulent evidence, should not be exempt from such scrutiny because Jews claim to be offended by such examination. Yet this aspect of these thought control laws is never discussed in the US, not in the media, not in academic circles. This is a moral disgrace to this country.

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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 4 years ago (Tue Nov 22, 2005 1:20 pm)

Extreme scrutiny of Christianity, Christ, the birth of Christ, was Christ homosexual?, who was Mary?, conspiracy charges about the 'Last Supper', attacks upon the Vatican, on & on are met with silence and no laws exist to prevent such scrutiny.

Why is it legal to attack Christians and Christian society, but yet scrutiny of the absurd Jewish 'holocau$t' is banned because it is 'antisemitic'? What are they hiding?

It should be remembered that under Communism there were laws against 'anti-semitism', but none against anti-gentilism, or anti-Christianism.

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.


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