'Nazis kept meticulous records of mass exterminations'

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Mannstein
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'Nazis kept meticulous records of mass exterminations'

Postby Mannstein » 1 decade 1 year ago (Mon Aug 06, 2007 1:20 pm)

Here is a recent article form the International Herald Tribune claiming that the Nazis kept meticulous records of their WWII mass exterminations;


A closely guarded Holocaust archive opens its doors
By Mark Landler

Sunday, August 5, 2007
BAD AROLSEN, Germany: Like other Holocaust victims, Noemi Ban has gone back numerous times to survey the ghostly field of chimneys at Auschwitz-Birkenau, the Nazi concentration camp in Poland where she and her family arrived in July 1944, and she alone survived.

But last May, Ban got an even more jolting glimpse into her past, when she visited the Holocaust archive in this tranquil town in central Germany. There, filed in the labyrinthine shelves of records, was a faded scrap of paper that she remembers signing on the day she arrived at the camp from Hungary.

"I was shocked to see my handwriting," Ban, 84, said by telephone from her home in Bellingham, Washington State. "When I signed it, I had no idea why. Why they needed such precise data in that horrible place is amazing."

The Nazis kept meticulous records of their mass extermination during World War II, and much of it ended up here, in a closely guarded archive maintained by the International Tracing Service, which is administered by the International Committee of the Red Cross.

Now, after more than six decades, the tracing service is opening its vast repository of information - not just to survivors like Ban, who have long had the right to see material here, but to scholars who are eager to plumb its depths for fresh insights into an unfathomable horror.

On Aug. 20, the archive plans to transfer digital copies of the first major trove of documents to the U.S. Holocaust Memorial Museum in Washington and to the Yad Vashem memorial in Jerusalem.

The files cover 51 concentration camps and prisons, and include transportation lists, medical reports, entry documents - like the one signed by Ban - and Gestapo prison records. About 10 million documents in all, they will represent a third of the entire collection at Bad Arolsen.

Prying open the doors of Bad Arolsen has been a lengthy, politically fraught process, and it is not completely finished. Three of the 11 countries that oversee the institution have not yet ratified an amended treaty that would give historians unfettered access to the archive.

In May, though, the 11 countries, among them Germany and the United States, agreed to begin the electronic transfer even before the last three countries - Italy, France, and Greece - ratify the treaty.

"We have interpreted the decision in a way that there is no turning back," Reto Meister, the director of the tracing service, said. "It became very evident that the ITS had to change because the victims wanted it to change."

A tall, rangy Swiss national who has spent his career in places like Iraq and Lebanon for the Red Cross, Meister has made it his mission to dispel Bad Arolsen's reputation as a secret Nazi archive - a characterization he contends was always a bit exaggerated.

Outside experts on the Holocaust, who have long pushed for more access, said he had been remarkably successful.

"I have a good deal of admiration for how far he's moved the place," said Paul Shapiro, the director of advanced Holocaust studies at the museum in Washington. "He's dealing with a staff that, for a very long time, operated in a closed and secretive manner. He also has to balance multiple forces."

Among those is the German government, which pays nearly $20 million a year for the upkeep of the tracing service and its 320 employees. Until last year, Germany opposed granting wider access to the archive, contending that it would violate privacy standards.

The documents include confidential personal information, like reports of medical experiments carried out on prisoners, and accusations of murder and homosexuality made by the Nazis to discredit people.

Much of the material was discovered by Allied forces when they liberated the camps at the end of World War II. They dumped the files in a complex of vacated SS barracks in Bad Arolsen, which was conveniently located near the border dividing the U.S. and British occupation zones.

Few historians doubt there is a wealth of dramatic, wrenching personal stories in the archives. Shapiro said he expected enormous interest from researchers, who previously had to rely on documents in government archives in Washington, London and Moscow, which focused less on individual victims than on the Nazi system.

Among the files on displaced persons here is a sheaf of drawings and illustrations by a Latvian refugee who was conscripted into the German Army in 1944 and ordered to dig trenches in Germany.

Among those watching Bad Arolsen most closely are lawyers for Holocaust victims and their relatives. They cited the archive this year in opposing a settlement with an Italian insurer, Assicurazioni Generali, over unpaid claims on life insurance policies.

As part of the settlement in February, Generali agreed to give heirs of Holocaust victims until next August to uncover evidence of unpaid claims at Bad Arolsen. Officials there said no one had made inquiries.

The complexity of the archive, combined with the flood of inquiries, resulted in a huge backlog of requests - 450,000 at its peak earlier in the decade, causing a wait of several years for a response. The backlog is now down to 75,000, but officials say new requests are answered within eight weeks.

As records are transmitted to Washington and Jerusalem, part of this research burden will shift to the Holocaust Museum and Yad Vashem. Shapiro said he expected a wave of inquiries. Some survivors have already complained that the museum is playing a gatekeeper role.

While it would have been nice to wait for new technology to organize the archive, Shapiro said, the advancing age of Holocaust survivors - many are over 80 - makes it vital to answer requests as soon as possible. "That's a big job, but it's one we're committed to doing," he said.

Copyright © 2007 The International Herald Tribune | www.iht.com


Yet when I asked the archivist at Bad Arolsen for a shred of evidence on extermination by gas here is what he replied:

unfortunately, we cannot reference a single document listing the death of a detainee due to gassing by Zyklon-B. As a rule, the Nazis gave other causes of death for inmates, who perished in the concentration camps.
With kind regards,

U. Jost
Archival Manager



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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 1 year ago (Mon Aug 06, 2007 1:53 pm)

The Arolsen records, in spite of judeo-supremacist spin, show nothing that supports the absurd claims of '6,000,000 & gas chambers', zero.

The only recourse is for the 'holocaust' Industry to lie about the labor camps records.

Search 'Arolsen' at this forum:
http://forum.codoh.com/search.php
for much more which demolishes the claims made these records.

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 1 year ago (Mon Aug 06, 2007 2:18 pm)

You gotta love it:
The Nazis kept meticulous records of their mass extermination during World War II ...

But the absurd claim is that the Germans tried to 'hide the evidence', that it was supposedly a state secret.

We get such ridicuous claims like the Germans tried to hide the alleged gassings by blowing up the impossible 'gas chambers', and then left millions of records for all to see. Right.

A simply embarrassing attempt to support the 'mountain of evidence' canard.

Judeo-supremacists are constantly moving the goal posts and changing the story within an ultimately unmanageable Big Lie.

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Postby simon1003 » 1 decade 1 year ago (Tue Aug 07, 2007 2:25 am)

Mannstein wrote:Among those watching Bad Arolsen most closely are lawyers for Holocaust victims and their relatives.


And if that doesn't make believers question the holocaust industry's motives, nothing will.

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Postby Hektor » 1 decade 1 year ago (Tue Aug 07, 2007 6:05 am)

Hannover wrote:The Arolsen records, in spite of judeo-supremacist spin, show nothing that supports the absurd claims of '6,000,000 & gas chambers', zero.

The only recourse is for the 'holocaust' Industry to lie about the labor camps records....

Exactly - the emperor is naked - these records are actually the best evidence against the Holocaust!

The files cover 51 concentration camps and prisons, and include transportation lists, medical reports, entry documents - like the one signed by Ban - and Gestapo prison records. About 10 million documents in all, they will represent a third of the entire collection at Bad Arolsen.

Prying open the doors of Bad Arolsen has been a lengthy, politically fraught process, and it is not completely finished. Three of the 11 countries that oversee the institution have not yet ratified an amended treaty that would give historians unfettered access to the archive.
Piles of records, claimed to be related to "the Holocaust". Yet not a single document indicating homicidal gassings on an industrial scale in camps. No orders, no reports, no homicidal designs. The Holocaust is the best debunked genocide myth in history.


That is by the way the source:
http://www.iht.com/articles/2007/08/05/ ... rchive.php

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Postby Inquisitive » 1 decade 1 year ago (Thu Aug 09, 2007 8:38 am)

unfortunately, we cannot reference a single document listing the death of a detainee due to gassing by Zyklon-B. As a rule, the Nazis gave other causes of death for inmates, who perished in the concentration camps.
With kind regards,

U. Jost
Archival Manager


Then how many deaths CAN they account for AND what is the "official" cause of these deaths? Surely with that many millions slaughtered, it should be easy to do, shouldn't it?

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Postby Friedrich Paul Berg » 1 decade 1 year ago (Thu Aug 09, 2007 11:39 am)

If Mannstein could publish the entire letter he received from U. Jost the Archival Manager at Bad Arolsen--that would be enormously helpful.

That simple statement undermines most of the value of the entire archive to the exterminationist position. It is valuable to revisionists, however.

Friedrich Paul Berg
Learn everything at www.nazigassings.com
Nazi Gassings Never Happened! Niemand wurde vergast!
The Holocaust story is a hoax because 1) no one was killed by the Nazis in gas chambers, 2) the total number of Jews who died in Nazi captivity is miniscule compared to what is alleged.

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Postby Hannover » 1 decade 1 year ago (Thu Aug 09, 2007 11:39 am)

Inquisitive wrote:Then how many deaths CAN they account for AND what is the "official" cause of these deaths? Surely with that many millions slaughtered, it should be easy to do, shouldn't it?

The death books for Auschwitz, found in a Moscow archive, list a total of 63,000 registered death, both Jews and non-Jews. All periods are not covered. Extrapolating for the missing death book volumes would result in ca. 130,000 dead, Jews and non-Jews.

There is a propaganda newsreel (where you would expect inflated numbers) which claims "300,000" people were killed at Auschwitz (this figure comprises both Jewish and Gentile deaths) and makes no mention of gas chambers.
http://www.vho.org/aaargh/engl/cincinnati.html

Irving screened a brief newsreel in German, which was shown in German movie theatres during the Allied occupation, circa 1948. The subject was the Allied show trial of Nazis charged with crimes at Auschwitz. In the newsreel, the Allied reporter states that "300,000" people were killed at Auschwitz (this figure comprises both Jewish and Gentile deaths) and makes no mention of gas chambers.

This celluloid snippet should make Lipstadt and Co. sweat. (Recall that like Jean-Marie LePen, both Eisenhower and Churchill regarded the alleged homicidal gas chambers to be a "mere detail" of history, since both men make no mention whatever of gassings in their comprehensive, multi-volume war memoirs).

Clearly, the liars have lost control of their lies.

This really is too easy.

- Hannover
If it can't happen as alleged, then it didn't.

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Postby Mannstein » 1 decade 1 year ago (Thu Aug 09, 2007 11:57 am)

This is the e-mail I recieved in its entirety. I left out my last name as it appeared on the reply.

Dear Mr____,
unfortunately, we cannot reference a single document listing the death of a detainee due to gassing by Zyklon-B. As a rule, the Nazis gave other causes of death for inmates, who perished in the concentration camps.
With kind regards,

U. Jost
Archival Manager

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Postby Friedrich Paul Berg » 1 decade 1 year ago (Thu Aug 09, 2007 12:33 pm)

My thanks to Mannstein for the information about the letter. On can certainly understand Mannstein's reluctance to provide an exact copy of the letter which would have included Mannstein's personal information.

If Mannstein could provide the address at Bad Arolsen, then others could write to Bad Arolsen and get the same or other information for themselves. The above letter's text appears now also on my website's homepage.

Friedrich Paul Berg

Learn everything at www.nazigassings.com
The Holocaust story is a hoax because 1) no one was killed by the Nazis in gas chambers, 2) the total number of Jews who died in Nazi captivity is miniscule compared to what is alleged.

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Postby Goethe » 1 decade 1 year ago (Thu Aug 09, 2007 5:14 pm)

I recently saw this blunt opinion of the Arolsen records.
Fact is, if the Arolson files would have contained information proving this so-called Holocaust happened, we would have been able to marvel at same long ago. This nonsense about a committee blocking access is just that, nonsense. And if now, after all those years, “evidence” appears, we should look at it very closely, for we know who is the custodian of those files now, the same people who invented this sordid tale.

Good points.
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Postby Mannstein » 1 decade 1 year ago (Fri Aug 10, 2007 8:58 am)

The e-mail address for the Archivists at Bad Arolsen is:

[email protected]

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Postby Radar » 1 decade 1 year ago (Sat Aug 11, 2007 4:56 pm)

These records are clearly one of the best things that have happened for the cause of Holocaust revisionism in some time. The journalist claims that they will show a large part of the "meticulous records" of the mass murders, i.e. gas chambers, etc. used by the Nazis in their killing of six million Jews during WW II. Finally, we will now see the proof! Well, guess what? Those records will show no such thing! For any objective viewer they will show that there were no such records of mass murder.

What to do to keep the Holocaust stories alive?

(1) Continue to claim that the gassings were done outside of the "meticulous recording keeping system" of the Germans. It just becomes a little more difficult to believe as it would have required the conspiracy of thousands without a leak, document or record to this day. Remarkable, in fact, unique.

(2) Keep revisionists from viewing the records. Again, a bit more difficult than before, after boasting about opening the records to public scrutiny.

(3) Invent "special interpretations" of the words in the records to fit the desired result.

(4) As a last line of defense, don't report any more about it in the mainstream press.

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Postby Laurentz Dahl » 1 decade 1 year ago (Sun Aug 12, 2007 5:41 am)

Radar wrote:(2) Keep revisionists from viewing the records. Again, a bit more difficult than before, after boasting about opening the records to public scrutiny.


But they aren't opened fully yet, right? Only to survivors and some researchers, wasn't it? I suppose I can't go there as myself and take a look at the papers or copies of them?

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Postby astro3 » 1 decade 1 year ago (Sun Aug 12, 2007 6:00 am)

Can Manstein kindly give us the date of Jost's letter to him?

This info from Bad-Arolsen confirms what the US army's consultant pathologist Dr Charles Larsen determined back in 1945. He was sent over to Dachau and other German labour camps, to check out the piles of bodies, and what their causes of death may have been. They had been due, he reported, to both famine and the typhus epidemics. He was put under quite a bit of pressure to state otherwsie, that the deaths had been due to cyanide poisoning – but, he refused to do so. See his biography, Crime Doctor (J.D.McCallum, Canada 1979).

There is also a newspaper quote from him in 1980, ‘There never was a case of poison gas uncovered:’ www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/article.asp?ID=55

There is one other vital bit of info to come out of the Bad-Arolsen archive, and that is the total Jewish mortality in their very comprehensive records. Georges Theil cites this figure as: 291,594 wartime deaths, and from this he derives a total of 'authenticated deaths in all the Hitlerite camps of detainees of Jewish origin' as under 200,000 (1). It would be nice to have this grand total broken down by the various camps.

Would anyone like to confirm this figure?

Germar Rudolf took one further step here, in a way that Theil did not: he surmises that there were a comparable number of such deaths that were non-authenticated, and thereby he reached a total figure of double this: 'A realistic estimate of the actual number of victims, therefore, may be twice as high as the total of victims registered by name in the records at Arolsen. ' (2) Does that conjecture of Rudolf's seem reasonable, or not?

1. Georges Theil, 'Heresy,' 2006, p.73.
2. Germar rudolf, Dissecting the Holocaust, http://vho.org/GB/Books/dth/fndstats.html, Section 7.


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